Bupe or not to Bupe....

[Rio Fantastic]

How are you doing dude? I tried doing a bupe taper for my habit but failed. I was taking 1200mg DHC, 480mg oxy and 400mg tramadol a day (split into 2 doses). So my habit was quite large. I did a 7 day taper but day 9 I was still very sick and had work the next day so relapsed.
I found bupe didn't get me well until day 3 or 4 and I was still having sweats/chills seeping through.
I'm trying to quit using codeine now. 240mg of it twice a day, I have just started day 3 and feel terrible, but the codeine is allowing me to lie mostly still otherwise i'd be flopping around in agony

You are aware bupe is way stronger than codeine??? You failed a taper with a stronger opioid so you've swapped to a much weaker one? I hope it works out for you - on the positive side a codeine taper should be much easier than a buprenorphine one, especially at the point where you actually jump off completely. However, the issues that made it difficult for you to taper the bupe should be present at the start where you try and habituate to just taking codeine. What happened with your bupe taper exactly?? What was your dose and where did it go wrong?

 

[Rio Fantastic]

OK, so been on Bupe for a week now and I have stabilised nicely.

A couple of side effects: Constipation (I am taking laxatives every 3rd day and that clears me out). Sudden breaks of sweat (later in the day all of a sudden i go hot and within a minute I am drenched in sweat!). That last for about 1 hour but I spoke to the doc and he says that should go away eventually. Ive also mastered taking the SL pills so it all stays under my tongue until its all completely gone. One thing I have noticed though is these Prefibin tabs take longer to dissolve than Subutex.

apart form that I'm feeling good, sleeping OK, mood is good, anxiety is gone, no wd's at all. I have lots of energy and motivation and my mid is clearer than it has been for a long long while. I almost feel "normal". (if normal is actually a thing)

Once of the best things is i dont wake up in WD every day anymore and I dont have to spend all day panicking about where I am going to get opiates from and driving round parmacies and ordering dodgy pills of the web. ! So that drug seeking part of my life has gone. plus I'm saving ££££.

Now to start planning my recovery like the catinthehat has stated previously.

I've not had a drink yet on bupe, is it best to avoid it completely ? I dont drink much anyway but like 2 or 3 pints on Sunday afternoon with the footy!

I've personally never had a problem drinking on any dose of bupe. The only difference from drinking off bupe in my experience was some of the euphoric effects of alcohol being blocked, especially when I was taking a higher dose - 8mg - of bupe. I'd get intoxicated as normal and I would definitely have a good time and experience giddiness and that initial rush of excitement & disinhibition, but I noticed as I kept drinking though the intoxication would keep mounting I wouldn't be getting as much joy out of it as I would when I was off buprenorphine. The effect was much less prevalent at 2mg but still there a little. Did you do it in the end?

 

[df118s]

You are aware bupe is way stronger than codeine??? You failed a taper with a stronger opioid so you've swapped to a much weaker one? I hope it works out for you - on the positive side a codeine taper should be much easier than a buprenorphine one, especially at the point where you actually jump off completely. However, the issues that made it difficult for you to taper the bupe should be present at the start where you try and habituate to just taking codeine. What happened with your bupe taper exactly?? What was your dose and where did it go wrong?

The bupe didn't seem to make me 100% well, but the main problem was I felt awful even 3 days after I came off the bupe. People on opiate boards have said "you can do a magic taper with 3/5/7 days bupe or 'done and come off with No withdrawals at all even on a massive habit" - these people have never had a massive habit so they have no idea what it is like. I finished the bupe taper on 0.25 thinking that was it, I'm done - only for withdrawals to smack me in the face after that bupe wore off. I had bad RLS, Chills, insomnia come back.
I'm using codeine because it's the bare minimum, it's stopping my kick being a dopesick horror show of liquids (we all know what it's like), but I'm still pretty uncomfortable. I can put up with that as I know I'm detoxing. I don't want to be on day 11 still feeling awful as I get fed up of it and relapse. But I'm too much of a pussy to kick completely cold turkey and I can't taper either so this is what I'm trying. I'm on day 3 feeling bad but not dopesick horror (I can lie still mostly just very achey) but I have just taken 200mg codeine. Hoping that on Sat I can drop the codeine and have a few days of mild symptoms.

 

[FatBellyWhipSlay]

Hi All

so I'm 3 weeks in and am doing good. The other day I developed a bad chest infection and my GP prescribed me Amoxicillin and Prednisolone (as I have asthma) This morning I have woke up and feel like Im going through WD ever so slightly (cold hands and cold sweats)

Could either of those 2 drugs being messing with the Bupe and maybe shortening the half life ? Or is it just the chest infection making me feel crappy ? The Doc said they shouldn't interact...

 

[geekgrl]

ok so on Friday I started feeling shitty about 5 pm after my first dose, but only midly, then by about 8pm it seemed to calm down and i got quite a decent nights sleep!

then yesterday i woke up in full blown wd's, took my daily dose and felt good again after a couple of hours, but then by about 5pm again i started to feel crappy, then it calmed down again and i got another decents night sleep

woke up this morning feeling good! just about to take my daily dose, maybe I am starting to stabilise

hanging in there! thanks for all your nice comments, appreciate it! feel a lot more positive today....

Congrats, you're doing really well. Glad it seems to be working out for you.

 

[Eastender]

OK, so been on Bupe for a week now and I have stabilised nicely.

A couple of side effects: Constipation (I am taking laxatives every 3rd day and that clears me out). Sudden breaks of sweat (later in the day all of a sudden i go hot and within a minute I am drenched in sweat!). That last for about 1 hour but I spoke to the doc and he says that should go away eventually. Ive also mastered taking the SL pills so it all stays under my tongue until its all completely gone. One thing I have noticed though is these Prefibin tabs take longer to dissolve than Subutex.

apart form that I'm feeling good, sleeping OK, mood is good, anxiety is gone, no wd's at all. I have lots of energy and motivation and my mid is clearer than it has been for a long long while. I almost feel "normal". (if normal is actually a thing)

Once of the best things is i dont wake up in WD every day anymore and I dont have to spend all day panicking about where I am going to get opiates from and driving round parmacies and ordering dodgy pills of the web. ! So that drug seeking part of my life has gone. plus I'm saving ££££.

Now to start planning my recovery like the catinthehat has stated previously.

I've not had a drink yet on bupe, is it best to avoid it completely ? I dont drink much anyway but like 2 or 3 pints on Sunday afternoon with the footy!

Hi mate , I've been on espranor for about a year now , reducing on a weekly basis & down to 1.2 mg daily from starting 8mg daily. I like you go to the pub at weekends & found drinking no problem whilst on this medication, hope it works out for you. I'm a bit worried about finally jumping off tho , I've heard some horror stories regarding it , as I'm self employed so cant take 4 weeks off, keep me updated on your progress , best of luck

 

[draculic acid69]

Not to bupe

 

[VanOccupanther]

I’m down to 1.2mg now and it does suck but mostly psychological stuff. I expressed my fears to the doctor at the clinic about my impending final jump off (having also heard horror stories about weeks/months of pain/misery) he laughed them off. “You’ll be fine” I know he just doesn’t want me to dwell on negativity but it doesn’t help my anxiety which is through the roof (I’m guessing largely because this is the cleanest I’ve ever been!) Every drop below 2mg has brought a new intensity of craving, but I’m determined.

 

[Eastender]

I’m down to 1.2mg now and it does suck but mostly psychological stuff. I expressed my fears to the doctor at the clinic about my impending final jump off (having also heard horror stories about weeks/months of pain/misery) he laughed them off. “You’ll be fine” I know he just doesn’t want me to dwell on negativity but it doesn’t help my anxiety which is through the roof (I’m guessing largely because this is the cleanest I’ve ever been!) Every drop below 2mg has brought a new intensity of craving, but I’m determined.

Hi , I've got some comfort meds just incase I feel awful when finally jump, things like pregabalin, gabapentin, some valium & codeine, bought from people who are prescribed these , but not telling the drug counsellor that, yeah I'm a little anxious after hearing peoples account of getting off this buprenorphine, if I knew what I know now I'd never would of been on it this long...

 

[VanOccupanther]

Hi , I've got some comfort meds just incase I feel awful when finally jump, things like pregabalin, gabapentin, some valium & codeine, bought from people who are prescribed these , but not telling the drug counsellor that, yeah I'm a little anxious after hearing peoples account of getting off this buprenorphine, if I knew what I know now I'd never would of been on it this long...

How long have you been on it?
I’ve just had my third anniversary, the first two and a half on 8mg. I’m the same as you I certainly feel now like I may have reconsidered if I’d known how sticky it is! But it’s easy to say that now, I think I’d have done just about anything the doctor told me at the time! I barely remember it tbh.
I’ve also got some benzos to take the edge off, but they are a very slippery slope all of their own!

 

[VanOccupanther]

Hi , I've got some comfort meds just incase I feel awful when finally jump, things like pregabalin, gabapentin, some valium & codeine, bought from people who are prescribed these , but not telling the drug counsellor that, yeah I'm a little anxious after hearing peoples account of getting off this buprenorphine, if I knew what I know now I'd never would of been on it this long...

Sorry I’ve just read above you’ve been on about a year, wish I’d done mine quicker. But then again I’ve had the most productive three years probably of my life.

 

[VanOccupanther]

Also like you eastender I can’t afford to take any time off work when I jump off this horrible shit. It worry’s me a lot.

 

[Eastender]

Also like you eastender I can’t afford to take any time off work when I jump off this horrible shit. It worry’s me a lot.

Best of luck in your journey , I have a prescription review in a few weeks with my local drug service here in the UK, I'll be down to .5 daily by then, (hopefully) then the really tough bit starts, hoping for some advice on coping & what to expect , keep me posted on how you do

 

[Nagelfar]

For maintenance: I'd use lope before I'd use bupe; I know that's just me and a small circle of the experienced. Better to be on a full agonist, even if lightly effective, than bupe wherein very soon you're feeling nothing at all. I am on bupe now and I regret it.

 

[Jabberwocky]

i've used lope for cutting through a rattle though i never got anything but slight relief from it. i think to even touch a serious opiate habit you'd need dangerous amounts of loperamide- iirc it has negative cardiac effects. not crossing the blood brain barrier means you won't get any effects, though i've heard of some people managing on really high doses. i've seen both bupe and methadone have pretty stunning impacts on people who are really ready and motivated to switch to maintenence. when i was using i never saw the point cos i just saw maintenence as a route to a double habit.

OP well done!!! no idea about antibiotic interactions, best to call your GP about that.

 

[VanOccupanther]

Best of luck in your journey , I have a prescription review in a few weeks with my local drug service here in the UK, I'll be down to .5 daily by then, (hopefully) then the really tough bit starts, hoping for some advice on coping & what to expect , keep me posted on how you do

Yes will do, same with you. It really helps hearing from someone else going through this.

 

[Eastender]

Hi Vanoccupanther , yeah same for me , speaking to people who are experiencing the same is a real benefit, especially as I'm hiding this all from my loved ones etc so have no one to talk to, I appreciate the conversation & dont feel so lonely now, currently dropped to 1mg today, always in slight wd every morning before work so always look forward to getting the bupe to start my day, hope your feeling ok with your taper, Eastender

 

[FatBellyWhipSlay]

ok so reporting in folks!

its been 7 weeks ? (I think) and things have been going very well, I've started to rebuild my daily life and slowly starting to build back the trust with my wife and things have been really positive. No relapses or even thoughts/cravings for opiates. My wife even got prescribed DHC for her back problems a couple of weeks back and theres a box of 100 starting me in the face all the time but I haven't even thought about necking some, not 1 thought.

So last Friday I started to reduce my dose (from 4mg). I am now on 3.2mg daily and will be dropping another 0.8 in 2 weeks time. Then when I get to 2.4mg I will be dropping by 0.4 every 2 weeks.

I did notice the drop to 3.2mg though. The last few days I could feel it by late evening and then the following morning. Not like really bad WD's but ever so mild, Yawning, Goosebumps and a bit of agitation. But hopefully in next couple of days that will stabilise and should be OK (so the doc says).

So keeping plodding on! I haven't been drinking as dont like the feeling of the mix with Bupe its weird, kind of has no effect...

 

[VanOccupanther]

Good work man! Sounds like it’s going well. I was the same it gave me time (and money) to sort my shit out: work, family etc, with a minimum of cravings. I’m down to 0.8mg now and like you I feel the sharp edge each time I drop (every four weeks) but then it evens out after about a week. Not looking forward to the next couple though!!
Well done and keep going!!

 

[Eastender]

ok so reporting in folks!

its been 7 weeks ? (I think) and things have been going very well, I've started to rebuild my daily life and slowly starting to build back the trust with my wife and things have been really positive. No relapses or even thoughts/cravings for opiates. My wife even got prescribed DHC for her back problems a couple of weeks back and theres a box of 100 starting me in the face all the time but I haven't even thought about necking some, not 1 thought.

So last Friday I started to reduce my dose (from 4mg). I am now on 3.2mg daily and will be dropping another 0.8 in 2 weeks time. Then when I get to 2.4mg I will be dropping by 0.4 every 2 weeks.

I did notice the drop to 3.2mg though. The last few days I could feel it by late evening and then the following morning. Not like really bad WD's but ever so mild, Yawning, Goosebumps and a bit of agitation. But hopefully in next couple of days that will stabilise and should be OK (so the doc says).

So keeping plodding on! I haven't been drinking as dont like the feeling of the mix with Bupe its weird, kind of has no effect...

Good work, yeah I think 0.2 drop every week is a sensible taper for now, although when you get around the 2mg daily dose maybe think about 0.1 per wk , sounds like your body has adjusted nicely, I'm currently dropped to 0.8 daily & surviving haha, keep going & keep us posted as there are a few of us on here going through the exact same thing which is handy to talk to each other etc