Do K9 Units alert on Phenethylamines?

[blakmike]

Was wondering if anyone knew if it would be safe to travel interstate with research chemicals in the car. I had a bad experience one time and was 'profiled' by some crazy drug task force due to out of state license plates.

 

[junglejuice]

Well...dogs can smell crystal meth, which is a phenethylamine, so they are no doubt capable of it, but there are so many RC's with different scents that it would be impossible to train the dog to hit on any and every pack. Trained drug dogs cost in the neighborhood of 50K, and they train them for the high-dollar seizures of crystal, heroin, weed and cocaine. These counties aren't after little bags of alphabet soup. They are after the big busts of cash, drugs, guns and cars, of which they get a cut.

:D

 

[killermunchies]

I'm 99.9% sure that a dog won't smell non amphetamine phenethylamines. The dogs don't smell drugs in general. They have to be trained to smell each substance individually. Considering most phenethylamines aren't even illegal and are quite uncommon, I very much doubt that a dog would smell it. However, if you put your RC's in a bag that used to have something illegal in it, that could be a problem. Also, if you smoke weed, vacuum your car so the dog won't hit on some little random nug on the floor. Also, don't keep RCs in gel caps or pre-weighed. Remember, they are legal as long as they aren't for human consumption.

 

[Issac Sinclair]

Idk if you keep them in a baggie it looks bad too.

 

[blakmike]

yah, was just wondering if 4-fa would smell like crystal.

During my aforementioned bad experience, i refused consent, had nothing in the car, and they brought the dog... Was one of those Belgian shepherd things, couldn't have been more than 2 years old, almost a pup. I watched the pig lead the dog around the car closely, I saw no reaction at all, yet the fuckers said it alerted. I don't smoke weed, but there's a chance i guess that a friend might have left a particle or sumthin... I think the fuckers can say the dog 'alerts' whether it smells anything or not.

Anyhoo, I got to continue on my trip, I still feel violated... "The reason I stopped you is you were doing 73 in a 70 zone" wtf....

 

[sekio]

I think it's more likely the dogs alert because their handlers want them to, but whatever.

I think most k9 units would only be trained to detect (meth)amphetamine, methylenedioxy(meth)amphetamine, and their ketones, maybe methylamine too. I don't see interstate 2c-b smuggling as much of a problem and neither does any US poilice dept, I'd wager.

 

[reformer]

Wow... These substances aren't very volatile, if they even are at all at room temp and pressure.

Are the K9s actually detecting the drugs directly, or are they trained to detect volatile organic compounds associated with the synthesis?

I mean, sure dogs have great scent, but damn. I imagine that when they "alert" on MJ, its not off of THC (which is non-volatile), but they are alerting due to the volatile terpenes and esters.

 

[mr.mackey]

Whats this about emphasizing the (meth) in methamphetamine and MDMA, that stands for methyl, and I think both as well as their respective ketones would not smell similar enough to a dog, they don't smell similar to me and my nose is a crude and ineffective tool in comparison to a dogs. Tiny changes in chemical structure can have dramatic effects on smell, for example, the two enantiomers of carvone, one smells like caraway seed, the other like spearmint. Structural similarities are not necessarily indicative of similar physical properties

Also, good point about their volatility

 

[PROZ4C]

Well...dogs can smell crystal meth, which is a phenethylamine, so they are no doubt capable of it, but there are so many RC's with different scents that it would be impossible to train the dog to hit on any and every pack. Trained drug dogs cost in the neighborhood of 50K, and they train them for the high-dollar seizures of crystal, heroin, weed and cocaine. These counties aren't after little bags of alphabet soup. They are after the big busts of cash, drugs, guns and cars, of which they get a cut.

:D

Yuck what rotten individuals you must unfortunately deal with, goodluck bro.

 

[PhyllipThylamine]

If I'm correct a dog can only be trained to smell out one chemical. So for intance, a dog trained to smell a certain explosive won't be able to detect cocaine, & vice versa.

Training these animals takes ages & costs thousands, & for that reason pigs train dogs to seek explosives, cocaine, marijuana, methamphetamine etc. They wouldnt waste theire time with RC's or anything not hugely popular &/or a danger to the public health.

 

[sekio]

There was a huge argument on here which resulted in some people dredging up an abberant fact - that apparently drug dogs can detect LSD without any LSD actually being there (i.e. Aldrich sells a mystery product for training LSD detection dogs that isn't controlled). I got kinda pissed at some people suggesting that a dogs' nose could be more sensitive than a multi-thousand-dollar GC/EI-MS and detect stuff like triply vaccum sealed and soapy-water-washed LSD wrapped in carob grounds.

For those not familiar with the notation, when i say (meth)amphetmaine i mean either methamphetamine or amphetamine. It's faster to write it that way.

I would expect trace amounts of the ketones (MDP2P etc etc) from reductive amination, or even degradation, to be the main volatile scent marker dogs are trained with. Even then, the common methamphetamine and amphetamine synthesis impurities etc are nothing like 2C-E's, for example.

 

[Solipsis]

So then it's not unthinkable they would blow the whistle on methylone, or mephedrone? If only for the cat piss smell they can have :D