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  • Trip Reports Moderator: Cheshire_Kat

(Desoxypipradrol/10 mgs) First experience: Which way is Poland?!

yaesutom said:
Yeah this stuff wasn't "too bad" WHILE on benzo's daily :) I could take a high enough dose to get nicely spun and manic and not go crazy when it wore off (cause of the benzos).

But.. the few times i tried it after coming off all other drugs/meds, i'd kinda want to dose high enough to get good and wired, but that effect would only last like 5 hours, followed by minimal stimulation that just had me thinking "redose and definitely go crazy psychotic tomorrow? or don't and be sane just awake and bored" .

It'd be great if it just didn't last anywhere near as long definitely :)
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I would've been fine if benzos had taken the edge off. Second time round I had a plentiful supply of poppy pods but even so, it took a colossal quantity to produce a tea that put me to sleep. I gave up on the valium after 140mg - which had zero effect.
 
SpellmanT7 said:
I was awake for 48 hours and experienced bona-fide Kill myself? Wouldn't be the end of the world type neurological feelings
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i can relate to this entirely. by the 12hr mark i was filled with such overwhelming aggression. i've beat my alarm clock against the wall at 4am knowing that i'll have to leave for work in less than an hour with zero sleep but nothing compares. i could have very well torn my skin off. surrendering resolved the issue.
 
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HAHA, I finally slept 12 hours last night, but haven't otherwise been sleeping but brief naps since monday. I had sort of interesting midsummer festival (summer solstice) this year; unforgettable and truely unlike any other. I was up with the sun and saw the longest days of the year in the greatest measure (with manic pleasure).

Desoxy's indefinitely long duration, of course, makes it unpractical for the most purposes. Sleep deprivation is really difficult to avoid. Only if dosed precisely and enough early in the morning, then it will possibly allow sleeping in the following night. I don't care, if sleep is occasionally skipped; in fact, all stimulants causes to me an urge to not sleep at all (sleeping feels like giving in, it appears as loss useful time). But it is matter of fact that sleepness causes crazyness, and longer the period, deeper the state! And, because of that reason, I will avoid Desoxy and especially binges on it, though in some special dutyfree periods, I may return to that physically easy craziness. It is absolutely sure that Desoxy would not become popular. Most of people will surely feel that even one night without sleep is scary as hell.

I am still loving that fact that I don't feel physically bad at all, although I have binged like fool on desoxy. With almost any other stimulant that same duration of continuous stimulation would have caused crash of horrible magnitude!
 
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what an unusual substance! it feels very similar to methylphenidate (and in my book that a big compliment) but with an added twist, it sort of reminds me of what it felt like when i would combine concerta with hydergeine and piracetam, the same yet more saturating, more euphoric (and less useful for practical work). i took 1mg this morning, followed with 1mg two hours later, and then one final mg an hour later. it seemed as if then all of the doses hit me at once and it was too strong, i took a cold shower and within a couple of hours was down from the effects. no endless stimulation but the dose was low. For me it was a much more interesting stimulant than MDPV.

EDIT: although i was sure that the stimulation had ended, (i was able to take a successful nap in the late afternoon) i was not able to actually sleep until after 8 in the morning, im not working with this again until i have time to allow my sleep schedule to be torn to pieces. it is even more subtle and insidious a sleep ruiner than selegiline or modafinil.
 
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Does anybody know the shelf life of desoxy hcl? I've had a rather large amount (think grams) for around 6 months now and I'm begining to wander if its losing potency or is it just some tolerance of sorts.
At the begining few sub 5mg bumps would mean I have no chance to sleep for 8hours +, yet now I can effortlesly fall asleep only an hour after consuming 10+ mg. It doesnt seem like the rush and level of stimulation have lost anything, but duration definitely has.
Also, are anybody else's nostrills taking some major beating from snorting desoxy? Me and my girl have stopped taking it solelly because few 5mg bumps in a night would leave our nostril in a crusty sore state for up to 2 - 3 days after.
 
^ It's tolerance as it has no functional groups that'll degrade from just sitting on a shelf in a cool, dark place. What you describe is almost identical to when I started to experience tolerance.

If your shnozzle is suffering, try dissolving it and administering rectally; it's just as efficient and actually has a quicker onset (not much slower than IM admin).Really though, the best thing would be to give it a rest for a couple of weeks (at least) and let your tolerance reset to pre-exposure levels
 
I took 5mg orally at 2pm and 4pm respectively, then smoked another 5mg.
I didn't sleep (I expected that).
I need to be up and alert today, so took another 5mg at 9am, will I be able to sleep by about 10-12pm or so?
How bad is a crash after two days on desoxypipradrol.
It made me very stimmed yesterday, talkative and hyper, I do a weird half gurn with my tongue too.
Would benzo's or gbl be better for sleep? After a few xanax fairy scares, I am trying to not go near any benzo's for a while.
I do really like it, it carries a nice mild stimulation and mood boost at first, then some really pleasant chatty euhporia and slight tingles, combines nicely with weed.
It does tend to tense my muscles and twist my stomach up a bit. It also creates a weird surreal "push the big read button out of curiousity" instinct, that I get on other stims.
Would melatonin help out with it at all?

What would be the long term consequences of a very small daily dose?

i.e. 1-2mg in the morning?
 
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nobody knows what the long-term consequences of daily dosing are. I imagine you could go find research on other NE reuptake inhibitors (this is what desoxypip is primarily, right?) and compare notes, so to speak. I wouldn't recommend it though its still largely an unresearched chemical.

From what I gather unless you have benzos you probably won't get to sleep tonight unless you're used to falling asleep on the tail end of stims :\

good luck I bet melatonin will help a little at least maybe get you to go into a 'trance' half sleep state maybe.

but prove me wrong! fall asleep mate!
 
Melatonin was rather helpful, nice anti oxidant for the subsequent dopamine oxidation.

A few questions regarding desoxypipradrol.

Does it deplete dopamine as part of it's mechanism? I am guessing DARI's must either down regulate receptors or reduce dopamine function in some way?

Could L Dopa be taken alongside it to boost dopamine levels and hopefully the desoxy?

Are there any other non active/rapidly metabolised molecules able to "displace" desoxypipradrol?

A fairly irresponsible few days left me with some rather nasty side effects.

My intercostal muscles ached a bit, my stomach seemed to "churn" after doses. I experienced fairly hefty paranoia (including staring at a door for around an hour), my vision swam in your general stimulant way accompanied by various objects morphing into creatures and so forth.

It took around 2.5 days for the paranoia and visuals to develop, redosing at this point was unpleasant and created an edgy stimulation.

The OCD comments are true, this manifested itself in a range of bizarre and amusing ways. I found that with this and the paranoia it seemed detached, I was thinking clearly, and didn't start being affected by the paranoia in anyway.

For studying purposes I find this to be a superior more benign version of Modafinil.

The ability of this chemical to affect sound is impressive, higher doses warped dogs, birds etc into pleading children, hearing footsteps and whispering voices outside my bedroom door for 2 hours was really annoying though.
 
^ what I gathered is that its mainly a nor-epinephrine RI. I still wouldn't combine it with L-Dopa. That stuff is dangerous on its own (it can horribly disrupt your mental processes), so combining it with an unresearched chemical is a very bad idea.

A reuptake inhibitor will (generally if not always?) downregulate the receptors of the neurotransmitter it blocks. This is because there is elevated dopamine (for instance) in the synaptic cleft and the receptors will downregulate as a result to stabilize to 'normal' levels.

This is why daily use is probably a bad idea as once you go off it you will have effects that are reversed of what the drug does (ie lack of energy, no motivation, asocial, etc).
 
I think it's affinities across NE and DA are the same, it certainly has a very dopaminergenic edge.

L Dopa can disrupt mental processes? Is that a personally experienced thing? I would love a link to the source if you have one. It has been combined with other DARI's and NDI's with a potentiating effect before (cocaine was the DARI I think).

I wonder how bad the DA downregulation will be, I would also be rather worried of NE receptor changes, I imagine that causes the vast drop in blood pressure, and could have some really nasty effects given a long enough use.

The NRI mechanism is also responsible for light headedness, dry mouth, etc.

It appears that NRI's can increase dopamine output through a shared recycling system, (it's on the wikipedia NRI page), this would tie straight back into the desoxy output and may be responsible for the gradual slow developing euphoria, it also increases the risk of hypertension.

Another NDRI, Bupropion has been reported to cause mania, hallucinations and paranoia.

I wonder why Desoxypipradrol causes so many changes to the sounds you hear.

There is no specific antidote for bupropion; treatment is supportive, and focuses on maintaining airway patency and controlling seizures with high dose intravenous benzodiazepines or barbiturates if seizures are refractory to benzodiazepines.[72] Gastric decontamination may be of little benefit given the risk of seizures and aspiration[72] but activated charcoal is recommended,[71] additionally whole bowel irrigation should be undertaken in those ingesting sustained release formulations.[72] Toxic effects may be delayed in onset, with seizures developing as late as 32 hours,[72] subsequently patients should undergo electroencephalographic monitoring for 48 hours.[54]
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I am imagining that the same applies to desoxypipradrol.

Seizures are mentioned as a major bupropion risk, however I have not read anything about desoxypipradrol induced seizure.

Could desoxypipradrol be a DA/NE releaser?

It's cousin methylphenidate seems to be fairly well tolerated, although quitting suddenly after high use carries the following risk: -
Chronically abusive use can lead to marked tolerance and psychic dependence with varying degrees of abnormal behavior. Frank psychotic episodes can occur, especially with parenteral abuse. Careful supervision is required during drug withdrawal, since severe depression as well as the effects of chronic overactivity can be unmasked. Long-term follow-up may be required because of the patient's basic personality disturbances.
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I'm sorry for the random off topic stuff, it has probably been already covered, this kinda makes me wish I could skip back a few years to when I actually cared about myself and my health.
 
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^ hey I'll look for something more substantive than just what I've 'heard' before, but L-Dopa is a very potent donator precursor for dopamine (its the step before dopamine and not the rate limiting step, ie the change from L-Dopa to dopamine in the brain is fast).

L-dopa is used to treat parkinsons where patients suffer from degradation of brain areas dense with dopamine receptors. L-dopa elevates dopamine in their brain and helps slow the decline they would have suffered otherwise (ideally if the dose is right they can 'normalize' for some time at least).

L-Dopa is a very tricky drug to dose. Patients are monitored closely on the drug as too much L-Dopa can result in overwhelming levels of dopamine in the brain which can result in the polar opposite problem to parkinsons (ie schizophrenia). Elevated levels of dopamine are linked (theoretically) as a 'neurotransmitter correlate' to schizophrenia-induced hallucinations/voices, etc.

Again, warning: it is very strong stuff. If you take too much you most likely will become psychotic for a period of time. It is easy enough to OD a parkinsons patient with it, let alone somebody that has relatively normal DA levels.

What makes you even think if you take L-Dopa it will (necessarily) go to the areas that desoxypip is acting on? (Maybe somebody more knowledgeable could speak to this).

A better option would be to supplement with tyrosine (an amino acid further up the dopamine biosynthetic pathway) on days that the desoxypipradol is completely out of your system. Doing otherwise may result in hypertensive crisis (much like combining dopamine donators with methamphetamine).

You also want to seriously think about the addiction potential of desoxypipradol. Stimulants have a hard bite and the 'withdrawl'/recovery from abusing them is not a pleasant process.
 
Thanks :), you're a star.

I was wondering about using L Dopa over the come down in a staggered fashion to minimise any substantial drop in synaptic levels, any idea how direct the promotion of vesicle release is with a precursor like L Dopa. I don't like tyrosine, can't think off the top of my head why though.

Is dosing really that large of an issue? I know I sound incredibly uninformed, but I use to take it regularly as a study aid and general anti depressant, I took small amounts of pure powder sublingually as and when I needed them, I never noticed any issues at all apart from a really uncharacteristic adrenaline cascade if something angered me, that was the reason I stopped using it.

The schitzophrenic link is interesting, as I understand it, Schitzophrenia is a fairly blanket condition, and changes in neurological structure occur across a few neurotransmitter systems. The psychotic state evident after chronic methamphetamine usage is linked to a lack of dopamine in other areas of the brain, causing serotonin secretion. I'll dig up a link as that was explained horribly.

I'm not sure on the area that L Dopa would act in, I naively assumed it would act in the same way as L Dopa in the body does (after it is made in the adrenal glands).

I am fairly sure it would boost my NE and DA levels, in essence reducing or eliminating any redose desire, there are far too many if's and but's surrounding this topic though.

My brain is a bit scattered at the moment, but I think that a constant firing of DA receptors essentially limits/stops further release until the synaptic DA is removed, L Dopa and a DARI alongside this mechanism would presumably boost then maintain DA levels, as opposed to a hypertensive cascade, still not worth it.

As for addiction, maybe, the half life and the long come up reduce the risk of reinforcement greatly, the psychological need to stay awake for productivity reasons is my main fear. I highly doubt I will get addicted, I am fairly cautious about addiction generally, and I am lucky that I have a lot of friends and family that are always on the look out for my substance use.

Once again your concern is appreciated. Cheers.
 
It's a reuptake inhibitor (no release) of primarily dopamine with a bit of activity on noradrenaline, so no it doesn't cause depletion.

It actually made it to phase III trials when Ciba-Geigy were looking to make it a medicinal product. What scuppered it wasn't anything dodgy regardinmg long term use etc (well not physically), it was because it has such a long half life that it had unacceptable levels of side effects like insomnia; well that and te fact that it had a noticable abuse potential. In the end they went with methylphenidate as the CNS stimulant they chose to market

Oh and on L-DOPA, don't fuck about with it as it's downtream of the rate limiting step in dopamine & noradrenaline biosynthesis (the rate limiting step is tyramine -> DOPA via tyrosine hydroxylase. The enzyme is inhibited by dopamine so it's a very useful negative feedback loop). Bypassing that step by introducing L-DOPA is just asking for paranoia, uncontrollable writhing movements & nausea because of excessive levels of dopamine in the brain. If yu want to take something, try L-tyrosine or phenylalanine - then at least the body can regulate things

edit - SORRY fb i meant to quote you and accidentally pressed edit!!
 
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Thank you very much for the response :). This little compound must of cost them a huge amount of money,

The L Dopa was intended supplementally, the use of it on a tail end was to hopefully prevent a redose, but I don't think it is necessary.

The rush of the hcl smoked was fairly pleasant, felt like a cascade, I have some freebase crystals waiting for the right moment too.

It's good to hear about the NE depletion, any idea about downregulation causing any issues?

It's been some time since I took my last dose 2 days ish, I can sleep fine, but I still feel I have retained a bit of the alert concentrating mode, I usually find I dispaly adhd-esque symptons, but they aren't appearing at the moment.

I found myself developing ocd, slight anxiety and strong audio and visual hallucinations after two days or so, My vision is slightly odd to the extent it morphs facebook pictures into pornstar esque shots for a few seconds till I focus.
 
I made some freebase desoxypipradrol crystal and have ascertained it's umm a lot stronger than the hcl salt.

This feels nearly psychadelic, really colourful, rusheeeeee.

Any idea how long this inital part lasts? I can see this posing a big challenge to my self control.

There's something utterly depraved about large amounts of dopamine.

My nostrils are itchy, I have recenylu learn that the blue dlistex stuff does not create the beautiful numbing coke affect when applied to the inside of a nostril.
 
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