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Flower Cannabis sativa effects on sleep? Does no munchies mean less sleep?

elgoucho9

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So I've been back to enjoying my weed lately. Which has had many positive effects including appetite and muscle relaxation.

However the past few nights I've been fasting after dinner (to avoid the munchies but also I'm on a controlled diet), and having a few pipes.

I've noticed without any munchies I'm struggling to feel that tired before bed. And when I do head off to bed say 11.30pm - half past midnight, I only seem to stay asleep til around 5.30-6am? Prior to this phase i was sleeping 8-9hrs no problem.

I wouldn't mind but it's not convenient to be awake this early in my household. Also I'm starting a new job soon that's predominantly night hours.
 
How does fasting avoid the munchies? Please tell me. The only real health hazard to pot for me is the munchies, but that's a significant one.
 
Your smoking a sativa and your wondering why your not able to sleep? ..
I was wondering if the "Sativa" in the title was the point.
Myself, I get the munchies and sleepy on Sativa too. I just get them later. Initially, I'm more awake than on an Indica. Not wide awake, just a lot more awake.
But, later on in the high, I still get sleepy and tired feeling. Smoking more Sativa will wake me up, but that effect lasts a shorter and shorter time each time.

Maybe get a good buzz going a couple hours before bed and then do not top up the high?

Biggest difference in a Sativa for me is that the high feels more "floaty" or "psychedelic". Not well described, but maybe you get the point. :cool:
 
Despite the popular stoner lore that cannabis helps sleep science has shown cannabis users have worse sleep and more insomnia

All those but one were about either treating insomnia with cannabis or insomnia from cannabis withdrawal.

Quality of sleep might suffer, as it does with alcohol and as it does with any other sleep aid.
So, "worse sleep", maybe. Not "more insomnia".

In my case, and the case of anyone I've ever known, pot helps me get to sleep, I sleep longer, my sleep isn't quite as restful per hour slept, and I have trouble sleeping if I don't have pot.
 
All those but one were about either treating insomnia with cannabis or insomnia from cannabis withdrawal.

Quality of sleep might suffer, as it does with alcohol and as it does with any other sleep aid.
So, "worse sleep", maybe. Not "more insomnia".

In my case, and the case of anyone I've ever known, pot helps me get to sleep, I sleep longer, my sleep isn't quite as restful per hour slept, and I have trouble sleeping if I don't have pot.
That’s just one study you can look up others with the exact parameters you are interested in. Overall cannabis users have more sleep pathology and difficulty sleeping.

It’s lowers ratio of REM sleep/ vs all sleep very significantly.


Even if you end up sleeping more hours it’s not as restorative sleep.

Personally cannabis gives me insomnia if used in the evening for the first time of the day
 
i thought maybe weed was making me sleep longer and giving me less rest until i had to go to the psychward for three months.. i'm actually super grateful they let me not try any meds for a whole month so i could see what no pot was like. i would still sleep like 12 hours a day and i would pretty much feel the same except for i'd get anxiety which i had a ton of before smoking weed... must be different effects for different people.
 
That’s just one study you can look up others with the exact parameters you are interested in. Overall cannabis users have more sleep pathology and difficulty sleeping.

It’s lowers ratio of REM sleep/ vs all sleep very significantly.


Even if you end up sleeping more hours it’s not as restorative sleep.

Personally cannabis gives me insomnia if used in the evening for the first time of the day
No, all but one of the articles you cited were about treating insomnia with weed or insomnia from weed withdrawal.

Yes, quality of sleep suffers as from any sleep aid. So, sleep pathology maybe, but again, difficulty sleeping, no.
Cannabis users having more insomnia in anything other than withdrawal from it in most people is something I might argue.
Yeah, maybe the first buzz of the day and immediately trying to sleep. An hour later, no.
 
i should edit my post saying i was taking ativan with my experiences not sleeping with weed, so i really have no opinion on this. it's pretty much impossible for me to sleep on a regular schedule with out weed though. my body will goes days at a time with out sleep unless i have weed or a benzo. my body has kind of been doing this since i was a teen. i'm not sure if drugs started it. but it started before i was using weed... maybe it's natural for some people. i dunno. sleeping every 2 or three days. not a habbit i really like to get into. i'll take sleep aids and enjoy my time away from reality sleeping. lol
 
I was wondering if the "Sativa" in the title was the point.
Myself, I get the munchies and sleepy on Sativa too. I just get them later. Initially, I'm more awake than on an Indica. Not wide awake, just a lot more awake.
But, later on in the high, I still get sleepy and tired feeling. Smoking more Sativa will wake me up, but that effect lasts a shorter and shorter time each time.

Maybe get a good buzz going a couple hours before bed and then do not top up the high?

Biggest difference in a Sativa for me is that the high feels more "floaty" or "psychedelic". Not well described, but maybe you get the point. :cool:
Sativa in any form effects me much the same. I went on an Indica kick for a spell but overall Sativa works best for me it seems If I have things to get done about the spread with Sativa I can do those chores with a smile and life is good. In the evening If I want to stay up for a bit maybe watch a movie or somee such I'm just relaxed but not plumb pure dee STONED ya know. LOL good Indica I like if I'm laid up hurting and just need to rest. I can make it work with creative activity or chores but I'm a helluva lot slower and nowhere near as motivated.

I don't smoke much anymore. I've discovered RSO. It doesn't hit as quick but it lasts forever it's not as messy and its way easier to just do the dose rather than rolling/packing. No smell no fuss no muss. I love the stuff. A gram yube of it lasts me about 4-5 days. More if I don't use any but in the evening. But with the Sativa I find that if I wanna just roll up and go to sleep it's no issue and I sleep through the night. I roll out when the sun starts coming up which is around 0500 these days. It's above the horizon at that time. I can generally bag from 2100 to 2200 till 0500 and I wake up rested.

It do take a little longer to nod off than with an Indica but I sure don't toss n turn at all. I haven't gotten the munchies from anything for a long time But that hasn't had any effect one way or the other on my sleepSmoking will give me the munchies but any more if I do get them I want real food. When I was younger I wanted the 2 pound back of M&Ms but now I want steak or chicken wings. For me Sativa is more of a "head high" whereas Indica effects my whole body. I just started using cannabis again about 8 or 9 months ago. Regularly anyway. I use it as a medication supplement pretty much.

I have severe chronic pain issues which I have a prescription med for that's wonderful stuff. i've figured out a combined dose of it and the RSO that works for any activity or lack thereof I have in mind. It loosens and makes my joints feel warm and flexible I feel relaxed and totally coherent in my thoughts and overall just way gooder. Hybrid strains are good as well. I'm still not used to being able to just roll the 1/4 mile to the weed shop and pick from so many products. I had to spend a bit to find what I like but having options is great. sheesh we had to make our own edibles back in the day a process for which I have developed a killer recipe for brownies. But RSO is now my preferred manner of indulgence. I don't drink and outside my prescription I don't use anything "harder" than my combo I've worked out.

I've found for me sativa or hybrid are the critters that work for me. Oh...and all three work really well for nausea on me. That's an added benefit which I have needed a few times over the last 8 or 9 months. I'm pretty happy my state legalized the stuff.
 
I don't find sativa's like fifty fifty hybridy to cause alertness, I probably could go to sleep smoking a sixty forty , seventy thirty or even a hundred percent like green crack, or Durban poison, but why would I want to?

If it's all that's available, then Probably best to smoke it four hours or less before sleep. Six hours or less is probably more desirable for sleep.

As far as muchies, I don't think sativa stimulates that part of the brain. I think it's indica, or another cannabinoid(s).
 
i recently purchased some cbn hash and i can confirm something about it that it increases my length of REM Sleep and i dream a bit (i never usually remember any dreams in all honesty i think i dont usually reach that deep a sleep to have dreams)
In my area sativa dominant strains are way more common and i never found weed around where i live to help me sleep at all, where as when i grew northern lights in the past well lets just say that month after id harvested i slept every night
Interestingly enough the cbn hash appears to give me munchies
 
Your smoking a sativa and your wondering why your not able to sleep? ..
To be fair it's probably just sativa dominant. Everything is so hybridized it's like 5050 or 6040 for many. I've had pure indicas that made me extremely stimulated and euphoric, I've had sativas that made me extremely tired. I think the terps matter the most. I often hit a Hawaiin pen, 100% sativa and still feel heavy body hghs.
 
i recently purchased some cbn hash and i can confirm something about it that it increases my length of REM Sleep and i dream a bit (i never usually remember any dreams in all honesty i think i dont usually reach that deep a sleep to have dreams)
I am not sure what we know on cannabis and sleep. A lot of stuff gets thrown at it. But I can say I still dream as a regular smoker. If I get woken up in the middle of one it is undeniable what the dream was. I think the recall of the dream is affected. Just last night I woke up in the middle of the night to pee. Was sort of awake. Took two pipe hits (blue dream and zoap mix) and went back to sleep. I can remember some of the dreams I had after that. So cannabis and REM sleep for sure needs more study. I think it is said to affect the lighter sleep, not the deep sleep we need. Of all the meds a person can take I would imagine cannabis is gentler on sleep cycles than say quetiapine or temazepam, etc.

Also the whole notion of sativa and indica is still not resonating with me. I have had peppy indicas and sleepy sativas too. I don't think any strain of cannabis would keep me awake. It all eventually puts me to sleep. I would love fully believing that sativas wake you up but indicas make you calm. That would be a great way to pick the next strain I would buy, or which one to use at different times. But even though I can feel differences in highs, I can from all batches, a sac of weed makes me hungry and sleepy no matter what type. THC itself can put me to sleep. Add in CBD and CBN then I am for sure sleeping.
 
The idea of “sativa vs indica” in cannabis is just marketing. It’s considered to be debunked by the scientific community, and not controversially. The people who still label their products as sativa or indica are just trying to get your money.

The most egregious example I’ve seen so far is a brand of edible that had a regular version and a “sleepy” version. The regular version was 10 mg THC and the sleepy version was 10 mg THC + 5 mg CBN. Because the latter one was supposed to be sleepy while the former one was not, they labeled them as “indica” and “sativa”, respectively. That’s it, that’s the entire difference, but they labeled it that because that’s what people know and they want their products to sell.

This is from an interview with the widely respected cannabis scientist Dr. Ethan Russo:

CCR: Some users describe the psychoactive effects of Cannabis indica and sativa as being distinctive, even opposite. But are they really? Beyond self-reports from users, is there any hard evidence for pharmacologically different species of Cannabis?

Dr. Russo: There are biochemically distinct strains of Cannabis, but the sativa/indica distinction as commonly applied in the lay literature is total nonsense and an exercise in futility. One cannot in any way currently guess the biochemical content of a given Cannabis plant based on its height, branching, or leaf morphology. The degree of interbreeding/hybridization is such that only a biochemical assay tells a potential consumer or scientist what is really in the plant. It is essential that future commerce allows complete and accurate cannabinoid and terpenoid profiles to be available.

CCR: Sativa is often described as being uplifting and energetic, whereas indica as being relaxing and calming. Can you speculate on what could be the basis for these perceived differences?

Dr. Russo: We would all prefer simple nostrums to explain complex systems, but this is futile and even potentially dangerous in the context of a psychoactive drug such as Cannabis. Once again, it is necessary to quantify the biochemical components of a given Cannabis strain and correlate these with the observed effects in real patients. Beyond the increasing number of CBD predominant strains in recent years, almost all Cannabis on the market has been from high-THC strains. The differences in observed effects in Cannabis are then due to their terpenoid content, which is rarely assayed, let alone reported to potential consumers. The sedation of the so-called indica strains is falsely attributed to CBD content when, in fact, CBD is stimulating in low and moderate doses! Rather, sedation in most common Cannabis strains is attributable to their myrcene content, a monoterpene with a strongly sedative couch-lock effect that resembles a narcotic. In contrast, a high limonene content (common to citrus peels) will be uplifting on mood, while the presence of the relatively rare terpene in Cannabis, alpha-pinene, can effectively reduce or eliminate the short-term memory impairment classically induced by THC.2,8

CCR: How do you think one could address the sativa/indica dichotomy in a scientifically sound manner?

Dr. Russo: Since the taxonomists cannot agree, I would strongly encourage the scientific community, the press, and the public to abandon the sativa/indica nomenclature and rather insist that accurate biochemical assays on cannabinoid and terpenoid profiles be available for Cannabis in both the medical and recreational markets. Scientific accuracy and the public health demand no less than this.

Like Dr. Russo, I also think we’ll be better off when people abandon these terms and just start focus on the explicit chemical profiles.
 
The idea of “sativa vs indica” in cannabis is just marketing. It’s considered to be debunked by the scientific community, and not controversially. The people who still label their products as sativa or indica are just trying to get your money.

The most egregious example I’ve seen so far is a brand of edible that had a regular version and a “sleepy” version. The regular version was 10 mg THC and the sleepy version was 10 mg THC + 5 mg CBN. Because the latter one was supposed to be sleepy while the former one was not, they labeled them as “indica” and “sativa”, respectively. That’s it, that’s the entire difference, but they labeled it that because that’s what people know and they want their products to sell.

This is from an interview with the widely respected cannabis scientist Dr. Ethan Russo:



Like Dr. Russo, I also think we’ll be better off when people abandon these terms and just start focus on the explicit chemical profiles.
Um, guy.

"The degree of interbreeding/hybridization is such that only a biochemical assay tells a potential consumer or scientist what is really in the plant."

The specific stuff on terpenes was very interesting. And do agree with...

"insist that accurate biochemical assays on cannabinoid and terpenoid profiles be available for Cannabis in both the medical and recreational markets. Scientific accuracy and the public health demand no less than this."

Then we could get a handle on what actually causes the difference in effects. Right now, Sativa and Indica is all we got.

JackARoe, ya, no pot really wakes me up. some certainly makes me less sleepy. Sativa, to me, gives something Indica does not. Indica gives a syrupy body high. Feels good, like you're wrapped in a warm blanket. But something is missing. Sativa gives that floatey space between thoughts where you expect to hear any second, "Bing, bing, bing. Space, the final frontier. These are the voyages...". You get the picture. That shit's what I started getting high for when it was all Sativa.
 
Um, guy.

"The degree of interbreeding/hybridization is such that only a biochemical assay tells a potential consumer or scientist what is really in the plant."

The specific stuff on terpenes was very interesting. And do agree with...

"insist that accurate biochemical assays on cannabinoid and terpenoid profiles be available for Cannabis in both the medical and recreational markets. Scientific accuracy and the public health demand no less than this."

Then we could get a handle on what actually causes the difference in effects. Right now, Sativa and Indica is all we got.

It’s not, though. Where I live - and cannabis is legal - every strain is explicitly labeled with all of the terpenes with the highest quantities in them. I feel bad for anyone who doesn’t have access to this as I didn’t until I moved here a couple months ago, but that doesn’t mean this kind of information isn’t available these days. It’s the illogical drug laws that are holding back people from having access to it.

This is what cannabis labels look like where I live:

[snip]

Everyone would have access to this these days if people would just make cannabis legal everywhere already.

That interview I posted is also seven years old. Here’s an excerpt from an article from last year about a research group exploring the suppose differences between sativa and indica:

If labels describing cannabis strains do in fact represent two distinct groups of cannabis, then the differences should be reflected by chemical and genetic differences. Our study, published in Nature Plants, found that indica and sativa labels are largely meaningless.

It was frequently the case that strains labelled indica were just as closely related to strains labelled sativa as they were to other strains labelled indica.

An example that illustrates the inconsistent use of these labels is that in 1999, a cannabis strain named “AK 47” won the Sativa Cup in the Cannabis Cup. The same strain went on to win the Indica Cup in the same competition four years later.

I too once differentiated between my strains as sativa and indica, as I assume most of us did at one point, but the science is clear. It’s an old system that didn’t really work the way it was assumed to and has been superseded by actually accurate scientific research. Again I realize not everyone has access to cannabis like I do now with this kind of labeling, but that just means we need to keep working towards legalization.
 
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@brokedownpalace10

I’m not trying to say that anyone’s observations on the differences between the effects of cannabis they had sold to them as “sativa” vs ones they had sold to them as “indica” are wrong, by the way. And anyone who lives in the same area is probably largely getting the same stuff and having similar results and creating more robust local opinions too. The effects of cannabis do seem to differ from one batch to the next and I’m not trying to deny that, but if the science says that sativa and indica labels are largely meaningless and the results we see are most likely the result of something else just being conflated with this incorrect former concept, then personally it makes me want to abandon that former concept even if it seems like it may have worked before, because I’m not comfortable knowing that I’m personally giving into a confounding variable that doesn’t actually correlate rigidly with the qualities I’m looking for. It basically says to me that what I’ve noticed are not standard, objective patterns but just the subjective patterns I’ve personally encountered so far, which doesn’t really mean anything with respect to going forward. It has undermined my faith in the sativa and indica classifiers to the point that I would genuinely rather have nothing to work with than continue using that system, and I did for years up until a couple months ago when I finally moved somewhere cannabis is legal. But that’s just my opinion and how I decide to do things; others can have theirs as well and I’ll respect that, but I will still argue for my own.
 
Incidentally, I want to give an on-topic response too but I don’t think I actually understand the question….

@elgoucho9

Are you saying you used to snack at night after dinner while smoking and that’s what you’re abstaining from now? That alone would make it harder for me to fall asleep, just a little bit. Eating too much makes me tired but not in a pleasant way. I’m very familiar with the results of overeating while high on cannabis.

I find cannabis stimulating when it first kicks in so smoking it late at night and also fasting and doing other things that keep up your energy can make it harder for me to sleep. I tend to get these hypnagogic hallucinations as I jerk in and out of almost falling asleep but not really. It doesn’t take that long for me to eventually get tired though.
 
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