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Opioids Can anyone give tips on how to sleep during opiate/opioid withdrawal?

if its anything over "light withdrawal" sleep is not going to be possible for me because of the restless legs/body. I literally stayed awake for 30 straight nights (not exaggerating not one hour) from being on pods for 3 years followed by 7 years on subutex about five years back and thought I was gonna die it was a nightmare. I stupidly got back on sub 8 months ago but am tapering now. I have no advice on how to sleep but the one thing I will say is the worst thing you can do is try to force sleep and lay in bed kicking around. For me it was better to just accept the inevitable pain I was gonna go through and strap in and hold on for the ride and I wouldn't even try to get in bed and sleep after awhile I just tried to keep myself occupied the best I could and would have to switch positions from a rocking chair to the floor to the couch to a hot bath rinse and repeat over and over again it was brutal. Getting out of the house can help but is understandably hard to do. Just remember as shitty as it is now sleep will eventually come. You will feel like it will never happen but one day your body will just fall alseep from exhaustion and you'll wake up and from that point on you'll get a little more ever night IME. Exercise speeds along the process if you can get out and do some cardio.
 
Xanax/lorazepam not that much, they're sedatives but don't last as long. A longer acting one like clonazepam/diazepam, works better +they have muscle relaxant properties which is a fking godsend for the RLS.
I combine short acting and long acting. Short acting for the intense anxiety and to increase sedation; long acting to keep me sedated as long as possible.

Speaking from experience Valium/diazepam is overall better than clonazepam for physical symptoms and Ativan (lorazepam) for immediate physical sedation. Xanax seems like I still feel the physical, but helps with the sudden panic attacks and it's good to have a stash of it for those "fuck this" moments when you're about to call the plug.
 
if its anything over "light withdrawal" sleep is not going to be possible for me because of the restless legs/body. I literally stayed awake for 30 straight nights (not exaggerating not one hour) from being on pods for 3 years followed by 7 years on subutex about five years back and thought I was gonna die it was a nightmare. I stupidly got back on sub 8 months ago but am tapering now. I have no advice on how to sleep but the one thing I will say is the worst thing you can do is try to force sleep and lay in bed kicking around. For me it was better to just accept the inevitable pain I was gonna go through and strap in and hold on for the ride and I wouldn't even try to get in bed and sleep after awhile I just tried to keep myself occupied the best I could and would have to switch positions from a rocking chair to the floor to the couch to a hot bath rinse and repeat over and over again it was brutal. Getting out of the house can help but is understandably hard to do. Just remember as shitty as it is now sleep will eventually come. You will feel like it will never happen but one day your body will just fall alseep from exhaustion and you'll wake up and from that point on you'll get a little more ever night IME. Exercise speeds along the process if you can get out and do some cardio.
Completely on point. Obviously instincts tell you to just stay in bed and try to sleep as much as possible, but I find that once the RLS creepy crawlies have started you're pretty much fucked on sleep. The only thing you can do is accept that it is what it is and you wont be sleeping. You basically have to just get yourself to the point of pure exhaustion physically and force your body to pass out. Whether you do that with exercise or sedatives is entirely up to you, but just trying to get up and walk around a bit will help.

The problem is the mental side of things. You're anxious, depressed and craving. The only thing you can do to not feel those feelings are use or sleep, and the physical symptoms make half of those options not possible without meds to help with the symptoms.

I find Flexeril (cyclobenzaprine) to be a life saver when it comes to managing RLS with withdrawal, especially combined with long acting benzos. Its sedating as is, rather dissociative and its a skeletal muscle relaxer. About 20-40mg and your choice of benzo or z drugs like ambien and Lunesta WILL allow you to get SOME sleep even in the worst of the worst withdrawals.

I've never tried Lyrica but have found gabapentin to be fucking worthless but everyone is different. For me, I don't even like taking MAT tapers when detoxing because it just prolongs the healing of your brain and you experience intense cravings within a few days of getting off of them anyway and are more likely to relapse. Detox sucks no matter how you do it, but taking other opiates to treat opiate withdrawal just prolongs the inevitable. People wanna pretend subs/bupe are not as bad as Methadone but it truly is, if not worse.

All this is subjective at the end of the day and you gotta do what you gotta Do. Only you know your body's needs.
 
I'm not sure if phenibut has been mentioned, but it can give some relief from withdrawals. It is honestly kind of a shitty drug in that it takes 3+ hours to kick in, and the tolerance builds extremely fast. When you combine that with a duration of effects well over 24 hours, it basically means you shouldn't take it more than every third day or so, unless you want to have some level of physical dependence on it.

Phenibut is also pretty finicky as far as dosing goes. Some people take as little as a few hundred milligrams but generally doses are a couple grams. Some people take way more than that which is a massive mistake, but there is a relatively small window between "I can't really feel anything" and "spin up, throw up, puke up, pass out" (I can't stop hearing that on top of Swimming Pools by Kendrick Lamar, idk that's OCD),


Fortunately it's fairly cheap and legal in I believe 49 states, and is essentially treated like a supplement, but make no mistake; it can absolutely be harmful if not used correctly and will fuck your life up if you let it (as with a lot of things).

For a non drug alternative, are you familiar with "Binaural Beats"?
If you have a good set of headphones, this may be worth trying for you.
 
I'm not sure if phenibut has been mentioned, but it can give some relief from withdrawals. It is honestly kind of a shitty drug in that it takes 3+ hours to kick in, and the tolerance builds extremely fast. When you combine that with a duration of effects well over 24 hours, it basically means you shouldn't take it more than every third day or so, unless you want to have some level of physical dependence on it.

Phenibut is also pretty finicky as far as dosing goes. Some people take as little as a few hundred milligrams but generally doses are a couple grams. Some people take way more than that which is a massive mistake, but there is a relatively small window between "I can't really feel anything" and "spin up, throw up, puke up, pass out" (I can't stop hearing that on top of Swimming Pools by Kendrick Lamar, idk that's OCD),


Fortunately it's fairly cheap and legal in I believe 49 states, and is essentially treated like a supplement, but make no mistake; it can absolutely be harmful if not used correctly and will fuck your life up if you let it (as with a lot of things).

For a non drug alternative, are you familiar with "Binaural Beats"?
If you have a good set of headphones, this may be worth trying for you.

Almost thought you were referring to Phenobarbital; great for withdrawals tbh.

Is this a supplement or something natural?

I remember detoxing benzos my pheno dose was in the 3 digit MGs at first but you're talking about doses much closer to grams or actual gram doses so I assume this may be a precursor of some kind that's not as potent as Pharma grade Pheno but I'm not sure. Please elaborate of you will, I'm interested in this.

I have no experience with Phenibut and can't speak on it. Dosing kratom definitely helps with lighter habits but in my experience the natural remedies and OTC drugs are only effective for relatively mild withdrawals, even if they do feel "severe."

As my habit has grown and as I've aged I've found I really have 2 options when detoxing, those being I either sleep or I suffer. I lean HEAVILY on benzos for withdrawals as they're extremely simple to get scripts for in large amounts and o always have access to them.

My suggestion would be to get a long acting benzo and use it sparingly when possible, however of you're still struggling, take more. Fuck the instructions on the bottle. The prescriber likely didn't know you'd be using them for detox purposes or they'd likely never give em to you in the first place. Even of they "know" ot is for detox, as long as you tell them it's am anxiety issue they can prescribe. Explain you've been on them in the past and low dosages never worked and you are naturally tolerant to benzodiazepines and that you need a stronger dose than the standard starting dose for most people and you'll likely get it. I recommend seeing a psych who specialized in addiction and trauma therapies in order to acquire such a script. Do not get benzos off the street. Just. A slikwly to be pressed fakes as pxy these days amd it will defeat the point of using them for detox.j
 
Almost thought you were referring to Phenobarbital; great for withdrawals tbh.

Is this a supplement or something natural?

I remember detoxing benzos my pheno dose was in the 3 digit MGs at first but you're talking about doses much closer to grams or actual gram doses so I assume this may be a precursor of some kind that's not as potent as Pharma grade Pheno but I'm not sure. Please elaborate of you will, I'm interested in this.

I have no experience with Phenibut and can't speak on it. Dosing kratom definitely helps with lighter habits but in my experience the natural remedies and OTC drugs are only effective for relatively mild withdrawals, even if they do feel "severe."

As my habit has grown and as I've aged I've found I really have 2 options when detoxing, those being I either sleep or I suffer. I lean HEAVILY on benzos for withdrawals as they're extremely simple to get scripts for in large amounts and o always have access to them.

My suggestion would be to get a long acting benzo and use it sparingly when possible, however of you're still struggling, take more. Fuck the instructions on the bottle. The prescriber likely didn't know you'd be using them for detox purposes or they'd likely never give em to you in the first place. Even of they "know" ot is for detox, as long as you tell them it's am anxiety issue they can prescribe. Explain you've been on them in the past and low dosages never worked and you are naturally tolerant to benzodiazepines and that you need a stronger dose than the standard starting dose for most people and you'll likely get it. I recommend seeing a psych who specialized in addiction and trauma therapies in order to acquire such a script. Do not get benzos off the street. Just. A slikwly to be pressed fakes as pxy these days amd it will defeat the point of using them for detox.j
Detoxing in the hospital you would have been given phenobarbital. I understand this to be a relatively weak barbiturate.

Phenibut has been used clinically in the former Soviet Union for anxiety and sleep; I've read that they gave it to cosmonauts as well although I'm unsure if it was the more common HCL form.

As to it being natural or a supplement;

I'm not a chemistry guy, not at all, but it's an amino acid and a GABA analogue. I don't believe it's found in nature if that's what you're asking, but it can be easily found on google in less than a minute.

I just got a script for alprazolam, and even though I prefer clonazepam and I know we'll get there, I'm elated; having benzos around again, after ten years of not having them, is so good.
 
Detoxing in the hospital you would have been given phenobarbital. I understand this to be a relatively weak barbiturate.

Phenibut has been used clinically in the former Soviet Union for anxiety and sleep; I've read that they gave it to cosmonauts as well although I'm unsure if it was the more common HCL form.

As to it being natural or a supplement;

I'm not a chemistry guy, not at all, but it's an amino acid and a GABA analogue. I don't believe it's found in nature if that's what you're asking, but it can be easily found on google in less than a minute.

I just got a script for alprazolam, and even though I prefer clonazepam and I know we'll get there, I'm elated; having benzos around again, after ten years of not having them, is so good.
I wasn't in the hospital, but technically I was in a detox setting under doctor care. It was the only time I'd ever been given Pheno, and that shit can get you FUUUUUUCKED up if you're not tolerant to gaba agonists.

I think I've seen phenibut online in reseaech chem markets but can't say for sure. My guess is being its a gaba agonist, that solves the anxiety issues and being an amino a od as well likely provides some much needed amino acid to the muscles in the legs at high enough doses to trick them into thinking you just ran a marathon. That's just me throwing shit and hoping it sticks though, o couldn't say for sure why it works or of it would work for everyone but I'm glad it gets you through when you need it.

As for you're new script, I'm happy for you. It's really hard to get docs to give us scripts as addicts and we're often treated as med seekers (which we are, even if we're seeking them for a legitimate purpose they're meant to be used for) which results in multiple attempts to have you try anything pff label instead of an actual fuckin benzo for anxiety. It can be frustrating.

I too prefer clonazepam/klonopin to alprazolam/Xanax. MY psych initially had me on Valium 5mg 3x daily, but I always took extras and ran out early and leaned on my mom's klonopin stashes she'd save for me when I inevitably ran out early since she never took her shit..

What I ended up doing was telling my doctor that the Valium was giving Mr side effects, mainly extreme mood swings, which to some extent was true. The withdrawal definitely made me go into insane spirals of madness and blind rage on occasion. I asked him of it were possible to swotch to Kpins since they seemed to work better for me in the past and not have the same effect and he instantly switched me and upped my dose to exactly what I asked to be given, so that was nice.

If I were in your shoes, I'd schedule a follow up asap and tell the doctor this; "the Xanax works great when I'm having full on panic attacks but doesn't help me with my general anxiety throughout the day as a whole. Can you put me on Klonopin for generalized anxiety and give me a smaller dose of the Xanax for breakthrough anxiety/panic attacks? I get it if you're worried about combining the two meds but the Xanax by itself isn't controlling my anxiety and I feel like I'm counting the minutes until my next dose..."

Now, that may or may not work depending on your doctor's relationship with you and his prescribing practices but my psych and I have developed a good rapport and I'm very honest woth him about my history of addiction. I recently got a short term script on top of my klonopin for Ativan/lorazepam from him. It's all in how you approach it. If it seems like you're not open to trying any other medication besides benzos, they are less likely to give you what you actually want. In my experience doctors are now often underprescribing due to the prescription drug epidemic in the US and fear of losing their licenses and practice or want to try evened under the sign that is used off label as an anxiety med before giving you an actual narcotic anxiety med like a benzo, which is honestly rodoculous considering its only a schedule IV substance. It's a give and take with these fuckers and you almost have to play dumb to get them to give you what you want, as long as they think they're the one who made the decision to prescribe that specific med, you typically have to steer them towards the right script, but you'll get it.

DEAR Mods; I'm sorry in advance if this sort of conversation isn't allowed. I just made an account after years of being a lurker and I'm not up to date on all the rules as I've been away a while. For example, I remember back in the day people addressed themselves as SWIM for safety reasons and now that appears to be a dead practice. So sorry Ina dance if I can't give advice on how to get scripts, I just wanna help..
 
I wasn't in the hospital, but technically I was in a detox setting under doctor care. It was the only time I'd ever been given Pheno, and that shit can get you FUUUUUUCKED up if you're not tolerant to gaba agonists.

I think I've seen phenibut online in reseaech chem markets but can't say for sure. My guess is being its a gaba agonist, that solves the anxiety issues and being an amino a od as well likely provides some much needed amino acid to the muscles in the legs at high enough doses to trick them into thinking you just ran a marathon. That's just me throwing shit and hoping it sticks though, o couldn't say for sure why it works or of it would work for everyone but I'm glad it gets you through when you need it.

As for you're new script, I'm happy for you. It's really hard to get docs to give us scripts as addicts and we're often treated as med seekers (which we are, even if we're seeking them for a legitimate purpose they're meant to be used for) which results in multiple attempts to have you try anything pff label instead of an actual fuckin benzo for anxiety. It can be frustrating.

I too prefer clonazepam/klonopin to alprazolam/Xanax. MY psych initially had me on Valium 5mg 3x daily, but I always took extras and ran out early and leaned on my mom's klonopin stashes she'd save for me when I inevitably ran out early since she never took her shit..

What I ended up doing was telling my doctor that the Valium was giving Mr side effects, mainly extreme mood swings, which to some extent was true. The withdrawal definitely made me go into insane spirals of madness and blind rage on occasion. I asked him of it were possible to swotch to Kpins since they seemed to work better for me in the past and not have the same effect and he instantly switched me and upped my dose to exactly what I asked to be given, so that was nice.

If I were in your shoes, I'd schedule a follow up asap and tell the doctor this; "the Xanax works great when I'm having full on panic attacks but doesn't help me with my general anxiety throughout the day as a whole. Can you put me on Klonopin for generalized anxiety and give me a smaller dose of the Xanax for breakthrough anxiety/panic attacks? I get it if you're worried about combining the two meds but the Xanax by itself isn't controlling my anxiety and I feel like I'm counting the minutes until my next dose..."

Now, that may or may not work depending on your doctor's relationship with you and his prescribing practices but my psych and I have developed a good rapport and I'm very honest woth him about my history of addiction. I recently got a short term script on top of my klonopin for Ativan/lorazepam from him. It's all in how you approach it. If it seems like you're not open to trying any other medication besides benzos, they are less likely to give you what you actually want. In my experience doctors are now often underprescribing due to the prescription drug epidemic in the US and fear of losing their licenses and practice or want to try evened under the sign that is used off label as an anxiety med before giving you an actual narcotic anxiety med like a benzo, which is honestly rodoculous considering its only a schedule IV substance. It's a give and take with these fuckers and you almost have to play dumb to get them to give you what you want, as long as they think they're the one who made the decision to prescribe that specific med, you typically have to steer them towards the right script, but you'll get it.

DEAR Mods; I'm sorry in advance if this sort of conversation isn't allowed. I just made an account after years of being a lurker and I'm not up to date on all the rules as I've been away a while. For example, I remember back in the day people addressed themselves as SWIM for safety reasons and now that appears to be a dead practice. So sorry Ina dance if I can't give advice on how to get scripts, I just wanna help..
I appreciate your advice and kind words and will take them into consideration.
 
Completely on point. Obviously instincts tell you to just stay in bed and try to sleep as much as possible, but I find that once the RLS creepy crawlies have started you're pretty much fucked on sleep. The only thing you can do is accept that it is what it is and you wont be sleeping. You basically have to just get yourself to the point of pure exhaustion physically and force your body to pass out. Whether you do that with exercise or sedatives is entirely up to you, but just trying to get up and walk around a bit will help.

The problem is the mental side of things. You're anxious, depressed and craving. The only thing you can do to not feel those feelings are use or sleep, and the physical symptoms make half of those options not possible without meds to help with the symptoms.

I find Flexeril (cyclobenzaprine) to be a life saver when it comes to managing RLS with withdrawal, especially combined with long acting benzos. Its sedating as is, rather dissociative and its a skeletal muscle relaxer. About 20-40mg and your choice of benzo or z drugs like ambien and Lunesta WILL allow you to get SOME sleep even in the worst of the worst withdrawals.

I've never tried Lyrica but have found gabapentin to be fucking worthless but everyone is different. For me, I don't even like taking MAT tapers when detoxing because it just prolongs the healing of your brain and you experience intense cravings within a few days of getting off of them anyway and are more likely to relapse. Detox sucks no matter how you do it, but taking other opiates to treat opiate withdrawal just prolongs the inevitable. People wanna pretend subs/bupe are not as bad as Methadone but it truly is, if not worse.

All this is subjective at the end of the day and you gotta do what you gotta Do. Only you know your body's needs.
I'm tempted to try methadone or suboxone treatment, but I know in the long run it'll just prolonged the recovery process or worse--become another addiction. Kratom and various benzos helped me the last time I had withdrawals (granted at the time I was also able to ration my dose of oxy down to practically nothing before the big jump off), but I eventually ran out of benzos and kratom became expensive...so in other words, I said fuck it and relapsed. I felt like a failure, but I'll give it another try eventually.
 
I'm not sure if phenibut has been mentioned, but it can give some relief from withdrawals. It is honestly kind of a shitty drug in that it takes 3+ hours to kick in, and the tolerance builds extremely fast. When you combine that with a duration of effects well over 24 hours, it basically means you shouldn't take it more than every third day or so, unless you want to have some level of physical dependence on it.

Phenibut is also pretty finicky as far as dosing goes. Some people take as little as a few hundred milligrams but generally doses are a couple grams. Some people take way more than that which is a massive mistake, but there is a relatively small window between "I can't really feel anything" and "spin up, throw up, puke up, pass out" (I can't stop hearing that on top of Swimming Pools by Kendrick Lamar, idk that's OCD),


Fortunately it's fairly cheap and legal in I believe 49 states, and is essentially treated like a supplement, but make no mistake; it can absolutely be harmful if not used correctly and will fuck your life up if you let it (as with a lot of things).

For a non drug alternative, are you familiar with "Binaural Beats"?
If you have a good set of headphones, this may be worth trying for you.

I love listening to binaural beats and ASMR videos! On another note, now Swimming Pools is stuck in my head. Haha.
 
Almost thought you were referring to Phenobarbital; great for withdrawals tbh.

Is this a supplement or something natural?

I remember detoxing benzos my pheno dose was in the 3 digit MGs at first but you're talking about doses much closer to grams or actual gram doses so I assume this may be a precursor of some kind that's not as potent as Pharma grade Pheno but I'm not sure. Please elaborate of you will, I'm interested in this.

I have no experience with Phenibut and can't speak on it. Dosing kratom definitely helps with lighter habits but in my experience the natural remedies and OTC drugs are only effective for relatively mild withdrawals, even if they do feel "severe."

As my habit has grown and as I've aged I've found I really have 2 options when detoxing, those being I either sleep or I suffer. I lean HEAVILY on benzos for withdrawals as they're extremely simple to get scripts for in large amounts and o always have access to them.

My suggestion would be to get a long acting benzo and use it sparingly when possible, however of you're still struggling, take more. Fuck the instructions on the bottle. The prescriber likely didn't know you'd be using them for detox purposes or they'd likely never give em to you in the first place. Even of they "know" ot is for detox, as long as you tell them it's am anxiety issue they can prescribe. Explain you've been on them in the past and low dosages never worked and you are naturally tolerant to benzodiazepines and that you need a stronger dose than the standard starting dose for most people and you'll likely get it. I recommend seeing a psych who specialized in addiction and trauma therapies in order to acquire such a script. Do not get benzos off the street. Just. A slikwly to be pressed fakes as pxy these days amd it will defeat the point of using them for detox.j
I can vouch for the kratom statement. I was able to kick oxy with a combination of benzos, kratom, and weed--but in that same breath, that was only after rationing my oxy dose as low as I could go. I'm talking 1.25mg low. This next time around my jump off is gonna be higher at 10mg, so the kratom might be useless this next time around. :(
 
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