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Damned benzo tollerance.

/navarone/ said:
Are you refering to the antioxidant present in grapefruit juice (polyphenols) or sumthing else?

shouldn't wine do the same trick?
Click to expand...
Some certain flavonoids from grapefruit are cytochrom-P450 inhibitors.

Wine doesn't contain those, so: NO, it won't do the same "trick".
 
/navarone/ said:
PS: ive been an ex-methhead for a couple of years so.......i'm not surprised if some of my receptors downregulted a lot.

Could that explain my tollerance?
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Meth and benzos act via completely different receptors. Therefore: Not impossible but quite unlikely.
 
Could flumazenil (a GABAa antagonist) up-regulate GABAa receptors?

in short words, my big question is:
Is thee any substance that could up regulate GABAa receptors and there fore inhibit benzodiazepine tollerance? or should i justs wait months and months hoping that they up-regulare by themselfs?
 
johanneschimpo said:
^ Until you mix them with another CNS depressant. Then you're fucked.


VECKTOR/FASTANDBULBOUS/NUKE: Why is this thread still in ADD? Or open at all?
Click to expand...

Always be suspicious of a thread on ADD with a spelling mistake in the title. :\
 
/navarone/ said:
Could flumazenil (a GABAa antagonist) up-regulate GABAa receptors?[1]

in short words, my big question is:
Is thee any substance that could up regulate GABAa receptors and there fore inhibit benzodiazepine tollerance?[2] or should i justs wait months and months hoping that they up-regulare by themselfs?[3]
Click to expand...

[1] No.
[2] IMO no.
[3] You got it. And maybe that helps with your dyslexia, too. But maybe you fucked up your GABA-system already irreparable.
 
haribo1 said:
Always be suspicious of a thread on ADD with a spelling mistake in the title. :\
Click to expand...
In the title and in practically every post by the thread-opener. I strongly second Haribo...
 
I started taking 1 10mg valium 3x daily about 3 years ago while still on suboxone and it made me feel great and it also made me get a better buzz and great feeling from it too, however I sometimes would take 3, then 5 at a time to really get feeling good. Then I slowly developed a tolerance to it and the suboxone wasn't working hardly at all anymore except just keeping wd's at bay so 2 years ago I started on methadone and my psych doctor who prescribed them to me asked me if I thought I needed to still take the valium since the methadone was working so good. I knew it would be a disaster if I quit so I said no I think I still need them etc and kept getting them.

Then when I was feeling so good on methadone I did something dumb one day, I picked up my 120 pills that were supposed to last a month and didn't tell my mom I got them again and hid them and went on a binge and started taking 5 at a time a few times a day and ran out in a week or a week and a half. I didn't notice anything until about 2 weeks later, I suddenly started feeling so depressed and felt like the methadone was doing nothing, so I saw my clinic doctor and told him what happened, he said that I was going through valium wd's and not anything to do with the methadone.

He gave me a stern lecture on not doing that ever again and asked my permission to call my Mom and urge her to keep my valium hidden and give them out to me every day and was nice enough to give me a script to last a week before my next 120 were due so I would not suffer so bad.

Now I'm on 20mg valium twice daily since I told my psych doc that it doesn't seem to be working anymore so he upped it 10 mgs and I still feel like I'm wasting pills. Then I read this great informative thread and now I wonder if I'm so loaded with overlapping half lives of valium that I should start stashing up the two at a time my Mom gives to me twice a day and cold turkey off valium for a week or until I start getting too uncomfortable. What do you all think of this plan? will this make me feel much better? how long do you think it would be, before I get wd's setting in? I'm assuming a long time since I'm so loaded up with half lives. Let me know what you all think, along with any advice on how to do this etc so I feel better. Thanks, sorry for my long story but I figured if I told everything, it would give a true insight on what's been going on the past 3 years since I went from feeling great to now feeling just blah all the time and wanting to sleep alot.
 
If you have high benzo tolerance, try combining ketoconazole with any azolobenzodiazepine (triazolam, midazolam, alprazolam)
 
I'm currently taking a break from benzos.

I got myself a pharm with dihydrocodine + cardiazol (a GABAa antagonist).
After reading few ages online, it seems that by puting an extended end to benzo assumption and taking antagonist instead should lead to an upregulation of the receptor.

I'll keep doing so for another 2 weeks, then after a week of complete sobriety (apart from cigs and wine at dinner) im going to test if my tollerance with 3-4mg of clonazepam and see how strong the effect gets.

would anyone advise me something else?
 
cardiazol is pentylenetetrazol (PTZ), for any who aren't aware. commonly used to induce seizures. I dunno when, but I do know it's FDA approval was revoked a while ago.

2 weeks is not an extended end.
2 months isn't an extended end.

extended means extended, what you're talking about is super short.

I'd advise not bothering because what you're doing won't do anything.

benzo tolerance is notorious for taking a long time to go back to normal.
 
Taking a GABA antagonist will reverse benzo tolerance much more quickly than abstinence would by itself, but Hammilton is correct that pentylenetetrazol is a strong convulsant and it would be a sensible precaution to take a non-GABAergic anticonvulsant alongside the GABA antagonist (a sodium channel blocker like lamotrigine or carbamazepine would be best)

Also yeah, 2 weeks is nowhere near a long enough break even with a GABA antagonist to speed up reversal of tolerance, I'd suggest a couple months at least...
 
I also, currently am having quite a hell of a tolerance to Xanax. Is this Alprazolam powder anything different or special as opposed to regular Xanax? ..and yes, it seems all I can do to cut this tolerance down is have an "extended end" and I can knock it down from 8 to 10 barrs to about 4 or 5 but right after that it will bump right back up there. now with this said....I have eaten about eleven 10MG name brand Valium's and nothing! same with these Klonopin's. Only Xanax seem's to get the job done.
 
Has none of the heavy (ab)users ever considered to be addicted, in particular mentally?! It is so fucking obvious. And when you then suggest to stop your habit for a couple of weeks - while thinking aloud at the same time to restart as soon as possible (!!!), then I feel only pity for you. You better stop completely. A couple of weeks? Pfffffff... Senseless to say the least. Only to ease your conscience. Ridiculous!
When people here report about eating 110 mg valium without any noticable effect, I would strongly recommend to seek professional help. You are still alive solely for the reason of a broooooaaaaad therapeutic index.
 
yup....we really do like taking drugs. We're just trying not to fuck our brains receptors permanently.

I think im going to listen to your advice and take a long break, lets say 6 months.
Maybe i'll add a moderate daily dose of flumazenyl during theese months hoping it would speed up the up-regulation, or maybe I'm just going for pure abstincence with healthy living.

Btw i wonder if frequent cannabis consumption has any interaction with benzodiazpine tollerance. I recall having less tollerance when i stopped smoking marijuana a few years back.
 
All right, this time I'm serious, since i saw that IVing 10mg of clonazepam (4ml of 2,5mg per ml) feel next to nothing, I'm planning to stop taking benzos for at least 6 months.

I have another 2 questions though, could should I avoid valproic acid and piracetam in order to upregulte my GABAa receptors in these 6+ months? they all affect GABA receptors if im not wrong.

Second: Would stamina and strenght exercise help in upregulating my GABA receptors?
(I'm saying this since glutamic acid is responsible for neurological excitement but afterwards it's converted into GABA by enzymes.)
 
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Additional info:

I recently discovered that cytochrome p450 inhibitors can increase benzodiazepne efficiency as well as tricyclic antidepressants.

Ethanol and fluoexetine seem to inhibit cytochrome p450 activity.
 
just stop taking them. This is a harm reduction site, and I think anything more is anti-reductionist.
 
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