Deprenyl/Selegiline combinations/dangers

[Swedish Penguin]

I think theres a chance I wont get good responses here but I thought I may as well try as the internet seems particularly lacking and contradictory on deprenyl interactions with other drugs- namely psychedelics, mdma, stimulants.

Generally with 2c- or phenethylamine psychedelics people warn extreme caution, reducing dose by 2/3s at least etc, as phenethylamines are metabolized by maob this makes perfect sense.

Tryptamine psychedelics I really cant find any info on the potentiation, I would imagine it would make them more clearheaded and maybe increase the effects somewhat? Obviously depending on the psychdelic (5-mep-mipt, amt would probably pose some issues), but as tryptamines are likely not metabolized by maob and dont have a lot of dopamine interaction I would imagine they have less effect.

Mdma is clearly a very split topic, with half the people saying too dangerous to try, some saying no difference in effect, obviously there are articles on pubmed saying reduction in neurotoxicity but this is obviously dependent on dosage of mdma and deprenyl. A single dosage before may be helpful, taking a quarter of a mdma dosage may equal usual effects, etc.

I guess what it comes down to is that everyones dopamine systems are very different and the effectiveness of the drug ranges and there is no real safe way to manage these interactions. I guess what I would like to know is, without suggesting ways for me to be dangerous like you have, has anyone managed these interactions safely, and if I were to try these interactions, specifically mdma- what are my hazards, and assuming there were no way to talk me out of it, how could it most safely be navigated?

Just to be clear, I am not going to try this necessarily. I have taken 5mgs a day for about a week and a half. My thoughts on most safe way to do this would be to take like a quarter of a clean molly pill, and wait an hour and then take another quarter if need be. Sorry if you guys think this the wrong place for this. Any responses, thoughts, experiences are appreciated. Thanks.

 

[ebola?]

I will keep plugging my FAQ on the matter :

I wrote this while on the combinations I talk about: my apologies for my verbosity

I will add that there is no reason to combine deprenyl with phenethylamine psychedelics: there will be straightforward potentiation, but with increased risk of cardiovascular side-effects (due to unpredictability of potentiation), but no likely benefit; just take more of your compound of choice sans deprenyl. There should be no interaction with tryptamines that do not affect dopamine or norepinephrine.

ebola

 

[Epsilon Alpha]

Well take enough and it inhibits MAO-A, which will act on tryptamiines. But, at those doses you'd run into more problems even with your diet.

 

[Swedish Penguin]

Well I have of course read your FAQ ebola, very informative, and I dont really have any inclination in combining it with stimulants or phenethylamine psychedelics honestly- to be honest Id prefer to not combine it with anything but as it happens I am on a course of it and I know several times coming up will be instances where I would sort of want to roll, or possibly do LSD.

ebola I know I saw a post saying you safely combined with MDMA, now if you dont want to talk about it in public where stupid people could get bad ideas or just in general if you wouldnt recommend it simply because of unpredictability thats fine, but I am interested in more info on that.

I guess I wasnt thinking from the FAQ that you would recommend the same sort of incremented regimen for anything we are trying to combine it with? For psychostimulants I am taking daily it would makes sense but if I am trying to take mdma one time I think starting at a shulgin level would take me several attempts to feel anything. Maybe for safety that would be the only way, I dont know.

From the reports I have seen of people having a psychotic break or something to that effect they havent cared or realized the possible dangers of their combinations and have taken ludicrous doses of the phenethylamine, I have no inclination in doing that, I think taking a quarter pill and waiting for effects would be reasonably safe.

also Ive seen several posts saying LSD was fine- not potentiated, which makes sense in that it is not broken down by MAOB, but it does have dopamine effects and I could find maybe two or three posts on the entire internet even mentioning it, so I was looking for more info on that as well.

 

[ebola?]

I guess I wasnt thinking from the FAQ that you would recommend the same sort of incremented regimen for anything we are trying to combine it with? For psychostimulants I am taking daily it would makes sense but if I am trying to take mdma one time I think starting at a shulgin level would take me several attempts to feel anything. Maybe for safety that would be the only way, I dont know.

Yeah. Unfortunately, titration upward with MDMA is quite the hassle. However, it's quite necessary for safety.

I think taking a quarter pill and waiting for effects would be reasonably safe.

Probably. However, you might be a member of the population who just happens to respond severely to the combination, so I'd start even lower. People have had physiologically alarming responses to 5 mg / adderall while on maob selective doses of deprenyl, while the vast majority would not, so responses to combinations are quite idiosyncratic.

also Ive seen several posts saying LSD was fine- not potentiated, which makes sense in that it is not broken down by MAOB, but it does have dopamine effects and I could find maybe two or three posts on the entire internet even mentioning it, so I was looking for more info on that as well.

LSD's effects on dopamine are limited to direct agonism, so you're fine. Hell, LSD is metabolized mainly via mechanisms other than monoamine oxidase.

ebola

 

[Swedish Penguin]

Would tolerance have a factor in this at all, for instance it would usually take 2 pills/mollies for me to roll than I could expect it would take more than a very small amount. Or since it is dopamine we are talking about, I could still randomly have uncomfortable stimulation regardless of any sort of tolerance?

 

[Hammilton]

Selegiline is okay to combine with DA agonists, anyway. I combined it with L-dopa and Requip without a problem, maybe very slight potentiation.

 

[Swedish Penguin]

I think it is worth mentioning that i attempted taking mdma last night, I have been on a deprenyl course for like a week and a half, i stopped a few days before taking mdma. Though I do not recommend this to anyone as personal interactions could obviously range/my tolerance is not yours. Perhaps noticing synergy with lesser stimulants like caffeine could indicated some increased synergy with mdma though, i dont notice any/much synergy with even large amounts of caffeine.

Anyway I started off taking a 1/4 molly, noticed nothing so an hour later took the other 3/4s, and an hour after that took another whole pill. Throughout the night I noticed very little interaction if any at all. It should be noted that I have taken mdma about two weeks ago, and generally I expect to take at least 3 pills a night to roll the amount I like. I felt like perhaps I was stimulated longer than usual but I wasnt rolling particularly harder. Perhaps a slight potentiation, but I would likely have to take a full dosage of mdma to know better. I will say this morning I noticed no real ill effects of mdma but I dont really know how much that says about the fact that deprenyl supposedly protects against mdma damage.

As it happens I wont likely attempt this interaction again, I have no interest in risking these sorts of things, I just happened to have an event that I didnt plan to roll on that circumstances made me feel like I would be better served rolling. I may however attempt a very low dosage of amt (5-10mgs tops) to see interactions, which I think could actually be sort of favorable. interactions with other drugs are also interesting to me, only because it seems like there is very little information on these and inquiring minds do need to know occasionally.

So in the name of science I may try very low dosages of drugs I think could be dangerous or likely to be combined, methoxetamine comes to mind, since it has such a DARI effect, maybe in small dosages it could increase afterglow/motivation effects, though in large doses I assume it would lead to psychosis. I may attempt a 1-5mg dosage, my usual dosage of 100mgs will not be attempted. Note that I have no timetable in which I plan to attempt this endeavor, just that I may sometime. I would update this thread in the event it happens.

I think it is also worth it to mention that I have combined alcohol and mj with deprenyl to no ill effects, thought it made my mj high more enjoyable (less anxious) than they have been in years, alcohol maybe I felt a lil less inhibited, but otherwise pretty much exactly the same as usual. I combined it once with bacopa moinneri and it made me feel strange, though I couldnt describe it, and the feeling passed. I think sulbutiamine could be somewhat dangerous with it, may attempt a very small dosage. l-tyrosine I havent really noticed a large difference, though i have cut my dosage by a significant amount.