Can you eat TOO healthily...?

[masterglen]

Hey folks!

Due to problems with lactose, and all lactose substitutes (ie Soya, Rice et al) as well as calcium supplements (tough break I know), I've been trying to get all my calcium needs from natural foods. I.e. Veggies, fruits and grains.

I can post a diet plan if necassary, but most of it just includes the obvious sources; Quinoa, Bak Choi, Kale, infact most types of greens, and broccoli. Typical amounts I eat are usually just a cup of Greens, a cup of Broccoli, a cup and a half of Kale and a cup of Quinoa or sweet potato daily. The rest of my diet is normal normally.

Although when planning, it seems possible, the high amount required means I'm getting FAR more than the RDA of certain nutrients.

For instance; due to the amount of green veggies, the iron content, is almost 350% of the RDA, the copper content, almost 300% of the RDA. Vitamin B-6 often the same.

Of course I'm not eating anything over excessively. I simply eat a variety of green foods until I get to the 1000mg of calcium mark. But...

Is this detrimental to health? Will the body just eliminate what it doesn't need, if it has come from a food source? Can you eat TOO healthily? And if so, is there any way around this?

Thanks

 

[modern buddha]

Much like vitamins, if your body is receiving more minerals / vitamins than it needs, it's discarded through your excrement.

Some vitamins are able to be stored in the body (B vitamins, I believe), but I don't see your levels of vitamins being harmful.

 

[addictivepersona]

^ Not all vitamins/minerals are excreted--Some can build up to dangerous levels. And, just because a vitamin/nutrient is excreted doesn't mean it couldn't cause a problem on its way out. Kidney stones are a prime example of this, as some are due to an excessive amount of calcium in the body. I realize this isn't the case with you, OP, but that is why some people get kidney stones--Too much calcium.

The TUL (tolerable upper limit) to some nutrients are known. I personally don't know all of them off hand and could look them up in one of my textbooks for you, but I feel this site* would be much more beneficial to you since you can learn it yourself. The first part is about the terminology, but if you scroll down, there is a listing of nutrients. If you click on one of them, it takes you to a page that will outline numerous things about that nutrient, including its TUL.

Also, OP, some greens have too many either phytates or tannins to allow your body to properly absorb the iron, calcium, and other nutrients. One example of this is spinach--So while spinach itself has an excellent amount of iron, it is not of high biological value.

*Totally just noticed that site is not a US website. Oops. Here's the American dietary standards (go to page 3), since it varies per country, though not much.

 

[sarcophagus.heels]

Much like vitamins, if your body is receiving more minerals / vitamins than it needs, it's discarded through your excrement.

Some vitamins are able to be stored in the body (B vitamins, I believe), but I don't see your levels of vitamins being harmful.

What you need to watch out for are the fat-soluble vitamins. Water-soluble vitamins (vitamin C and the B vitamins) just get peed out if you take them in excess. Fat-soluble vitamins (A, D, E, K), and these are absorbed through the intestinal tract and stored in the body. You can get vitamin poisoning if your intake is way too high (and actually, I think this can also happen with some of the B vitamins, but it's mostly fat-soluble vitamins that'll do it).

You should be careful with the iron - too much iron is actually pretty bad for you, it leads to all sorts of health problems down the road. Free iron in your bloodstream can build up over the years and contribute to liver damage, heart disease, premature aging (the excess iron stimulates free radicals), etc. However, since you're getting your iron from veggies, it's less of a problem - you absorb a good deal less iron from veggies than you do from meat. But the upper limit for copper is wayyy higher than the recommended amount, so you should have no worries there.

 

[thujone]

Variety is the spice of life. If you grossly exceed the RDA for certain nutrients or vitamins then it's just as likely you're also grossly undershooting the RDA for others.

 

[addictivepersona]

^ When I've crunched the numbers with my diet, sometimes I'll have 300% of the RDI of certain nutrients and barely 60% of others (like calcium and vitamin D). With some diets, esp. alternative diets, it's tough to get a happy medium, even more so when you don't eat fortified foods.

 

[max_]

No amount of vegetables will be bad for you. You could cause a bad iron surplus by eating dietary sypplements, or enriched food like yoghurts or milk, THAT can lead to overdoing it. But think about it, it's food, good food. You are supposed to eat that.
As a side note, a doctor once told me (he was amazed 'cause he had just read it on a medical journal) that our kidneys work only at 1/6 of their actual capabilities because when we lived in the wild we needed a lot more filtering and cleansing than we need now.

 

[modern buddha]

I can see where everyone's getting their information, but I personally believe we need to know how much food OP is eating and if there's enough variety in order to judge it.

If you're a healthy weight, eat how much food your body needs to be healthy and don't eat the same shit every day, I'm sure you're fine. Just don't eat too much of any one food.

 

[masterglen]

Thanks for the input guys and gals, some good comments, as well as links.
Diet has always been a nightmare for me. I had an undiagnosed gluten intolerance until aged 21, so my stomach was shot to bits. I've been trying to find the path of least resistance eating wise, and have bad reactions to anything that isn't natural or easily digestable really (supplements, soya milk, even dairy)

My diet doesn't consist of eating the same thing, just vast amounts of certain categories.

E.g.
Day 1:

2 cup Pak Choi
3 cups Broccoli
2.5 cups lettuce
1 Cup Rocket leaves
.5 cup of Quinoa

Day 2:

600 grams of Kale
300 grams Mustard Greens
Salmon
2 cucumbers
Lettuce
0.5 cup Broccoli
Mustard Seed Cress

I'm getting plenty of good meats and grains to go with it (I just listed the main calcium vegetables) and my numbers suggest I'm meeting all RDA's, the worry is exceeding it. Obviously that many green vegetables contains lots of vitamin A and Iron. Vast amounts. I know this amount isn't good. The problem is getting calcium. I've tried supplements but find them so over-stimulating, and lactose and lactose substitutes are causing major digestive problems. I just want to give my stomach the chance to do some healing, and get some consistency.

After some consideration, constantly going well over 350% RDA of certain important nutrients isn't good, so I may have to look at other ways.

For now, I think I'll give supplementation another shot, perhaps after a while the over stimulating effect may wear a little. I'll try a different brand to see if it helps.

Again, much appreciated

 

[addictivepersona]

^ Have you tried black strap molasses or almonds? Black strap molasses packs a whopping 400mg in two tablespoons according to this.

If I remember on Friday, I'll ask two of my professors (who are RDs) about the whole issue--Forgot about it today.

 

[Clean_Cut]

If you are getting more than your RDA of certain nutrients, BUT they are all coming from plant sources...(as opposed to supplemental sources) I would not be worried. It is my understanding that while iron can be toxic when taken as a supplement, plant based iron is only selectively absorbed..i.e. they body only takes as much as it needs.

 

[Clean_Cut]

Also...go by how your body feels...if you feel good eating this many vegetables then keep doing it! If your that worried about specific levels...get a blood test to see whats being stored etc...thats what I have recently done.

Juicing vegetables has become extremely popular over the last few years so Im sure there are many people taking in just as large, if not more, vegetable material than yourself...

 

[delta_9]

No amount of vegetables will be bad for you.

Entirely false. Eating too many vegetables with crude fiber can quite easily lead to problems like indigestion. Vegetables with high levels of oxalic acid(spinach, tomato, etc.) can cause calculus(no not the math, you silly person ) as well.

...Just a few examples off the top of my head, but there are certainly more.

As is most often the case, moderation is the key.

It is my understanding that while iron can be toxic when taken as a supplement, plant based iron is only selectively absorbed

Indeed.
The iron found in animal foods is heme iron, while plants contain non-heme iron. Heme iron is absorbed better in the body.
However, iron can most certainly be toxic when consumed via food.

I've been trying to find the path of least resistance eating wise, and have bad reactions to anything that isn't natural or easily digestable really (supplements, soya milk, even dairy)

The body has no mechanism it can use to distinguish between a "natural" and "synthtic" vitamin/mineral/what have you. Whether you eat an orange or a vit c tablet it dosen't matter, either way you wont get scurvy