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Countering vasoconstriction with viagra

Anon0631

Anon0631

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 22, 2012
Messages
711
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London, UK
Just a thought... Viagra/cialis/levitra are vasodilators. Could they be used to counter vasoconstriction caused by psychedelics?
 
They were actually first developed as cardiac vasodialators, but they don't work as well for that purpose as inducing erections.
 
This is hearsay, but I remembering reading a few years ago someone saying that, despite intuition, a vasodilator wouldnt counteract the cardio effects of drug that is a vasoconstrictor. I don't know what his qualifications were for saying that, but I just figured I'd mention it.

Also, weed is a vasodilator right? So maybe thats a good experiment where you don't have to use some pharmaceutical. But it would probably increase your heart rate alot.
 
I definitely don't recommend weed imo, it always raises my heart rate, increases anxiety, and makes me feel tense like vasoconstriction is getting worse. This is my experience anyway, it could be different for others
 
Icarin the main active agent in Epimedium is a better safer alternative to Viagra and Cialis. I find it to be an overall energy enhancer, Helps with excersize in general, pleasent libido effects are noted.


I take this as a supplement every day as it is best in use as most herbal supplements are when it builds up in your body... seriously after a bout 3 weeks I had more energy overall. It is a good natural vasodialator.
 
From wiki:
Tolazoline is a non-selective competitive α-adrenergic receptor antagonist. It is a vasodilator that is used to treat spasms of peripheral blood vessels (as in acrocyanosis). It has also been used successfully as an antidote to reverse the severe peripheral vasoconstriction which can occur as a result of overdose with certain 5-HT2A agonist drugs such as LSD, DOB and Bromodragonfly (prolonged severe vasoconstriction can lead to gangrene if untreated).[1][2]
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Not all vasodilators dilate blood vessels where psychedelics constrict them (see alcohol). Alpha blockers may be what we're looking for for psychedelic vasoconstriction. Yohimbe bark extract is available OTC retail, though it's pretty stimulating so go easy. I'll have to try it sometime since I've been annoyed by psychedelic vasoconstriction lately. Can anybody confirm it works? Ideally a more selective alpha blocker would be used, though.
 
^I'm not sure commonly available vasodilators are powerful enough to combat the sort of vasoconstriction DOB-Dragonfly brings, but I could be wrong.

I've just posted the following question in the Big and Bang'in Not Quite Advanced Chemistry thread over in Advanced Drug Discussion, which is one of the more highly trafficked threads in that forum:
I know alpha-blockers have been used to treat severe cases of psychedelic vasoconstriction, but are skeletal muscle vasodilators better for alleviating the aches and tension from normal recreational doses of vasoconstricting psychedelics like LSD? Whether alpha-blockers or muscle relaxants are best, what fairly common drug among them is likely to be able to alleviate psychedelic vasoconstriction with minimal influence on mental lucidity?
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If I get a promising response there I'll post it here. I'm thinking a muscle relaxant with minimal impact on mental lucidity might be best for common psychedelic vasoconstriction but hopefully I'll get a more informed response.
 
I've been looking around and I'm somewhat hopeful that transdermal L-Arginine creme may be the answer. Oral l-arginine gives me a headache, but perhaps if I just rubbed it onto my back, shoulders, and neck it would be enough to alleviate the most annoying sources of tension. You can buy such cremes at many convenience stores. It seems as though the body tension psychedelics cause is through skeletal muscle vasoconstriction. L-arginine is a precursor to nitric oxide, which causes skeletal muscle vasodilation, and so by rubbing a transdermal l-arginine creme into our skin we may be able to combat psychedelic vasoconstriction in specific areas of the body without interfering with the psychological aspects of the trip. I've not tested this yet, but if anybody else has I'm interested to hear if it has worked.
 
I personally wouldn't mix the two, especially if you end up with a hard on that won't go away while you're tripping balls. Pun intended =D
 
psood0nym said:
I've been looking around and I'm somewhat hopeful that transdermal L-Arginine creme may be the answer. Oral l-arginine gives me a headache, but perhaps if I just rubbed it onto my back, shoulders, and neck it would be enough to alleviate the most annoying sources of tension. You can buy such cremes at many convenience stores. It seems as though the body tension psychedelics cause is through skeletal muscle vasoconstriction. L-arginine is a precursor to nitric oxide, which causes skeletal muscle vasodilation, and so by rubbing a transdermal l-arginine creme into our skin we may be able to combat psychedelic vasoconstriction in specific areas of the body without interfering with the psychological aspects of the trip. I've not tested this yet, but if anybody else has I'm interested to hear if it has worked.
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I've always had intense pains from vasoconstriction in my legs on NBOMes and now I'm noticing it on high dose mushroom trips. I'm going to try this out on my next NBOMe adventure, maybe the horny goat weed/icarin stuff too if I can find it cheap.
 
^Ibuprofen is itself a vascoconstrictor, that's why it's anti-inflammatory. L-arginine, already mentioned, is a precursor for nitric oxide biosynthesis and it's cheap and readily available. I've not had much luck with oral l-arginine but I think the topical cremes may be a more direct and effective vehicle for countering psychedelic induced skeletal muscle vasoconstriction (and I'm pretty sure it's skeletal muscle vacoconstriction and not the smooth muscle targeted by products like Viagra that's the source of the aches and tension). Hopefully someone will try it out soon and let us know.
 
^Interesting, I've always been told the opposite but never looked into it myself, good info thank you. I know they sell nitric oxide as a workout supplement would taking that not work better than the creme? I can't go any research atm so just thought I'd post the question for someone who may know.
 
^I don't know. It could be better, especially orally. It's sold as a weightlifting supplement to help getting lifters get "pumped," so I assume it works. I like the idea of the creme because it allows targeted vasodilation rather than generalized, and generalized vasodilation can result in headaches (cluster headaches are treated, theoretically, by the long term vasoconstrictive effects of LSD, so they're, again theoretically, the result of vasodilated blood vessels putting pressure on nerves). I assume the l-arginine cremes are somewhat targeted in their application because they're sold to, for example, help warm up feet. I'm not sure if nitric oxide is absorbed as well as l-arginine is transdermally or not. I assume they'd sell nitric oxide creme instead of l-arginine creme if it was more effective transdermally.
 
Well, I took my own advice and bought some l-arginine transdermal creme. I rubbed it into my neck, shoulders, and lower back before dosing a combination of 2-FMA and 2C-C earlier and so far I'm feeling none of the tension I associate with vasoconstriction mediated by psychedelics and amphetamines. The creme can be bought in the "diabetic" section of most convenience stores. As a poly-drug recreationist I want to acknowledge my dept of gratitude to the diabetic community:between your syringes and foot cremes your chronic suffering has never made the life of the armchair chemical enthusiast more convenient. Thank you.
 
psood0nym said:
As a poly-drug recreationist I want to acknowledge my dept of gratitude to the diabetic community:between your syringes and foot cremes your chronic suffering has never made the life of the armchair chemical enthusiast more convenient. Thank you.
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=D If only they knew.
 
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