Opioids Buprenorphine patches, help with dosage

[Jaredborgetti]

Hello, I have recently adquired 52.5mcg or ug/hr patches of buprenorphine, total 30mg buprenorphine each, I have experience with oxycodone, opium, morphine, tramadol, fentanyl, heroin and other opiates, however I use these very sparingly to avoid tolerance from building up so I do not have a tolerance, I understand that these 52.5mcg patches are equivalent to about 90mg morphine which is way too much for me, I usually use 30-40mgs of oral morphine, so my questions are:
1) can buprenorphine patches be cut in half or in several pieces? Or does this damage them

2) how are these patches used? I have never used a patch before so I dont know how they are supposed to be used? You apply them on the skin? Can they be ingested orally or in any other form?

3) what would be a safe dosage for someone with no tolerance of this patches?

 

[zuduxx]

Do not swallow as this will render the buprenorphine inactive. Patches can be cut to lower the dosage. These are applied to clean, dry, hairless skin. You MUST be off all other opiod drugs or you will experience a withdrawal effect. Buprenorphine cannot be combined with other narcotics. IF you are in withdrawal from other opiod drugs then buprenorphine can help immensely with the negative symptoms of opiod withdrawal. One other thing about the patches is you can remove it if anything negative occurs.

 

[Jaredborgetti]

thank you zudux, any more tips?

 

[Jaredborgetti]

I need more information to use safely, mainly what would be a safe dosage to put on?? Please assist

 

[Ticket]

Unfortunately with bupe, and even more so with long acting patches that release mcgs p/hr over days or a week, there's no real direct conversion rate to other opiates. There can be some rough guidelines, but even just dosing with bupe doesn't have a totally linear effect, as people always say, less is more with bupe, and not everyone even gets a buzz from it so it's really hard to say. 52.5mcg p/hr seems like a really high dose though, I used bupe patches to come off Suboxone and went from 2mg bupe daily to 20mcg p/h patch, down to a 15mcg one, then 10mcg, then 5mcg, then I cut a 10mcg in thirds for 3.3mcg, and finally a 5mcg cut in half for 2.5mcg. So yeah you can definitely cut them, just don't get your fingers all over it, and make sure you measure well so you have a more accurate idea of what you're dosing. I've seen people with your morphine tolerance be fine or even get high on anywhere from 2mg of bupe to 8mg or even up to 16mg, it's honestly so variable in most people. Good thing about a patch though is you can just take it off if it's too much, but I'd still suggest cutting it at least in half before you try it. Make sure there are no other opiates in your system when you do though, or you're gonna be in for a world of hurt.

 

[Jaredborgetti]

Thanks so much ticket, one thing I dont understand, why do people say you need to be free of other opiates? This is only buprenorphine without naloxone, do you enter WD if you are on other opiates?

Unfortunately with bupe, and even more so with long acting patches that release mcgs p/hr over days or a week, there's no real direct conversion rate to other opiates. There can be some rough guidelines, but even just dosing with bupe doesn't have a totally linear effect, as people always say, less is more with bupe, and not everyone even gets a buzz from it so it's really hard to say. 52.5mcg p/hr seems like a really high dose though, I used bupe patches to come off Suboxone and went from 2mg bupe daily to 20mcg p/h patch, down to a 15mcg one, then 10mcg, then 5mcg, then I cut a 10mcg in thirds for 3.3mcg, and finally a 5mcg cut in half for 2.5mcg. So yeah you can definitely cut them, just don't get your fingers all over it, and make sure you measure well so you have a more accurate idea of what you're dosing. I've seen people with your morphine tolerance be fine or even get high on anywhere from 2mg of bupe to 8mg or even up to 16mg, it's honestly so variable in most people. Good thing about a patch though is you can just take it off if it's too much, but I'd still suggest cutting it at least in half before you try it. Make sure there are no other opiates in your system when you do though, or you're gonna be in for a world of hurt.

 

[Ticket]

Buprenorphine is extremely potent and has a massively high binding affinity to your opiate receptors. If there's anything else on those receptors, the bupe is just gonna kick it right off and, if you have an addiction, you may experience precipitated withdrawals. The naloxone in Suboxone is kinda more like a marketing strategy, and ostensibly to prevent IV use (which it doesn't, people shoot them all the time), it isn't orally or sublingually active so it's not the naloxone doing it when people take Subs too early in WDs. Bupe also causes a blockade effect against other opiates (unless they're even more powerful ones like fentanyl) so if you were to take something else whilst already on bupe, nothing will happen, you won't get high. You won't get sick doing it that way around, but there's no upside to it either. The bupe is just a big powerful greedy opiate stomping around your opiate receptors taking up the whole damn place, not letting anyone else crash for the night and violently evicting anyone it finds chilling in its' spot when it comes through the door haha.

 

[Jaredborgetti]

thanks ticket, I u d

Buprenorphine is extremely potent and has a massively high binding affinity to your opiate receptors. If there's anything else on those receptors, the bupe is just gonna kick it right off and, if you have an addiction, you may experience precipitated withdrawals. The naloxone in Suboxone is kinda more like a marketing strategy, and ostensibly to prevent IV use (which it doesn't, people shoot them all the time), it isn't orally or sublingually active so it's not the naloxone doing it when people take Subs too early in WDs. Bupe also causes a blockade effect against other opiates (unless they're even more powerful ones like fentanyl) so if you were to take something else whilst already on bupe, nothing will happen, you won't get high. You won't get sick doing it that way around, but there's no upside to it either. The bupe is just a big powerful greedy opiate stomping around your opiate receptors taking up the whole damn place, not letting anyone else crash for the night and violently evicting anyone it finds chilling in its' spot when it comes through the door haha.

Thanks ticket, I understand much better now, given this, do you think 1/4th of a 52.5mcg/hour patch would be a good starter dose?

 

[Ticket]

Yeah so that's about 13mcg/p/hr which I would say is a pretty comfy place to start. In my experience people with chronic pain are often prescribed 10-20mcg/p/hr patches and that's usually with an alright tolerance to codeine and/or oxycondone for them to be put on bupe in the first place, so that's probably a good ballpark for starters. I mean, since you'll need to already be pretty well in withdrawals before putting it on, you're gonna know fairly quickly if it's enough, coz you'll stop feeling sick pretty quickly haha. Bupe takes about 5hrs to reach peak plasma concentrations though, so don't go adding more or licking the patch or anything too early on, see how you go first.