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dangers of dl phenylalanine

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psychedelic food

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Jan 8, 2009
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Are their any dangers of taking this everyday along with tryptophan? Would it mess with the tryptophan hydroxolase or whatever thefore unbalanicing other neurotransmitters?
 
You need to balance it with tryptophan. Dopamine and serotonin imbalances can cause problems.
 
If it does, the effects will be minor. Look what happens in phenylketonurics who don't control their pa intake.

All of this is rate limited, so the effects that can be had are also substantially limited.
 
I doubt there are dangers. DLPA is one of my favourite supplements -- after eating lots of it over several days, I got a cool opiate-like buzz going that lasted 24 hours. Gotta love those enkephalins.

I think the balance is perfect with DLPA, as some of DPA is converted to PEA, which may deplete neurotransmitters (not sure though). The LPA replenishes these.
 
also have another question didnt want to start a new thread. I took benzotropine on accident mistaking it for benzodiazapine. How much piracetam, aniracetam, choline and nicotine would i have to take to antagonize its effect?
 
psychedelic food said:
also have another question didnt want to start a new thread. I took benzotropine on accident mistaking it for benzodiazapine. How much piracetam, aniracetam, choline and nicotine would i have to take to antagonize its effect?
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This probably belongs in a new thread, as you say. Anyway, Racetams will be unable to reverse the effects of an anti-cholinergic in my experience. Even Acetylcholinesterase inhibitors like Aricept don't seem very effective. I believe the military might pack a special antidote in case of a BZ-like anti-cholinergic nerve gas attack, though I don't remember the specifics, and it is almost certainly not easily available. The pharmacology of anti-cholinergic overdose seems quite frustrating.

Benztropine is a muscarinic antagonist, and nicotine shouldn't really help.

BTW, how the fuck did you mix up benztropine and benzodiazepine? I am not aware of any common benzos that start with BENZ, either generically or by brand.
 
I was fucked up. Would caffeine help to speed up metabolism? What are some inducers of the liver enzymes its metabolized by?
 
It antagonizes muscarinic acetycholine receptors, so unless you have some muscarine, which I highly doubt you do then you're out of luck. None of those cholinergic drugs you've mentioned will really do anything to reverse benztropines effects.
 
Even Muscarine won't help; It doesn't cross the blood brain barrier.

Here's a quote from wikipedia (for educational purposes only obviosly- I doubt you'll be able to find VX nerve gas lol) about treating BZ nerve agent intoxication:

As a competitive inhibitor of acetylcholine, BZ effectively decreases the amount of acetylcholine "seen" by postsynaptic and postjunctional receptors throughout the body. Specific antidotal therapy in BZ poisoning is therefore geared toward raising the concentration of acetylcholine in these synapses and junctions. Any compound that causes a rise in acetylcholine concentration can potentially overcome BZ-induced inhibition and restore normal functioning; even the nerve agent VX has been shown to be effective when given under carefully controlled conditions. The specific antidote of choice in BZ poisoning is the carbamate anticholinesterase physostigmine (eserine; Antilirium), which temporarily raises acetylcholine concentrations by binding reversibly to anticholinesterase on the postsynaptic or postjunctional membrane. Physostigmine is similar in many ways to pyridostigmine and is equally effective when used as a pre-exposure antidotal enhancer ("pretreatment") in individuals at high risk for subsequently encountering soman. However, physostigmine is not used for this purpose because the doses required cause vomiting through CNS mechanisms. In the case of BZ poisoning, a nonpolar compound such as physostigmine is used specifically because penetration into the brain is required in those individuals who already have CNS effects from BZ.
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^ wait... that shit is BZ? LOL. funny i saw jacobs ladder yesterday. I know the effects are much different from how it's portrayed in that thriller/horror movie, but it still must really suck, and it can last like 4 days. Muscarine would help if you IV'd it. Then it'd be able to cross the BBB. I didn't know that shit was a pharmaceutical though. What's it for? ulcers?
 
No, BZ isn't Benztropine. I completely missed the possibility of BZ being a nickname for it. Hehe. Sorry for the confusion. BZ is 3-Quinuclidinyl benzilate, the stuff inaccurately portrayed in Jacob's Ladder. Both substances, however, are anti-cholinergics with similar side effects. I just use BZ as an example because there is more information about antidotes for it, as opposed to Benztropine.

BTW, I remember reading a news story a few months ago about Iraqi insurgents using BZ on themselves on purpose for it "recreational" or more likely purely deliriant effect. I'm sure somebody here must have posted it. Bizarre story.

Oh yeah, and I have seen Jacob's Ladder. I "watched" it years ago with a friend, but I was so "dissociated" (don't want to elaborate) that I only remember a few seconds of it. Sounds like a cool movie; I want to check it out again.
Muscarine would help if you IV'd it.
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Are you sure about this? Since it is a quaternary amine, wouldn't it have to be injected directly into nervous tissue to have an effect? For example, an IV'ed choline salt like Choline Citrate will not cross the BRB no matter the amount injected (choline transporter not included).
 
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Tsukasa said:
^ wait... that shit is BZ? LOL. funny i saw jacobs ladder yesterday. I know the effects are much different from how it's portrayed in that thriller/horror movie, but it still must really suck, and it can last like 4 days. Muscarine would help if you IV'd it. Then it'd be able to cross the BBB. I didn't know that shit was a pharmaceutical though. What's it for? ulcers?
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IVing things doesn't generally help them cross the BBB. I'm having trouble thinking of any quaternary amine that crosses. Also the reason that MPP+ is so horrible. It can get in (as MPTP which is metabolized to MPP+ after it's in the brain).
 
I'm having trouble thinking of any quaternary amine that crosses.
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I've been wondering about the same thing.

Here are two abstracts about the quaternary herbicide Paraquat. This stuff is toxic and potentially lethal to humans, but the mechanism doesn't appear to be neurological.

Paraquat is excluded by the blood brain barrier in rhesus macaque: An in vivo pet study.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19135428?dopt=Abstract

Distribution of paraquat into the brain after its systemic injection in rats.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1582580

The first abstract reads that Paraquat DOES cross the BBB in primates, though not in a pathologically significant way.

My inference from the second abstract indicates that Paraquat more readily crosses the BRB in rats.
The concentrations detected into the cortex may account for the neuronal cell death reported in rats following systemic injection of this herbicide.
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That wouldn't be surprising, rats and humans are pretty different. a good starting point, for research, but nothing more.
 
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