Wubb
Bluelighter
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DNM speed qlty
- Thread starter Gaffy
- Start date
Damn... I cannot understand why it’s so cut to hell, there’s a limit I mean come on..
My guess is the precursors for mass production are too hard to get these days and unlike MDMA the demand isn’t as high to motivate chemists to seek out other ways.
Meth is doing just fine over here and finding d-amphetamine pills is easy as finding your nearest frat boy college kid.
I would really like to one day try “traditional” (lol) old school racemic amp sulphate. My theory is that during the late 80’s/early 90’s the amphetamine was produced with the same synthesis route used for MDMA at the time which I believe may have left impurities which gave the whizz something it hasn’t had since.
-GC
My guess is the precursors for mass production are too hard to get these days and unlike MDMA the demand isn’t as high to motivate chemists to seek out other ways.
Meth is doing just fine over here and finding d-amphetamine pills is easy as finding your nearest frat boy college kid.
I would really like to one day try “traditional” (lol) old school racemic amp sulphate. My theory is that during the late 80’s/early 90’s the amphetamine was produced with the same synthesis route used for MDMA at the time which I believe may have left impurities which gave the whizz something it hasn’t had since.
-GC
Wilson Wilson
Bluelighter
Making amphetamine is super easy but there's not enough market for it and the market that does exist is willing to buy a cut to shit product hence the issues we see today.
Wubb
Bluelighter
if it costs £4 a gram, guess what your not buying speed, just a load of bash, Like Wilson said its super easy to make but that doesn't mean your going to find any decent for under £10 a g ime
Early this year I brought 10g from a Dutch supplier for about £75.00 and it was the absolute dogs bollocks, as my old dear always said ''if you buy cheap, you buy twice''
Punk may be dead but theres still lots of base around.
Travellers usually have the best stuff I find, but that's another matter
Early this year I brought 10g from a Dutch supplier for about £75.00 and it was the absolute dogs bollocks, as my old dear always said ''if you buy cheap, you buy twice''
Punk may be dead but theres still lots of base around.
Travellers usually have the best stuff I find, but that's another matter
It’s super easy but my guess is to make it economically feasible large scale these days is difficult. As we’ve seen with MDMA, even with other known routes it can take time and a lot of demand for chemists to change their ways. PMK glycidate was well known since at least the early 90’s but took quite a few years to become the next big precursor once safrole took a dump.
Benzaldehyde and p2p can’t be as easily obtained by the 55g drum like the old days.
-GC
Benzaldehyde and p2p can’t be as easily obtained by the 55g drum like the old days.
-GC
Yeah all I see now is BMK (benzylmethylketone= p2p) that actually is MDBMK glycidate.
I Wonder why they don't switch to making cathinone which is more enjoyable; the precursors are dirt cheap and very easy to find (perfume industry for propiophenone derivatives) and it's scaleable à la tour eiffel style, just PPPhenone, bromine and (methyl) ammonia to get some very good speed(!)
As to why p2p is getting rarer it's because it used to be made from ephedra (Don't ask me how or why) but the Chinese mafia now makes massive amounts of meth with it directly in the mountains and exports it to the philippines, India and god knows where as it is more profitable than making p2p.
I Wonder why they don't switch to making cathinone which is more enjoyable; the precursors are dirt cheap and very easy to find (perfume industry for propiophenone derivatives) and it's scaleable à la tour eiffel style, just PPPhenone, bromine and (methyl) ammonia to get some very good speed(!)
As to why p2p is getting rarer it's because it used to be made from ephedra (Don't ask me how or why) but the Chinese mafia now makes massive amounts of meth with it directly in the mountains and exports it to the philippines, India and god knows where as it is more profitable than making p2p.
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Tranced
Bluelight Crew
A strange thing I've noticed is that whatever caffeine they cut speed with is somehow ridiculously more potent and psychoactive than a coffee. I drink a lot of coffee and I make it very strong, to the point it doesn't even really work any more. Last year me and my friend bought some speed and got drunk, and it seemed ridiculously strong. We snorted our way through a gram and ended up being up right through the next day unable to sleep and stimmed/wired to fuck. I got it lab tested at wedinos and it was 100% pure caffeine powder.
The weird thing is that I took a sample dose of 20mg and it felt like speed, and I was gurning/rushing about doing loads of stuff I'd been putting off etc. Apparently a cup of coffee is 70–140 mg. I've tried replicating this experience with huge amounts of coffee and even excess amounts of pro plus and it just 100% isn't the same. I'm sure I've read that there are different forms of caffeine, perhaps different isomers or whatever, and they are more active. My point being, I got fooled and I'm a caffeine addict. According to wedinos 95%+ of UK speed is at the very least contaminated with caffeine, and for some reason it is noticeably more active than what we usually think of as caffeine.
Seriously, anybody with base: send some off to wedinos, I'm interested to see. I've just sent off some 4f-methylphenidate and I'm interested to see if there's a cut. Caffeine is demonstrably a notoriously common cut with stims... and it works. Aside from synergy, like I say it seems noticably more active in its own right than you expect it to be.
F.U.B.A.R.
Bluelight Crew
I've certainly found that pro plus is much more drug like than the equivalent dose of caffeine in coffee. Perhaps their are other substances in coffee that temper caffeine's stimulant effects? Plus you were snorting it so that must hit harder. Did you enjoy it though? I can drink as much coffee as I like and not get wired, but boshing pro plus ends up feeling quite uncomfortable for me.
Wilson Wilson
Bluelighter
Pro Plus is only 50mg caffeine, you sure it wasn't just placebo mate? Like you were taking a pill so in your mind you expected it to be stronger.
F.U.B.A.R.
Bluelight Crew
I'm talking about taking 6 - 8 at a time mate. And when I say 'more drug like' I just mean not as natural feeling as the stimulation from coffee - though I can't say I've had anything like the same experience from pro plus as Tranced did on his caffeine powder.
My go to off the shelf boost these days is a coffee called 'rocket fuel' which is high in caffeine and guarana.
PERCOL Rocket Fuel Strong Instant Coffee High Caffeine Content from Natural Source Guarana – Rich, Intense Blend 100g 6 Pk: Amazon.co.uk: Grocery
Free delivery and returns on all eligible orders. Shop PERCOL Rocket Fuel Strong Instant Coffee High Caffeine Content from Natural Source Guarana – Rich, Intense Blend 100g 6 Pk.
www.amazon.co.uk
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So caffeine batches can vary but MDMA can’t?
I definitely believe you and as someone who’s done some heavy experimentation with a wide variety of caffeine products, I believe your theory has potential.
Tranced have you done 99.9% pure caffeine before? I have and indeed it was very different from even like no doz tablets. The only thing is that it wasn’t long lasting, but highly euphoric which lasts for an hour or two. The pure caffeine I’ve tried was potent, highly euphoric but shorter acting (taken orally) by a long shot. But if batches vary I could see some longer acting stuff out there.
With that said, alcohol can cause some major placebo effect. The only time I’ve ever misjudged the quality of a batch of MDMA, I was drunk and swear it felt more potent and better than it really did upon sober.
-GC
Wilson Wilson
Bluelighter
Ah I get you mate. You'd be better off getting the generic caffeine pills off Amazon though. Higher dose and you get like 100 in one pack. Works out far far cheaper than Pro Plus.
As for the difference, for me it is weird, I used to bosh caffeine in any form. Monster, Pro Plus, coffee, whatever. I didn't notice much distinct difference myself it all got me wired and hyper.
But that was years ago when I was 18. I think I was self-medicating my ADHD which I didn't get meds for until my early 20's. Nowadays if I have even one can of Monster I basically have a panic attack. Which is a shame because I enjoy the taste of Monster. If they did a decaff one I'd buy it just for the taste.
Ironically though proper stims don't cause the same problems for me at all. I can take amphetamine, coke, mephedrone, MDMA and they only give me mild anxiety on the comedown sometimes but that's it unless my dose is too high. But I know how to handle myself on stims so it's basically never a problem. But with caffeine just one can of an energy drink is absolutely gonna give me bad anxiety unless I take benzos. But then what's the point? So I just avoid caffeine now.
LoginNotSecure
Bluelighter
Caffeine death sparks alert by Nottinghamshire coroner
A coroner warns of the dangers of taking high doses of caffeine following the death of Nottinghamshire man.
www.bbc.co.uk
Be careful boshing caffeine, it can and does kill!
Wilson Wilson
Bluelighter
If it were any other drug they'd be calling to make it illegal. I remember pre-PSA you'd get reports of one single death from some plonker boshing a gram of an RC and the tabloids would go mad calling for it to be banned.
ageingpartyfiend
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Mar 5, 2011
- Messages
- 7,396
I only ever did pro-plus once but it was as a late teenager and we'd gone to see our friends have their day in court...
...I was so wired i got taken to the cells underneath the court for a few hours for heckling the magistrates for being harsh on an 80 year old shoplifter...didn't get to see my mates sentenced.
Caffeine - just say no!
...I was so wired i got taken to the cells underneath the court for a few hours for heckling the magistrates for being harsh on an 80 year old shoplifter...didn't get to see my mates sentenced.
Caffeine - just say no!
Tranced
Bluelight Crew
My guess is that caffeine content is probably vastly lower than generally advertised, especially after processing/maybe pouring hot water/boiling water on it. Not to mention plants being mass produced for bean content rather than quality.
Yes, this is what I mean. I've got no idea if it was 99.9% pure but wedinos tested it as caffeine and no other active adulterants (check a few posts back), and 20mg had me a bit fucked. Half a gram or so had me up and wired until the next night. What you said about no doz seems to correlate with what I said earlier - we get pro plus in the UK (50mg caffeine per tablet) and after getting the "amphetamine" (pure caffeine powder) tested, I tried necking multiple pro plus to catch a buzz and it just wasn't the same. That said I did neck a tonne of pro plus in school and ended up feeling jittery and weird for a few hours. The caffine powder was very euphoric and lasted 24+ hours. We did snort most of it though, which again would account for differences.
So caffeine batches can vary but MDMA can’t?
Hey man, I've openly said in the MDMA thread (and right around bluelight) that I've seen significant differences with the different isomers of ketamine, and I've got no doubt this would be a thing with MDMA.
All I'm saying is that for me personally, MDMA is the same as it's always been, and I'm seeing a lot of conflicting ideas in that thread for what MDMA 'should' be. Some people think it should have you up and energised and chatty, some people think it should have you lying floored in a mess. Then there are some of the more ridiculous anecdotal reports about people not hugging in clubs any more (?) or new MDMA not dilating pupils (?!). Then you get people disagreeing on which generation it went shit, and to me a lot of people just sound jaded and like they've lost the old magic, or have high expectations of what it was like for them when they took pills when they were 18 and experiencing life with this new beautiful outlook.
But hey, as I've said before, I'm more than open to it, I just haven't noticed it personally. My experiences tend to be dictated by environment and dose more than anything. There is also genuinely every chance that by chance I've always had the 'good stuff', because for the past fifteen years or so I've always had vaguely the same looking brown, or white with hints of brown (half washed?), or white (fully washed?) crystals. Never had any of the black, tar, red, pink, etc etc stuff.
People like you are doing good work in there though, so I don't tar everybody with the same brush. I'm still waiting on that PM summary of evidence that you said you'd send me!
I guess I've lost my EADD
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Wilson Wilson
Bluelighter
I honestly think this is more about set and setting than anything else. Yes I know that term is usually applied to psychedelics which MDMA is not, but the subjective experience of any drug is influenced by those factors. I've been monged out and I've been running about energetic from different seshes on the same batch of MDMA.
What absolutely has changed with MDMA recently is purity and dosage. In the UK at least (and presumably the rest of Europe too, as they get the same product from NL) pills are more highly dosed than ever before (we're frequently seeing 250-300mg pills) and the crystal and powder is of very high purity. This is much different from the previous generation of users who had 100-150mg pills and powder/crystal was a rare thing in the first place.
Tranced
Bluelight Crew
Fucking quality! I went through a stage of taking it in sixth form along with energy drinks & guarana boost bars (lol), I guess in the hopes that it would counteract my daily bucket smoking and miraculously make me actually want to finish my course work. One day I necked a packet with my mate and we just sat there in sixth form wired kind of laughing at how jittery it was but wishing it would wear the fuck off.
Most definitely, set and setting is huge with all drugs. I've noticed that I only really like ketamine on sunny days, because it's the difference between a sunny, HD vibrant ketamine world or the gloomy and deppressigly thought invoking vibe of overcast clouds. I think there's also a bit of "grass is always greener" or "appeal to tradition fallacy" type of stuff going on. To be honest, I think there are literally loads of factors - and contaminants/precursors/isomers may even play a roll. Again, I just haven't seen it myself.
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