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Buprenorphine Ethanol Solution

What I hate about these studies is that they don't say how long they instruct patients to hold the shit in their mouths.

I don't think it matters if you're using Absolut, Stoli, Jack Daniels, Famous Grouse, etc- as long as your ethanol concentration is low enough that you don't burn a hole in your mouth and you can stand it for a lengthy enough period, it should be fine.
 
I would think a good portion of those here have access to journal full-texts...

So is the increase in bioavailability simply a result of increased dissolution speed of the tablet in the EtOH? There doesnt seem to be anything suprising about that; i would assume the heavier buprenorphine users are aware of this.
 
I would think a good portion of those here have access to journal full-texts...
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indeed they do (blacklight has a section for requesting and hosts many quality fulltext docs. I hope poor, thankless neuwelt's server keeps up!)

So is the increase in bioavailability simply a result of increased dissolution speed of the tablet in the EtOH? There doesnt seem to be anything suprising about that; i would assume the heavier buprenorphine users are aware of this.
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I don't think so- that study was done w/ predissolved bupe hcl; if anything, I would attribute it to the way ethanol enables drugs to cross the mucus membranes.
 
nor buprenorphine may be an agonist, but it's definitely not good for your liver.
 
Very interesting findings IMO. Just one note of caution: Your method of application increases clearly the time during which the alcohol stays in your mouth. This increases at the same time your risk for getting cancer in that area! So, nothing for long term application but definitely useful for the occasional user.
 
It looks to me as if ethanol in general enhances somehow uptake through the mucous membrane of the mouth...So, YEP, mouthwash would do it as well. But maybe less effective (due to lower percentage).
 
I know im bumping an old ass thread, but this really is good shit to know indeed. My purpose being if anyone can ADD to this in any way shape or form please do. Not only is this shit so fucking expensive, it doesn't show up on drug test.
 
I Believe that I had a post about that back in 06.

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=268840&highlight=IHateOpiophobes

It was 30 percent solution in the study I read. I always take my bupe after using mouthwash and I break it up a little. Also I leave just a little mouthwash in instead of spitting it out. Alchohol is slightly corrosive so it would get into the two veins under your tongue where its absorbed quicker than usual. And since it is slightly soluble in alcohol, it really just comes down to BETTER ABSORBTION. Because you always lose a little.

I've been doing that for the since I found some info on the topic and it seems to be explained by basic chemistry. Shit I learned in High School.
 
I also wanted to add that if you really wanted to be efficient, then make up a 30% solution (basic math, figure it out.) and then use a eye dropper used in titrations, then use it to drop controlled amounts under the tongue until you found the best way it works for you.
 
I learned stuff in this thread. What more can u ask for?

I can not hold the bupe long enough in my mouth so I plug. I tried it with alcohol and it wasn't the nicest experience. I wish I could use the alcohol to potentate but plugging already has around 50%BA so I guess I can;t get much higher than that.
 
If I remeber correctly one paper even had patients using bupe dissolved in acetone. I forget what his reasoning was, but it was OUT THERE.

Anyway, the suboxonetalkzone doc recommended dosing your suboxone like this. Place under tounge, then crush it up with your front teeth. "paint" your cheeks with the resulting saliva. He had mucho experince with vials of anesthesiologist only accesable painkillers and spent some time researching the ins and outs of sublingual/buccal administration. I am not sure if he is familiar with the ethanol trick though.
 
Thanks

SurfSurf,
Its been years since I've been on this site, but I know at some point I had read an article about it too. I also was attending a large public university with journal access, but I couldn't find anything. It was before suboxone became as large as it did, and the info wasn't there yet. I take my bupe with listerene (after one spit) and it's worked well for me for a while.
I just remember that it was interesting in the study they were giving them bupe/C2H3OH solution not tablets. It was a pre-dated study as well.



surfrusurf19 said:
(<For info. on the subject line see end of post>)

Hello all , this is my first post. I hope to be able to contribute to this forum and everyones knowledge with the vast amount of information i have access to and my own personal knowledge and experience.

anyways, I have been on suboxone for about 1 1/2 yrs. now and i have always been interested in pharmacology and chemistry and have taught myself much about these two subjects, as well as having plenty of first-hand experience with opiate/benzo addiction, and taking many classes on chemistry.

I am studying at a research university in california and through the library on campus and the fact that i am student, i have access to virtually every single scientific journal and article on the face of the earth (through an ungodly large online database). Pubmed, sciencedirect, galegroup, etc. all these databases of medical/pharmacological/chemistry/scientific are at my fingertips. these articles usually cost money to access but i am allowed free access to any one of them.

So as a welcome gift if any of you have seen or been trying to get your hands on any scientific articles but didn't want to pay the outrageous access fees, then p.m. me for my e-mail and we can discuss how i can get copies of the .pdf's to you so that we can expand the wealth of good information and knowledge on our favorite drugs out there.


Now on to the subject header.


BUPRENORPHINE ETHANOL SOLUTION

I read a thread on this earlier about someone asking about the ethanol solutions of buprenorphine used in it's research/clinical trials. No one could give him a very satisfactory answer.

Well here is any and all information on that and it is of significant importance to all of us wishing to potentiate buprenorphine for whatever reason.

So i have read probably 7 or 8 articles specifically on this subject and there are research papers whose sole purpose it to specifically compare the bioavailabilities of buprenorphine in a tablet preparation vs. an ethanol solution.

In all the research papers except for one, the buprenorphine administered to patients was a 30% solution (one was 40%). The solution used in nearly all of the papers (except for that one) was as follows:

Pure Buprenorphine HCL ([obtained from NIDA] at a concentration of anywhere from 2mg/ml to 8mg/ml) in a solution of 30% ethanol.

so literally it is buprenorphine HCL (the active ingredient in the tablet formulations also) in 70% water/30% ethanol.

Now i got to thinking, hey, Vodka is ethanol and water with very few distillate by-products. It is the purest form of hard-alcohol (besides pure ethanol). and it's at about the same concentration as the solutions used in the papers (approx. 40% ethanol for like 95% of the vodkas out there).

So i put two and two together and decided to take my usual sublingual dose of suboxone with a few ml of vodka held under my tongue. The results were AMAZING.

It definitely potentiated the dose and made it last about 1/3 longer than normal, allowing me to take less than my usual dose and get more and longer lasting effects than my usual higher dose.

That was about a month ago and ever since, everyday, every dose, i put however much i am going to take under my tongue and then put vodka and my mouth and let the dose dissolve as normal. (i use 2mg buprenorphine / ml of vodka). They have shot glasses that break things down into ml so its perfect and easy.

I have also tried crushing the tablet into a powder and dissolving it into the alcohol and then putting that under my tongue but i feel as if the binders/fillers/inactive ingredients in th tablet dont allow as much Bupe to dissolve and it doesn't give me the same effects plus it is generally way more of a pain in the ass than just taking my dose and putting a little alcohol in my mouth.

A few notes on the above paragraphs.

-a quote from the table of comparison in research papers comparing ethanol solution vs. tablet formulation bioavailability:

Peak concentration (ng/ml) for 8mg tablet vs. 8mg in ethanol solution
Tablet: 2.9 +/- 0.5 Solution: 7.1 +/- 2.8

As you can see there is a pretty large/significant difference.

With the solution, plasma concentrations of Bupe peak at almost double the concentrations of the tablet in most people and stay higher the entire time.

oral bioavailability of the tablet is approx. 30% and the ethanol solution is approx. 50-60%

- a note on vodkas. Level vodka put out by Absolut (their "top-shelf" premium vodka) is distilled like 10 or 20 times ( not sure of the exact # read about it a while ago). normal vodka is at most distilled 4 times. So level vodka has they claim "only pure vodka and water" and virtually no distillate byproducts in it. So if you don't have access to laboratory grade ethanol i suggest you use Level because it is far more pure.

I personally use Stoli, but i'm a student on a tight budget so i get by with what i can. ha.


anyways i hope this is of much value to all you suboxone users and abusers out there and to all of you interested in it in general.

Hope this was coherent and not to "rambly"

Peace,

Surfrusurf19
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^ whatever sinks to the bottom/stickso the sides isn't bupe; its the inactive ingredients of the pill. i guarantee you the bupe is dissolving.


buprenorphine's solubility: 17mg/mL in water.

(i know this off the top of my head, so i don't have a source. if you want one - google it. it won't be hard to find.)
 
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