Doctor Shopping for Pharms

[drug_wench]

yea i go to a govt-funded shrink and i get to see him free
now my records say im a drug abuser hes already said that i cant have any benzos to get me through the hard time im having at the momentwith anxiety
in the past he gave me clonazepam straight off

 

[AlexxRed]

I posted this in some haste and would have replied sooner had I not been away.

Firstly I'm not really interested in "stories" or a how to guide BUT can someone please explain to me what is really wrong with that being discussed here?? Cause its illegal? Please...there is FAR more illegal stuff discussed on this board and consider this:

“Reputable and dedicated doctors who espouse a philosophy of harm minimisation can face disciplinary proceedings if they are accused of prescribing excessive amounts of drugs of addiction. Strangely, prescription shopping is not illegal, and doctor shoppers are not subject to the same legal constraints as those who prescribe for them.”

http://www.ama.com.au/web.nsf/doc/WEEN-5WHU28

So, according the the AMA, Doctor shopping itself its not illegal. And its more the doctors themselves who are likely to get in trouble. Although, somehow I doubt this actually occurs in practice.

I'd like to hear more from the people that say they have been monitored. By who? medicare? I know that there used to be a line that doctor's could call to identify a doctor shopper, but it seems that this has been discontinued or wound down to some extent Does anyone know how this works?

One point that did interest me was made by basix re: xanax and the doctor having to call up and get an authority. Now I thought that this was the case but then can anyone explain how others seem to be able to easily get this drug without this process being carried out??

Lastly, records saying your a drug abuser. Are people saying that this is something that just pops up on file.

 

[drug_wench]

i have records of being a drug abuser because they send off a letter to ur regular doctor/s wen u go through a medical detox

 

[ayjay]

Here's a link to a relevant document:
http://medicalboardvic.org.au/pdf/DrChoo.pdf

It's a record of a disciplinary hearing against a doctor for inappropriate prescription of benzos and morphine. How did I find it? Googled "number benzodiazepine prescriptions" (Aust only). It seems like it should be a confidential document, but who knows? Anyway - it highlights the complexity of decision making by GPs about what to prescribe, and who to. Reference is made to the drugs poisons and controlled substances act 1981 (Vic) - this is easily googled up too, but pretty dense reading.

Basically, it comes down to GP perception of, and attitude towards the patient. If the GP thinks you are "drug seeking", s/he will either treat you like dirt and hustle you out with nothing but a lecture OR s/he will attempt to help you with the mighty power of their expert knowledge and access to massive pharmacopaeia You will still get a lecture.

I think for doctors it is a duty of care issue - prescribing opiates or benzos to people who are opiate dependant has an attendant risk of OD and death. The prescription opiate with the best safety profile to prescribe to opiate dependant people is buprenorphine - but you become a registered addict when you get on the bupe (as with methadone), and their are only a limited number of GPs who prescribe it.

Benzos are so fucking addictive that you could almost argue that they should never be prescribed, except to people who are already dependant on them.

Let's not get started on GPs prescribing antidepressants

 

[kapow]

One point that did interest me was made by basix re: xanax and the doctor having to call up and get an authority. Now I thought that this was the case but then can anyone explain how others seem to be able to easily get this drug without this process being carried out??

I believe, if you haven't been presribed the medication by a Psychiatrist a GP can only prescribe you a certain amount, any higher than this and they need an authority. When they call up they are checking if you have actually been prescribed the medication before, well at least thats been my experience when I've been in the room and they have made that call.

 

[LeoC]

One point that did interest me was made by basix re: xanax and the doctor having to call up and get an authority. Now I thought that this was the case but then can anyone explain how others seem to be able to easily get this drug without this process being carried out??

SWIM's spiel ("SWIM is from 'overseas country X'") circumvents this altogether, but it is not recommended. On another topic, there are certain countries in which benzos can be obtained over the counter from pharmacies, and anyone who wishes to can get a raging addiction to them.

 

[luke_dm5]

To get something like xanax for example, you need an Authority Prescription which the doctor has to ring up some government department in front of you and give your details and the prescription. If for example you got the same prescription 2 weeks ago from another doctor they will inform him and you won't be able to get it and probably have that recorded so it will be difficult to ever get tightly controlled drugs again.

Wrong. You'll need an authority for 2mg Xanax or high quantities. A pack of 50x1mg does not require an authority.

I think there are alot tighter controls here than in the US, which I think is a good thing.

Wrong. The US is far more fearful of drugs than Australia. And even if you were right, how is that a good thing ? Do you know what it's like to be anxious/in pain and refused appropriate meds ?


I would comment on this thread but am worried that it would lead to tighter control of pharms, a sad day for us all.

 

[chugs]

i got valium from a Vet once.....heheh "Vet shopping"

but for $70 bucks it wasn't worth it (and for those who were thinking what a cruel bastard chugs is then note we took the dog out of the stressful situation, made it very happy with many back rubs and ball throwing, whilst we were zomped out on valium).

Everytime i got to my Doctors for a med certificate I normally remind them about my headaches and are promply given a script. Though i don't get them that much anymore.

What i hate about doctors is ironically when i am in agony the bastards won't give me anything and when i'm not in pain (or just asking for the stuff) they do...

I get chronic ear infections and every time my ear drum pops it's like someone shoving hot coals into your head. so when i spend an hr waiting for fucking doctor only to have the wanker refuse it brings tears to my eyes. Yet if i go in all smiling and nodding you idiots prescribe away..

I think a pain measuring device should be invented. Let an impartial machine determine pain and treat it accordingly.

 

[aunty establishment]

I think a pain measuring device should be invented. Let an impartial machine determine pain and treat it accordingly.

*Volunteers*

"Does this hurt?" *WHACK*
"OK, how about now?" *THUMP*
"How's this working out for you?" *SMASH*

"OK, Diazepam 10mg three per day, take per needed".



- Dr. Establishment.

 

[basix]

luke I was talking about precription meds having tighter controls here than in the US.

I say this because of what Ive read on this board, it seems to me so many US users have absolutely no problem getting benzo, adderal, and opiate prescriptions from GPs compared to Aus users. Also from what Ive read in articles, prescription drug abuse is a massive problem in US and one of their biggest drug problems.

I think it's a good thing because the less people dpendant on these meds the better. Benzo's I think are probably the worst things on earth you could take if you have an anxiety problem.

I base this off my own experience and from the countless reports of others I have read, who end up addicted and dependant and the original problem now 10X as severe.

I would comment on this thread but am worried that it would lead to tighter control of pharms, a sad day for us all

I can't tell if you are being sarcastic there or if you are just incredibly paranoid

 

[phase_dancer]

Wrong. The US is far more fearful of drugs than Australia

You might want to reconsider that remark in light of the present review of Australian drug laws.

Steve Bracks:"I think we need to get out of our language this notion of recreational drugs - there's no such thing," he said.

From The Age


While the illicits are primarily the target, there's also likely to be some review on pharm policies & prescribing regulations, particularly with stimulants. Benzos may also be considered, as the PDI report of 2005 stated that of the national sample of ecstasy users in the study, 43% had reported using benzodiazepines in their life, and 27% reported recent use. 15% of those who had used recently, had used in the past month and 6% daily.


I agree absolutely on the statements regarding pain. If your doctor won't help, find one who will. They are out there. But for obvious reasons, doctors don't want to over prescribe benzos. The 60's and 70's were just as well known for benzo addictions as they were for illicit drug use.

If you ever want to read a disturbing account of Benzo (ativan) addiction, then read pages 5-13 of Benzo Junkie: More than a case History by B Faust, 1992, Penguin Melbourne.

 

[zegs]

Just a question for those who doctor shop successfully - what's your age bracket? I guess it's accurate to presume someone under 20 would have a much more scrutinous event if they went seeking pharms?

 

[volume-A]

The answer is simple, all pharmicies should be linked up to a single database.
If your doc shopping you have to go to different pharmacies obviously or they will question you and ring the doc or the authority.

If no matter what pharm you went to they if they had your previous scripts on record, they would be questioning why you have obtained X amount of benzos or whatever

It would work

 

[drug_wench]

i got valium from a Vet once.....heheh "Vet shopping"

LOL they give dogs valium???
i took vet-prescribed ketamine once, it wasnt any big thrill either....i guess they dose animals smaller amounts than the K i had once wen i was in hospital for a riding injury
most of my recreational use and abuse of meds has bn from friend's supplies, school drug lords etc - i did get prescribed tramadol for a few yrs which i abused
i used a friend to score me regular ritalin, bought pure codeine pills from another - im still paying the price of that now......
the dealers at school mostly sold weed, meth, Ecstasy and coke but they got me adderall evry now and then, and once xanax

 

[volume-A]

hey alexxred you wanted to know how to stop it, did you read my post?

 

[nanobrain]

damm, i love p_d.

 

[eggman]

the best opiate you will get is codeine in the form of panadeine forte you might get tramal which is tramadol but that is a bit harder, you wont get anything stronger than that without putting yourself in alot of pain.

well theres an idea for everyone... just wack yourself in the skull with a hammer then go to the doctors.

In all seriousness though, I wouldn't expect doctor shopping to be the most beneficial was to spend your time, I moved recently and found it hard to find surgeries that didn't have closed books. Of about 30 surgeries I could only get an appointment at 4

 

[Christ!]

my doc has gotten me vallium and oxycontin without needing to ring in about it. I think it was a repeat script for x4 on the vallium but just one box of the oxys. Didn't even hurt myself, she gave them to me to get off heroin...pretty nice why to get off it IMO

 

[AlexxRed]

If there was some sort of data base that pharmacies could share that would be the way to stop it. But these days I imagine that would create some sort of issue with privacy.

Interesting to see the way that some GP's treat people who admit to drug use. Some seem supportive? And willing to prescribe and some don't.

Wonder where this might leave some, who really need some sort of intermediate help when a crisis point arrives and then get a lecture and kicked out...I'd say we have seen a few on the 6'oclock news in a police standoff.

And, do you only end up "on file" if you go through some sort of rehab?

At the end of the day, show me a place with all the answers and I'm pretty sure it will look like nothing any of us have ever seen.

 

[volume-A]

Your right Alex If there was some sort of data base that pharmacies could share that would be the way to stop it. But these days I imagine that would create some sort of issue with privacy.

Another avenue in australia is medicare, each time you see a doc you show your medicare card, if you are using it in different surgeries this may raise suspicion, i dont know just a thought.