Heroin different types of heroin info

[sekio]

Fentanyl is 1/10 the price of heroin, 50x as potent, and also provides a strength of effect that you can't match with plain heroin. That's why.

 

[G_Chem]

I honestly believe it’s a conspiracy level operation resulting in a major decrease in heroin, while simultaneously a major increase in cocaine and meth use/availability/quality. All corresponding perfectly with the Trump administration getting into office...

I agree though, back in my heroin using days I’d be fucking lit if I got product with caffeine or any stimulant in it. Opiates are stimulating enough to me in all the right ways.

It sucks too because certain parts of the US have fallen so so hard. I’d argue some of the most potent heroin ever to be had came from certain Midwest and Northeast cities US early 2000’s. From late 2000’s onward it dropped in quality to what it is today.

-GC

 

[JessFR]

Fentanyl is 1/10 the price of heroin, 50x as potent, and also provides a strength of effect that you can't match with plain heroin. That's why.

How can it provide better effect if everyone says it sucks?

Admittedly I'm going off second hand reports here. As I said, up till at least 2018 when I quit heroin, Australia was largely free of fentanyl, so I have no experience with what it feels like.

But going on what everyone else seems to say, it's crap.

So the only benefit then is the cost. That it's cheaper for them. But that doesn't explain why the market doesn't self correct.

If you have regular heroin to sell, presumably you'd easily corner the market even if it cost more.

What am I missing here?

 

[tracedwards313]

It's crazy how fast it happend too! It just a few years it went from fentanyl being used as a cut to make the dope hit harder to it just being fentanyl rocked up and people still calling it heroin.

People even liked it at first because it was so strong but when thats all it is, it fucking sucks and its dangerous as hell.

 

[tracedwards313]

How can it provide better effect if everyone says it sucks?

Admittedly I'm going off second hand reports here. As I said, up till at least 2018 when I quit heroin, Australia was largely free of fentanyl, so I have no experience with what it feels like.

But going on what everyone else seems to say, it's crap.

So the only benefit then is the cost. That it's cheaper for them. But that doesn't explain why the market doesn't self correct.

If you have regular heroin to sell, presumably you'd easily corner the market even if it cost more.

What am I missing here?

Just because it stronger doesnt make it a better high. People don't understand this. It's not the same drug at all, it just the same class of drug. Heroin is a much better high than fentanyl could ever be, even though fentanyl is way stronger.

 

[JessFR]

From what people have told me, fentanyl is very sedating, but has little euphoria.

That about right?

Just because it stronger doesnt make it a better high. People don't understand this. It's not the same drug at all, it just the same class of drug. Heroin is a much better high than fentanyl could ever be, even though fentanyl is way stronger.

Doesn't really answer my question though.

That being, if fentanyl sucks so much and only has cost going for it. Why wouldn't the market self correct with one of the suppliers seeking to take advantage of the unserved customers?

If I were in a position of having 4 dealers, 3 selling fentanyl, 1 selling heroin. Even if it were more expensive and the dealer were one of those assholes who always kept you waiting for hours. If fentanyls as shit as people say I'd still go to that guy every time.

 

[sekio]

That being, if fentanyl sucks so much and only has cost going for it. Why wouldn't the market self correct with one of the suppliers seeking to take advantage of the unserved customers?

The introduction of fentanyl to the opioid supply basically started a "potency arms race" - initially it was added in small amounts to potentiate the onset of opioid effects when smoked/IV'd, then competition lead to increasing amounts of fentanyl being present. Gradually, users who formerly used stright heroin begin to have their tolerance elevated as they use more and more fentanyl-cut dope. Eventually fentadope became the "prime product" because the tolerance of the average user was so high (and they expected the fentanyl kick). Doesn't help that fentanyl cut dope has a much shorter effect (so you sell more doses, more often) and a cheaper wholesale cost (so you make more money selling it).

Also, fentanyl will have much more competition between manufacturers. Opium requires opium poppies - lots of them - and the labour to grow and collect the opium. In comparison, a single person could be capable of producing upwards of a kilogram of fentanyl per week in a small lab (if they were trained and equipped.) The only limitation is reagents, which have industrial uses and can be diverted (unlike opium poppy).

That's my idea, anyway.

 

[G_Chem]

Yea fentanyl sucks nuts. It was what we did as kids cuz it majorly fucks you up but isn’t really euphoric. Once I got passed the “do anything the fucks me up” stage of life it was garbage.

Imagine all the nod with none of the euphoria or motivation that comes with heroin.

-GC

 

[sekio]

A lot of people aren't aware that commercial opium poppy is grown in Malta, the UK, and Tasmania*, among other places. Opioids are closer to home than you'd think.
(* in Tasmania there are reports of wallabies getting into the poppy fields, having a light lunch of opium poppy, and then proceeding to get so stoned they run in circles for hours until they drop. The end result is mystery crop circles of destroyed P. somniferum with a very dopey wallaby snoozing in the middle.
In India/Pakistan, there are parrots that are dependent on opium (from snacking on poppy heads frequently). which apparently act like, well, junkie parrots. They hassle the farmers and eat the crop!)

wonder about Methadone? Here it is 5mg/ml. Would a high dose cover the receptors.

Here we have the disgusting 10mg/mL "Cherry" Methadose^tm concentrate. Thankfully, it seems to work for fentanyl addicts, although usually they need doses between 100mg and 200mg/day. The clinics are free to those with low income though.

it is NOT in our H. YET

It's only a matter of time, unfortunately.[/small]

 

[JessFR]

Of course opium poppies are required for production. History can tell us that the situation changed after the US and some allies set up house in Afghanistan all those years ago. Fields were destroyed and sprayed with something like agent orange. Nevertheless production continues there and also in Pakistan, India - then the golden triangle commencing in Burma and through SE Asia.
Look at Iran - no shortage there. The highest number of addicts per capita of any country in the world for herion and opium. Interestingly they are progressive and have free Methadone clinics and as a side note free sex changes also..... India has no drought nor does SE Asia. European smack is derived from Afghanistan and India. Traditional trade routes have been interrupted with foreign presence in Persian Gulf. Thus the product is shipped to Europe via Iran & Turkey primarily. SE Asian product finds it way to of course SE Asia and into China. That product is what is available in Australia. I have never seen brown so called "Afghan" in Aus, as has been pointed out by a poster in another H thread.
I was always of the view that US/Canada supply was via China/HK. I have seen this in some reports and maps. However I don't fully understand why powder was ECH and tar WCH, presuming the product arrived on WC. I know Canada WC had powder. That I do not get. It was sad reading the report of Canada above. Bupe would not cover a dependence such as has been described. I wonder about Methadone? Here it is 5mg/ml. Would a high dose cover the receptors. One theory I have read in medical literature is that Fentanyl binds very tightly to the mu receptors and remains so for up to 4 days, though loss of clinical effect is 6 hours. That may explain the mcg dosage in a patch as opposed to mgs IV.....
Of course fentanyl is available here, some dealers have patches, lollipop things and god knows what from DN markets, however it is NOT in our H. YET........ Let us not go down that destructive path

Yeah. It's weird. I don't even do heroin anymore. Ideally I should never do it again.

But... I like knowing it's there. So I hate the idea of it ending up polluted with fentanyl.

Apart from it fucking over other addicts, I like to know that it's always there to go back to for some reason. I dunno why. Junkie psychology probably.

Here we have the disgusting 10mg/mL "Cherry" Methadose^tm concentrate. Thankfully, it seems to work for fentanyl addicts, although usually they need doses between 100mg and 200mg/day. The clinics are free to those with low income though.

I wish they wouldn't put flavors or sweeteners in methadone. We have 2 brands here, one has glycerine or something in it and tastes horrible. The other just tastes bitter and is IMO much less horrible.

It's only a matter of time, unfortunately.

Not saying you're wrong, but is there anything in particularly you're basing that on?

 

[sekio]

Not saying you're wrong, but is there anything in particularly you're basing that on?

Economics, my friend. (That said, Aus customs and excise is legendary for its drug shipment seizure rate, I bet that plays a factor...)

 

[G_Chem]

Yeah. It's weird. I don't even do heroin anymore. Ideally I should never do it again.

But... I like knowing it's there. So I hate the idea of it ending up polluted with fentanyl.

Apart from it fucking over other addicts, I like to know that it's always there to go back to for some reason. I dunno why. Junkie psychology probably.



I wish they wouldn't put flavors or sweeteners in methadone. We have 2 brands here, one has glycerine or something in it and tastes horrible. The other just tastes bitter and is IMO much less horrible.



Not saying you're wrong, but is there anything in particularly you're basing that on?

I know what you mean, I still have the same pack of 10 fresh needles that I hung onto all those years back... When I got clean it was comforting to know if I ever wanted to go back I could.

No one could ever understand but I needed that and still do.

-GC