News Contaminated cocaine kills 20, puts 74 in hospital in Argentina

Atomic_Decay

Atomic_Decay

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Contaminated cocaine kills 20, puts 74 in hospital in Argentina

Rodrigo Abd
ABC
3 Feb 2022

Authorities are searching for the remainder of an apparently adulterated batch of cocaine that killed 20 people and seriously sickened 74 others in Buenos Aires.

Experts were still analysing the drug to determine what was in it that caused the deaths.

Judicial officials said one hypothesis being considered was that the cocaine was intentionally adulterated as part of a settling of scores between traffickers.
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Read the full article here.
 
The practice of adding opioids to cocaine appears to be spreading. I do not know if carfentanil is legally controlled in Argentina, but apart from being illegal, it should be on schedule 1 of the Chemical Warfare Convention.
 
Feretile said:
I do not know if carfentanil is legally controlled in Argentina, but apart from being illegal, it should be on schedule 1 of the Chemical Warfare Convention.
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can i ask why you think tougher scheduling will do anything to increase the safety of this drug? or rather, do you think labeling it a chemical weapon will do anything to reduce the harm of the drug?
 
thegreenhand said:
can i ask why you think tougher scheduling will do anything to increase the safety of this drug? or rather, do you think labeling it a chemical weapon will do anything to reduce the harm of the drug?
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Because it's synthetically VERY hard to make. Unlike the other, simple (far less potent) fentanyl analogues. It's actual potency varies hugely from one individual to another so you cannot even isolate an appropriate dosing schedule. I should also add that it isn't like I am the first to suggest that it be classed as a chemical weapon. If it was scheduled, nobody able to make it would make it.
 
i don’t know much about synthesis so i’ll take your word for it.

regardless, i think manufacturers will find a way if they want. or they will turn to other, potentially more dangerous drugs. the ‘nitazenes’ are an example of this.

you say “If it was scheduled, nobody able to make it would make it.”

this hasn’t really happened for any other scheduled drugs so i don’t see why this one would be different
 
I think you need to read the CWC. People manufacturing precursors and even pre-precursors need a licence and all sales need end-user licences. Yes, it's possible to get around, but AFAIK only 1 group that had 22 pHd level chemists ever produced a compound listed by the CWC.

I do not believe that the carfentaniil occasionally encountered was produced illegally. It made legally and sold through nations with weak legal controls. Such nations would no longer be able to order the stuff.

At the end of the day, it's also not the CHEAPEST opioid, even with that potency. It's just a different kind of criminal activity. A minor branch that it is possible to impact.
 
Feretile said:
I think you need to read the CWC. People manufacturing precursors and even pre-precursors need a licence and all sales need end-user licences. Yes, it's possible to get around, but AFAIK only 1 group that had 22 pHd level chemists ever produced a compound listed by the CWC.

I do not believe that the carfentaniil occasionally encountered was produced illegally. It made legally and sold through nations with weak legal controls. Such nations would no longer be able to order the stuff.

At the end of the day, it's also not the CHEAPEST opioid, even with that potency. It's just a different kind of criminal activity. A minor branch that it is possible to impact.
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Shops like this exit¥.. one stop shop for adulterants and some precursors as well. Look at the claims about clearing customs.

https://www.echemi.com/produce/pr21...th-safe-delivery-9999-white-powder-mulei.html

If you shut them down.. hope you do.. but then the profit driven corruption of the black market will persevere.
 
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The value of a cut is very low - lots of suppliers will resend cheap stuff because they add extra for the cases in which it is seized. It's the active I am discussing and that can be made impractical to obtain. My experience with CWC schedule 2 compounds (precursors with multiple uses) shows how difficult it is. In the end, we used something else. To buy in we needed a licence, they needed a licence to sell it to us and the particular transaction is recorded and the movement of the chemical tracked.
 
Feretile said:
I think you need to read the CWC. People manufacturing precursors and even pre-precursors need a licence and all sales need end-user licences. Yes, it's possible to get around, but AFAIK only 1 group that had 22 pHd level chemists ever produced a compound listed by the CWC.

I do not believe that the carfentaniil occasionally encountered was produced illegally. It made legally and sold through nations with weak legal controls. Such nations would no longer be able to order the stuff.

At the end of the day, it's also not the CHEAPEST opioid, even with that potency. It's just a different kind of criminal activity. A minor branch that it is possible to impact.
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Sorry for the late reply, I’ve been on a trip this weekend

I see your point about the manufacture if it was listed on the CWC

I guess my concern is more so that if this drug somehow does end up in the hands of a drug user they will then be subject to even worse punishment than usual for drugs.

Now of course this could be avoided by legalizing opioids people actually want but morally I can’t agree with further criminalization of any psychoactive substance.

Your point is well taken though. I readily admit my position is more of a philosophical one than one based on knowledge of the synthesis
 
Feretile said:
I think you need to read the CWC. People manufacturing precursors and even pre-precursors need a licence and all sales need end-user licences. Yes, it's possible to get around, but AFAIK only 1 group that had 22 pHd level chemists ever produced a compound listed by the CWC.

I do not believe that the carfentaniil occasionally encountered was produced illegally. It made legally and sold through nations with weak legal controls. Such nations would no longer be able to order the stuff.

At the end of the day, it's also not the CHEAPEST opioid, even with that potency. It's just a different kind of criminal activity. A minor branch that it is possible to impact.
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I just read it. Thanks
 
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The problem has always been with VERY high potency opioids is actually calculating it's potency. The CIs are generally too large. It's only accepted use is the immobilisation of large mammals such as elephants.

I have always been dubious of anything much > than x10M because unless it's going to arrive as accurately manufactured dose units of a very pure compound, it's too easy to OD. I'm also amazed by the greed involved. If 50% pure H sells at £50/g, it seems to me that costs do not decrease drastically when you get to >x10 M.

I know people do, but I do not even know how much a Kg of say U47700 wholesales for. It's made in 1 step from 2 commercially available chemicals so I think it cost about £4700/Kg in 2011.
 
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