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December 2012

maybe its the date when the illunmnati will have total control and declare us the "United States of Planet Earth"

i mean shit 'they' already have europe, north america, now the middle east, africa has no say in anything, japan, almost completed with china, north and south korea, india aint shit, russia, and the rest is no threat anyway.
 
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chemicalwasteland said:
absolutly not, I base my beliefs only one what I know, but i am an extremely open minded person and will take anything into concideration besides structured religion. So yea it was just an interesting post I found somewhere along the way while reading about him in wired mag.

when it all comes down to it none of us know anything about anything, science is only theory of reoccuring events that we have known and have yet to prove against. so you basing everything on science is a bit small-minded? (deffinitly not trying to insult you I just couldnt think of a word).

All any of us know is what we have experienced for ourselves, we werent around 100 (1,000; 10,000) years ago to prove for ourselves anything, include a story book such as the bible.

I dont know maybe i have just taken way too many hallucinogens and just know that there is never a right answer to anything, and you cant trust anything for fact.

I just opened this thread to get a feel for others ideas on the subject as I have been seeing it alot lately, with many different theories attached to them that seem resonable.

Hell keep the thoeries and personal arguments comming, I love it.


Nobody likes a fence sitter. You gotta throw all that psycho babble outta your head and be a man and face reality and grab it by its balls and make it squeal like the girl it is. IMO =D
 
The cycle is an illusion, but it is one human beings are meant to have.

No it's not, the cycle started with the seasons which were obviously very important to farmers. Also, you have day and night.

We've just refined that by figuring out one year is one rotation around the Sun which causes the seasons and one day is one rotation of the Earth around it's center which causes day and night relative to the Sun.

You can't just say, "There is no day and night in outer space so time doesn't exist".

We live by passing moments, the passage of time is simply counting these moments in a standard format and we decided that a good place to start over is 1 minute, 1 hour, 1 day, 1 year, ect.. because it allows us to UNDERSTAND the measurement of time and break it into a system like us humans always do.

If we sent a ship into outer space do you think they'd stop keeping track of time just because there is no day or night?

Would you tell someone you're 348326543765012086423 seconds old? No, cause you're not a computer which keeps track of time in seconds since 1970 and uses math to fit it into our system. Maybe if we were smart enough to do the math instantly in our heads we WOULD use a single unit of time to discuss passing moments.

What is an illusion? Maybe reality or some other philosophical thing but our concept of time seems pretty well established.
 
I myself have not run the Timewave 2012 program, nor do I claim to know what kind of mathematical formulations it is based on. So I'll start my little tirade by asking this question:

How long does anyone think the present course of human affairs can continue without monumental consequences? To put it another way, how close can you get to the edge of a cliff without falling off?

Some of you on this thread are asking others to 'prove' that the world is going to end in 2012. You want 'evidence,' you say. What you need to understand is that there are things which cannot be proven empirically, yet can be understood innately. I cannot 'prove' - in any definitive way - that I love my parents, but I know that I do, and so do they.

Asking someone to prove that the world is going to end at a given time is like asking someone to give a definite answer to the question, "what came first, the chicken or the egg?" No one here today was alive at that particular evolutionary branch point, so no one here today is qualified to answer that question. All we know today is that chickens lay eggs, which in turn become chickens - or breakfast.

Obviously nobody at present has witnessed the much-prophesied 2012 end/shift/transcendence/nothing, because it hasn't fucking happened yet. You will know 2012 when it comes. If you die before that time, then from your perspective, it will never happen, unless of course you believe that you will continue to exist in the flow of time and witness events from some other-dimensional vantage point (ie. heaven or hell), but that's another discussion altogether.

I believe, but cannot prove, that some sort of larger-than-life, either/or event is going to occur during my lifetime. The threat of runaway climate change, the insanity of never-ending geopolitical conflict, energy disruptions (like the one that turned out most of the lights in LA recently), and developmental progress of benign and malicious technologies all seem to point to something BIG happening in the near future. A revolution of some sort. At some point, humanity IS collectively going to be forced to make a choice: EITHER we will fail to adapt to necessity and die (like the dinosaurs) OR we get our collective 'shit together' and continue the walk down the path of evolution, towards what McKenna called the 'hyperspatial entelechy' - and what I believe is humanity's ultimate reason for being. One way or another, things are going to change, because change is all there is.

John von Neumann said it best:

"the ever accelerating progress of technology and changes in the mode of human life... ...gives the appearance of approaching some essential singularity in the history of the race beyond which human affairs, as we know them, could not continue."
 
I wasnt ever asking for evidence, but for references, that way everyone can have a link to someone elses thoughts and maybe open their mind a lil to new concepts and ideas.

just like i dont see how anyone could have such a following to the bible when to me it sounds like one great story, of a nice man with good intentions that may have possibly had a good A. Muscaria religous experience. Yes it was quite an innovation, but just another good story none the less, and no one here can prove for or against my lil theory because they werent there.

to me there is no such thing as evidence, only experience.
 
What a crock of shit. For thousands of years, people have predicted "the end"- it hasn't come yet. The Mayans didn't have some secret knowledge of the end of the world, use some common sense.
 
Just one word is needed for this thread: Bullshit.

Remember when everyone was predicting the millenium(sp?) bug and everything was going to shut down or whatever?It's embaressing that theres a thread about this kind of thing.
 
m885 said:
What a crock of shit. For thousands of years, people have predicted "the end"- it hasn't come yet. The Mayans didn't have some secret knowledge of the end of the world, use some common sense.

Maybe

How often is it that completely different belief systems all agree that "the end" is near though?
 
yougene said:
How often is it that completely different belief systems all agree that "the end" is near though?

one of the best points to come across this thread thus far, bravo.

and like he said its not just one person, one ethnicity, one religion, one timezone, or one perspective saying dec 2012, it is many.


i think to think that it is absolute bullshit is closeminded, and maybe scared of dying / gaining higher consiousness / higher overtone ... etc.


just the way i have been seeing it in many WAY different texts and such, made me at least consider the idea of something beyond our common knowledge happening, besides just calling it bullshit.

challenge a theory / argument besides just calling it bullshit, thats the easy way out.
 
yougene said:
How often is it that completely different belief systems all agree that "the end" is near though?

and which ones are those again?

to the poster afterwards, many? besides new age crackpots?

look, i have a couple thousand year calendars that were made in the 70s or 80s. they both end at the year 2000. guess what date passed and yet we're still here? it's an ad populum fallacy.
 
SomeOneElse001 said:
"what came first, the chicken or the egg?" No one here today was alive at that particular evolutionary branch point, so no one here today is qualified to answer that question. All we know today is that chickens lay eggs, which in turn become chickens - or breakfast.

It doesn't take many braincells to figure out that eggs came first, seeing as how reptillians were laying them for millions of years before the first proto-chicken crawled out and horrified his lizard parents.

As for this 2012 stuff, I think it proves that the quality of drugs is rising rapidly and doing a lot of damage to the youth of the world. =D

--- G.
 
Ahaha, one of the people claiming this crap is the guy who wrote that "Bible Code" bullshit. He was humiliated recently when someone used his system to find a warning about the 9-11 attacks in... get this... Vanilla Ice lyrics =D

You can literally find anything. And all these people claiming this date seem to be agreeing with the original Mayan crap, or at least came long after it and could this easily have been influenced by it or at least heard of it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012

--- G.
 
michael said:
and which ones are those again?

Judaism - Most of the signs of the coming of the mashiach have been fulfilled.

Catholicism - Benedict is the last prophecised pope

Scientifically - increasing speeds of development

Mayans - Calender


to the poster afterwards, many? besides new age crackpots?

look, i have a couple thousand year calendars that were made in the 70s or 80s. they both end at the year 2000. guess what date passed and yet we're still here?
I don't believe the world will actually end, i guess you must have missed that part.

it's an ad populum fallacy.
Well, I approach them in terms of omens anyway, so many logical "fallacies" are pretty irrelevant from the approach I am taking.

And I wasn't trying to point out that everyone is on the bandwagon, I was trying to point out how two completely disconnected civilizations have surprisingly similar future timelines.
 
yougene said:
Judaism - Most of the signs of the coming of the mashiach have been fulfilled.


What does that have to do with the date 2012? Why not right now? Why not next year? You are REALLY reaching with this one.

Catholicism - Benedict is the last prophecised pope

And he will die in 2012? Again, completely pulled out of your ass and has nothing to do with 2012.

Scientifically - increasing speeds of development

See above.

Mayans - Calender

LOL, exactly, that's where it ALL comes from.


Well, I approach them in terms of omens anyway, so many logical "fallacies" are pretty irrelevant from the approach I am taking.

If you admit your approach is illogical then don't try to make a logical case for it.

And I wasn't trying to point out that everyone is on the bandwagon, I was trying to point out how two completely disconnected civilizations have surprisingly similar future timelines.

But they don't, any "similarities" are so obviously due to vagueness and coincidence that can be shown in any number of traditions that it's completely meaningless as any predictor of anything what so ever.. That's the thing.

--- G.
 
Morrison's Lament said:
You are REALLY reaching with this one.
No, you just already decided you don't want to hear what I have to say.


And he will die in 2012? Again, completely pulled out of your ass and has nothing to do with 2012.
No pope? That doesn't suggest a major structural change?


If you admit your approach is illogical then don't try to make a logical case for it.
My approach makes use of logic it just functions under different assumptions then Michael's.



But they don't, any "similarities" are so obviously due to vagueness and coincidence that can be shown in any number of traditions that it's completely meaningless as any predictor of anything what so ever.. That's the thing.

--- G.
Hardly vague or meaningless if you take the time to look into with an open and critical mind but, we all know you won't.
 
I already did, you're the one evading every salient point of discussion here.

What makes ANY of the above correlate with 2012 and what is the place of logic in an ADMITTEDLY illogical argument?

--- G.
 
yougene said:
Judaism - Most of the signs of the coming of the mashiach have been fulfilled.

well, you can't argue with biblical prophecy!


Catholicism - Benedict is the last prophecised pope


by who?

Scientifically - increasing speeds of development


null phrase.

Mayans - Calender


yeah, isn't it amazing they stopped plotting out a calendar after they died out. it was only good for another 500 years or so.

And I wasn't trying to point out that everyone is on the bandwagon, I was trying to point out how two completely disconnected civilizations have surprisingly similar future timelines.

i still fail to see any similarity that isn't imagined.
 
Morrison's Lament said:
I already did, you're the one evading every salient point of discussion here.
I really don't feel like you're here to have a constructive discussion. For one I never admitted what I'm saying is illogical, I said my logic functions with different assumptions compared to michael's.

What makes ANY of the above correlate with 2012 and what is the
place of logic in an ADMITTEDLY illogical argument?

--- G.
If you would take the time to look at my original post you would see that I see the "end" in terms of major change, not destruction, everything I listed are examples of major changed or predicted major change all within a general time area. When I think of 2012, I'm thinking about the general events surrounding 2012 before and after, not neccasarily exactly december 2012.
 
michael said:
I don't know



null phrase.

I didn't feel like typing everything out again, read my original post for a clearer idea of what I'm talking about.


yeah, isn't it amazing they stopped plotting out a calendar after they died out. it was only good for another 500 years or so.
We know the mayans viewed everything in terms of cycles, they actually have a calendar mapped out on the scale of millions of years.



i still fail to see any similarity that isn't imagined.
Understandable
 
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