Codeine and CWE Megathread - The long awaited!

[drug_mentor]

Haha I have been thrown out of that chain but it is odd where you are 3 stores link databases because theres two near me that share staff and even they don't seem to cotton onto it too often. I do agree that in general they are cunts for getting anything though, only place to ask me for ID buying Restavit and the cunts have done it to me twice.

 

[tyrael]

#1 I use scolding hot water for the sake of speed....

....Paracetamol, or APAP is more soluble the warmer the water is. That is why people do COLD water extractions....

Take heed from us regular BLers (read: been doing this [CWE/extractions] a lot longer then most posting!

The "cold" ("cold" being anywhere from tap temperature to a bottle being left in the fridges for a while) reference in a CWE - from my prospective is two hold;

1. Heat - Yes, you maybe a few 10/20/30 degrees understand what's stated in text books for the breakdown of Codeine .... doesn't mean you're still doing damage to the molecule!).

And 2. APAP (paracetamol for us Aussies ) is (a lot in my experience) more water soluble the greater the temperature solution's is increased. However I assume (multiple) filtering should help combat this.

^ You have to give your details here in QLD, but a lot of places will just get you to write them down instead of asking for ID. If they are really suspicious of your codeine purchasing then they will ask for ID.

^ Nor in SA. I've never actually been asked for ID, there are two pharmacies that occasionally ask for my details if I've been going there too often, but they don't check them against my ID so I could just lie (though I don't bother).

+1 brother! Tbh I think a lot (all?) comes back down to your demeanor/attitude (additionally re the police snipper dogs, but don't want to hijack this thread! :D ) with the pharmacist/sales clerk!!!

Just tell them u have no ID and if they arnt willing to give it to u then say "Im going elsewhere, plenty of chemists around, ur loss not mine" and walk out. Ive done it before....

+++++1. The requirement of taking down customer details are done so on a chemist-by-chemist bases - (afaik, and correct me if I'm wrong) there is is no law stating all chemists/pharmacists must record PT details for S3 drugs! Hence, you are not obliged/legally required to hand over such information. If you do, is it also most definitely within your write to question and the clerk (truthfully) reply with what your information will be used for, how it will be stored and the like. In the end, it is YOU information!

[Tbh, this information can be carried across to any business - if any business keeps a record of you (you're personal details) you are completely entitled to have complete access to said file. would think LE would be an exception however! ]

I know for sure in SA you don't. Tbh I've noticed in SA they are very quite inconsistent in re-enforcing sched. 3 drugs and requesting ID. Never requested for ???+codine however have a few times for +DXM products. I guess DXM could have greater negative physical effects, as a posed (not including the 10-14% of the population how are deficient in CYP2D6 of course) codeine? Yet codeine has a mentally/physically addictive potential....stange!

Just because it hasnt happened doesnt mean it wont. IMO it can happen its just a matter of time, same like with Pseudo. Computers tracking u isnt fun.

^ Well they are still OTC now .... will keep an eye on the emails I get from the TGA and see if anything comes up.

Well done fellas! Personally (unfortunately!! ) I could easily see the way of +codeine OTC meds taking the same route as the pseudo path! However, I really don't think it would have much of a differences ..... did it effect the pseudo-based meth coming out?

What makes you say that? The amount of pills/APAP doesn't affect the solubility of APAP, in theory you should be getting the same amount whether you extract from 5 grams or 25 (to my understanding)....

Hey Crankinit, I would agree ..... to a certain point. Basic chem tells that a solvent (H2O in this case) does have a maximum loading to absorb the introduced solute (codeine/APAP) - so there would be a maximum loading point for the solvent to absorb the APAP/Codeine . [sorry, that's as far as my brain is gonna tax me at this time of night! i need brush up on my chem anyhow soon! )

 

[tyrael]

I hate all the exscuses these pharmacists come up with for not selling me codeine....I then get a 'I"m sorry sir, we have a policy of only selling 1 codeine containing product per 3O days and you've already made a purchase' . Policy what fucking policy????....

Tbh, as much as it does piss you (us! ) off, think of it from their point of view, the pharmacists/sales clerk are really only follow legislation - legislation clearly not passed by them - first word of advice .... chill! Don't get angry at them since they're are - litereally - at the bottom of this (parama) food chain!

Well most of the time when I walk in to this chain of chemists and ask for panadeine they ask me for ID immediately , sometimes they try and be sneaky and ask for my details, THEN ASK FOR ID!! , in an attempt to catch me lying to them. Maybe i'll try the no-id approach, not like i'll be worse off.

Again, they're only doing their job!. From my experiences/can gather, the information gathered is only stored in a local database. Often if the stop is just like a corner, small pharmacy the database isn't share and all information is kept on site and not share (inter)nationally. Not 100% sure on the major chains (Chem+, National Pharmacies, etc) however. It wouldn't surprise me if they are linked Australia-wide (having said that I've never been asked at these major chains in SA).

 

[tyrael]

One last thing, apologies of the excessive quoting. I don't get on here as much as I used to/would like these days so I'm usually a few days/week behind! >_< ^_^/

 

[brasil]

Brazil

Here in brazil is very easy to buy without prescription a remedy named "codein" wich contain, in it 60mgs of pure codeine phosfate in each pill. The box containing 30 pills of 60mgs(each), costs no more tham 40 us dollars. Brazil is a very nice place for precription pill lovers... .

 

[opi8]

More than a dollar a pill is a bit steep, but pure codeine tabs have always been better than CWE for me and I certainly wouldn't be complaining if the pure codeine tabs were available here OTC, even at that price.

 

[tyrael]

More than a dollar a pill is a bit steep, but pure codeine tabs have always been better than CWE for me and I certainly wouldn't be complaining if the pure codeine tabs were available here OTC, even at that price.

Ah, ah, ah! Of course, no comparison brother!

 

[bobbydarren]

Tbh, as much as it does piss you (us! ) off, think of it from their point of view, the pharmacists/sales clerk are really only follow legislation - legislation clearly not passed by them - first word of advice .... chill! Don't get angry at them since they're are - litereally - at the bottom of this (parama) food chain!

.

So far I"ve managed to neutralise any obvious annoyance with them, but I don't mind them choosing not to sell to me, it's just insulting me with their lies I'm not very tolerant off. There is no legislation or policy of selling 1 codeine containing product per 3O days. It's a lie. I know that, because I had bought 3-4 a month for the last 1 1/2 years. Yet I"m still told, 'this policy applies to everyone, not just you' . So I ask how long has this policy been in place. i'm told "we've always had this policy" . I say "ok... so you've always had this policy but rarely or never do you enforce it?" , to which i'm told "Oh no sir, this policy relates to all customers, only 1 codeine containing product per month"

I decided the person was either so ignorant as to believe this policy or such a bad liar he didn't realise what he was saying didn't make any sense, considering my near weekly purchases for the last couple of years. Anyway just having a whinge, I don't need to patronage their stores. [but if i did i'd be fucked]

 

[tyrael]

....
I decided the person was either so ignorant as to believe this policy or such a bad liar he didn't realise what he was saying didn't make any sense, considering my near weekly purchases for the last couple of years.....

Couldn't agree more. Maybe splitting hairs here however, but if it's the store's policy - that is, not legislation - they are in the end a business and hence are able to chose to who, of what, and of which quantity they sell**.

If however they say it's law, I would think they would (or should have to?) provide evidence as to why they're not willing to provide you with the medication you require!

To be honest though, I'm pretty confident that for (equal to or less than) schedule 3-type drugs the whether they are sold (at all) or in which quantities is completely up to the pharmacist discretion.

I think the best person to speak to here on BL maybe Mr_Blonde. Possible give him a PM if it's irking you that much!

 

[tyrael]

Sorry, re-read ya post!

While I believe this ......

There is no legislation or policy of selling 1 codeine containing product per 3O days.

I don't believe you can say the below is true purely based on the below!

It's a lie. I know that, because I had bought 3-4 a month for the last 1 1/2 years./QUOTE]

Like I said, it's probably that specifics (or that chains) "policy" and (afaik) as long as a store's policy/conditions of entry/requirements/what ever don't try to circumvent any state/federal law then upon entering said venue you agree to these conditions.

 

[S.M.F.G]

The OTC preperations have gone to shit IMO, theyve fucked with the binders or something i dunno but have had no great results with anything Like 500mg paracetamol 8mg codeine boxes, takes forever and just gunks up too much. There are 15mg codiene 500mg paracetimol tabs available in a box of 24, they are only slightly better. Only good results (crystal clear and left sit overnight) are with 30mg codiene 500mg para tabs and they require a script
one sheet = 300 mg codiene an if tolerence has gone back down, have no problems just dropppin 150 mg worth without extraction, Probably not a good idea all the time, but im not doin that much these days
But all the weaker codiene/ para brands.... Gone to utter shit

 

[pinkanga]

Dont know if I agree with that. Just dont do 40 in the one extraction... that is indeed messy and annoying. I do two glasses with 20 in each. Use a shirt then refilter with a coffee filter. I still get decent results.

 

[bobbydarren]

Sorry, re-read ya post!

While I believe this ......



I don't believe you can say the below is true purely based on the below!

It's a lie. I know that, because I had bought 3-4 a month for the last 1 1/2 years./QUOTE]

Like I said, it's probably that specifics (or that chains) "policy" and (afaik) as long as a store's policy/conditions of entry/requirements/what ever don't try to circumvent any state/federal law then upon entering said venue you agree to these conditions.

They're still lying to me though. Might be a policy for junkies, but i'm told it applies to everyone, and always has. I prefer good old honesty. I got banned from buying a cough medicine from a different store. Pharmacist just came out with the truth, says i've been buying this weekly and as the product is often abused he'd require that I bring in a prescription if I need it in the future, after selling me the product one last time for good will sake.

I mean if people think i'm a junkie, and guess as much I dont' have any ill will towards them if they'd be straight up like that guy was. Making shit up as to why they can't sell it to me [yet pretend they want to , i'ts just well.. they can't] if a cop out for cowardly staff.

 

[Mr Blonde]

To be honest though, I'm pretty confident that for (equal to or less than) schedule 3-type drugs the whether they are sold (at all) or in which quantities is completely up to the pharmacist discretion.

Emphasis mine. There are certain medications that are S3 for only certain quantities, and are considered S4 if sold in a higher amount. This doesn't stop some pharmacists from doing so anyway though.

The OTC preperations have gone to shit IMO, theyve fucked with the binders or something i dunno but have had no great results with anything Like 500mg paracetamol 8mg codeine boxes, takes forever and just gunks up too much.

I don't know if I agree with that either... I use a ridiculous amount of my CWE's due to tolerance and don't have a problem.

Unless they are fucking tabsules, in which case I need to thermite the motherfuckers before trying to dissolve them.

They're still lying to me though. Might be a policy for junkies, but i'm told it applies to everyone, and always has. I prefer good old honesty. I got banned from buying a cough medicine from a different store. Pharmacist just came out with the truth, says i've been buying this weekly and as the product is often abused he'd require that I bring in a prescription if I need it in the future, after selling me the product one last time for good will sake.

Some pharmacists will make arrangements with customers who have a legitimate need for long term use of an S3 product. For example, I knew at least two people who needed to use pseudoephedrine quite often for treating congestion related to nasal polyps. They had a deal with the pharmacist, where they would get it once a week and on the fourth week of the month they would need a prescription for it so that the pharmacy could show this to the Pseudoephedrine Taskforce should they start asking questions. One of them also had a copy of her sinus x-rays and a letter from her doctor on file at the pharmacy, mainly used if there was a locum pharmacist on who didn't know what the deal was.

 

[Jakeperson]

Any tips on evaporating a CWE?

 

[Mr Blonde]

^ Low heat, use a fan if needed, best option is to do an acid/base and evaporate it out of a solvent like chloroform (if you have the capacity to deal with solvents like this).

 

[pinkanga]

So tabsules are no good? Ive never got them but always seen them there near the other meds... I assumed:

1. that tabsules is just a stupid name for a capsule that is shaped like a tablet. (never really understood the point of them existing at all.
2. if I was to be given a tabsules box of panadeine on some occasion then this wouldnt be a problem as the water-based gel stuff they use to make capsuls breaks down instantly in a glass of water.... so this would be the case with tabsules.
3. that assumptions 1 and 2 are accurate.

[this is the crap that goes through my head sometimes when Im not confident about visiting a chemist I was at maybe < 2wks ago.... and Im trying to appear all business like in work get-up).

So anyway, are my assumptions not correct?

 

[Jakeperson]

I used water, took 3 days with no fan.

Pretty sure it's fucked though because my last 3 coffee filters broke.
There's meant to be 1.5g of codeine there but I reckon I would have lost .5g due to my shitty extraction skills, so I'm gonna scrape it all up tomorrow or later and see what it weighs to determine my ratio.

 

[Mr Blonde]

So tabsules are no good? Ive never got them but always seen them there near the other meds... I assumed:

1. that tabsules is just a stupid name for a capsule that is shaped like a tablet. (never really understood the point of them existing at all.
2. if I was to be given a tabsules box of panadeine on some occasion then this wouldnt be a problem as the water-based gel stuff they use to make capsuls breaks down instantly in a glass of water.... so this would be the case with tabsules.
3. that assumptions 1 and 2 are accurate.

[this is the crap that goes through my head sometimes when Im not confident about visiting a chemist I was at maybe < 2wks ago.... and Im trying to appear all business like in work get-up).

So anyway, are my assumptions not correct?

Sorry comrade, I forgot to say I was talking about CO tabsules. They are the worst for dissolving and become this sludge like mess that goes everywhere if you aren't careful. Other tabsules I have had no problems with, it's just certain brands that aren't great. Weird, because CO tablets are fantastic.

 

[S.M.F.G]

Dont know if I agree with that. Just dont do 40 in the one extraction... that is indeed messy and annoying. I do two glasses with 20 in each. Use a shirt then refilter with a coffee filter. I still get decent results.

Shit that really never even entered my mind... Prolly coz its been hell ages since ive neded to buy otc
still have to vouch for those 15 mg / 500mg tabs over the weaker ones, and have never had good results putting it thru a shirt first, it seems when ive done that the initial filter is cloudy as allshit and the coffee filters just drip the cloudy solution thru, i wont gulp it unless its mega fucking clear, also i have learned the more you hurry it the worse off it is, i can wait 5 or 6 hrs or even overnight to attain the clear solution that i can be sure has the least ammount of para in it. I also always use a motar and pestle to grind thoughrouly, tollerence isnt shit compared to a few years ago when i was on poppyseeds & pods... cold water out of the fridge with a few ice cubes in it is also a must for me.

Tried evaporating it once but used an oven @ 80 degrees celcius... think i fucked it though coz the little powder i scraped outta the dish did nothing. I guess patience is key with evaporation