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  • P&S Moderators: Xorkoth | Madness

Avoiding misanthropy

swilow

Sr. Moderator: AADD, CE&P, TD
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How? Its something I've pondered for a while....I do have a feeling of disgust towards humanity- yet, on an indivual level, I generally like people. I know that the people I see (and myself) are the same as the destroyers, but I can't ever feel hate towards an individual. But, in regards to the human race, I feel a great sense of disappointment. How to reconcile these feelings with the knowledge that most humans are seperately good people is troubling.....when, on a whole, our actions are despicable at times; more often then not....

Thoughts?
 
individuals are intelligent, people are dumb. Seriously humanity and def the main stream has been purposefully dumbed down & told to sit in a box & play with a shiny flashy toy while the world gets rapped power of nightmares . The worst part was humans did this willingly.
 
My experience is that the more I hate humanity as a whole, the more I am capable of loving humans.

Many people have had issues with my position, even here on BL.
 
How? Its something I've pondered for a while....I do have a feeling of disgust towards humanity- yet, on an indivual level, I generally like people. I know that the people I see (and myself) are the same as the destroyers, but I can't ever feel hate towards an individual. But, in regards to the human race, I feel a great sense of disappointment. How to reconcile these feelings with the knowledge that most humans are seperately good people is troubling.....when, on a whole, our actions are despicable at times; more often then not....

Thoughts?

I don't see where you get the idea that most people are "good" on their own. Most people are very ignorant, and are unaware of the personally observable effects of their own actions, nevermind expecting them to be aware of the larger systems of brutality and oppression they are encouraged to join by ceaseless propaganda. Most people in English speaking countries like the USA and UK, just by going to work at their 9-5 every day, or paying their taxes, are doing their essential parts in guaranteeing that millions of people die in bombings and battles every year (or from a number of forms of resource deprivation through economic domination).

If you are feeling misanthropic it's probably because you're surrounded by savages pretending to be civilized.
 
Most people are very ignorant, and are unaware of the personally observable effects of their own actions

If you are feeling misanthropic it's probably because you're surrounded by savages pretending to be civilized.

You just contradicted yourself there. As you said, most people are ignorant. Meaning they are not aware of the machine they are allowing themselves to be apart of. If someone isn't aware of something (or if they currently are not capable of seeing enough of the big picture to become aware) how can they be faulted for this?

If you literally think they are savages who are fully aware of everything yet pretending to be civilized, thats one thing. But it's different than simply being sleeping, ignorant herds of sheep, which is about where most of society seems to be right now.

Sheep might not have a lot of awareness or intelligence, but they are still worthy of love and compassion, IMO. All things are.
 
My experience is that the more I hate humanity as a whole, the more I am capable of loving humans.

Many people have had issues with my position, even here on BL.
Yes I can understand you on this, by not disavowing your hate and feeling it, though in generalization over the whole, it allows love to be active. Usually when we deny experiencing our dark/side it represses the other. We need to feel and then integrate the dark side of love!
You seem to be aware of its underlying presence and accepting it, but it also needs integration, so that you don't feel depression and the other states and feelings of anguish, when it is turned against the self!
 
I don't see where you get the idea that most people are "good" on their own.

Well, most people I encounter in my own life are "good", in the sense that they would not intentionally do something destructive or desire negative things for others. Yet, on a whole, the human race is utterly decadent.

Most people are very ignorant, and are unaware of the personally observable effects of their own actions, nevermind expecting them to be aware of the larger systems of brutality and oppression they are encouraged to join by ceaseless propaganda. Most people in English speaking countries like the USA and UK, just by going to work at their 9-5 every day, or paying their taxes, are doing their essential parts in guaranteeing that millions of people die in bombings and battles every year (or from a number of forms of resource deprivation through economic domination).

But thats my problem. No one individual amongst those people is causing these problems; yet, together, we all are. I include myself, because I can't really help it. Going to work, paying taxes- on an individual level, no-one is trying to really bomb and battle people. And we can't blame our "leaders" as we voted them in (in democratic countries that is). Its just hard for me; today, at work, I was speaking to a guy whose all tattoos and machismo, and pretty misogonystic, and then out of the blue he mentioned his work, which is helping immigrants assimilate into Australia- he mentioned how much he loved helping these people and how interesting they were on a whole. This shocked me, as I'd pegged him as one of "them".

If you are feeling misanthropic it's probably because you're surrounded by savages pretending to be civilized.


I guess, but I am actually somewhat of a loner these days anyhow; my "misanthropic" idea's stem simply from observing the crap in the media, and the mounting evidence pointing towards destruction of life on earth. But I know if I hate people, I am hating part of myself- and I don't hate people, even though they might be hate-worthy...

I'm just confused as to why individuals, such as my own friends, can see like "good people"- and yet, here we are, poised on the precipice of ruining absolutely everything.
 
Sheep might not have a lot of awareness or intelligence, but they are still worthy of love and compassion, IMO. All things are.
damn as hard as it is to admit it i agree. I am resentful of the mass of Sheeple's ignorance since its hindering the greater good of humanity but at the same time seeing other people who are aware & still have the view of the above is a reminder/inspiration to all who know better to stay positive & send love instead of hate. I usually get kinda stuck focusing on why humans(in mass) & mob mentality in general sucks & forget just how amazing each individual really is when not focusing on the positive.
 
I thought 'savage' implied a lack of awareness.

Maybe it does, I guess it means something else in my mind.

I'm just confused as to why individuals, such as my own friends, can see like "good people"- and yet, here we are, poised on the precipice of ruining absolutely everything.

Be the change you want to see in the world, that's all you have to do.
 
swilow said:
I do have a feeling of disgust towards humanity- yet, on an indivual level, I generally like people.

No advice i can really give since I'm in the same boat. Ill be watching this thread though. Glad you brought up this issue.


swilow said:
But thats my problem. No one individual amongst those people is causing these problems; yet, together, we all are. I include myself, because I can't really help it.

But I know if I hate people, I am hating part of myself- and I don't hate people, even though they might be hate-worthy...

I'm just confused as to why individuals, such as my own friends, can see like "good people"- and yet, here we are, poised on the precipice of ruining absolutely everything.


What i will say is that as far as humans causing their own destruction especially is that we, or at least I, were/was born into it. I was born into a world where you waste crap all the time, and almost everyone does it. Its hard to get out of that kind of rut.

While I dont hate most people (theres a long story about those few I do), I strongly dislike many. Same for you or no? And maybe its OK to hate a part of yourself that perhaps (for example, i dont know you) doesnt care about throwing cig buts on the ground when a perfecty good back pocket is available...etc.

And as far as judging most people I meet as good I feel the same. However, if i grill any of these people on real issues they either dont care or are misinformed or simply clueless. Thats what makes me hate people. The fact that almost every one i meet, "good" or not, seems like a fucking idiot or just simply incompetent.

Thats all i got.
 
Yes. Apathy will be the death of the sheep, not being bothered to care as the herds blindly gallop toward the cliff. :(

The fact that almost every one i meet, "good" or not, seems like a fucking idiot or just simply incompetent.

Haha yeah, I feel that way sometimes but then again, look at all of us here, having an intelligent conversation about it.


I've had a theory for a long time that humanity is sort of splitting into two different "species", maybe not physically but when it comes to consciousness and awareness. It feels to me that the awake are getting more awake, and the blind are getting even more clueless. Perhaps it's always being this way but it's reaching a boiling point because of the stress the overpopulated, polluting society is putting on the world. Something is going to break at some point, and I feel sorry for those sleeping sheeple who are going to get a rude wake up call.
 
I find spending time with children helps cure misanthropy

also understanding/being aware that humanity as a whole is largely a reflection of yourself...

so if there are aspects of humanity we have trouble understanding/excepting or just even liking (let alone loving) this is mostly just macro-cosmic aspects of ourselves

love thyself, or don't
 
I can't offer advice to others, but what I do is assume a constructive approach - even if people are fallible or even outright evil, I love what people could be. I believe anyone can be good, if only they saw the "truth". This is more of a religious belief than one based on reason or facts, but I believe it can't hurt :)
 
Ooh, boy...can I sympathize with the OP.

I'm reminded of a quote from the first MiB, when J asks K why they don't just tell everyone about the existence of alien life, because people can handle it. K replies, "A person is smart; people are dumb and panicky, and you know it..."

My own feelings about humanity have always been deeply conflicted. One of my favorite (!) studies is military history--strange for an avowed pacifist--and military history, unfortunately, is full of massacres, pointless battles, and idiotic mistakes that sometimes cost the lives of millions. The news today gives little encouragement: for every scientific advance there's news of another repression, for every act of charity another act of greed or stupidity (just look at Wall Street), for every problem recognized there is another ignored.

So, at least once a day I think the human race is a dead end, and hope fervently that some comet will come along and destroy the whole mess so nature can start over, hopefully with another intelligent species that can get things done instead of thinking of new and better ways to smash each other over the head with clubs.

But hey...childhood is like that. I know; I've done my share of prickish acts growing up, acts I now regret, but I learned and will not repeat them. The optimist in me tells me that's where humanity is now, in childhood--learning its limits, getting burned now and then, but coming through a little better year by year. Yes, it's easy to despair of humanity's present, but in the Western world alone, look at how much things have improved: we don't have the rack. We don't burn people at the stake. We don't have trial by ordeal, or legal blood feuds. We don't build up capital with the Middle Passage. Our democracies are imperfect, but are still a step above autocracy and the divine right of kings. Literacy has improved, justice has improved, health has improved--I must believe people are perfectible.

People are surprising; there are individuals I thought were friendly who most definitely were not, and others I thought would be contemptible or simply "not my type" who were wonderful. Every day my preconceptions are challenged. For instance, I recently visited a friend in southern Alabama. One day I'm walking along a rural road near his place, when a pickup truck stops beside me. Here goes, I was thinking, hick sees a black guy walking along the road in Lily White Land, stops and hisses at me that "We don't care much for your kind round these parts," and I'll thereby join the ranks of the millions of blacks who've been insulted by Dixie".... So he leans out the window, and asks "Care for a lift?" I saw not a drop of real suspicion, disdain, or veiled malice in his eyes, and I must admit that it was one of the most quietly shameful moments of my life. Yes, James Byrd-dragging mouth-breathers exist, but painting millions--let alone billions--of people with the same brush without giving them the benefit of the doubt is moronic, and that's exactly what I felt like at that moment.

The point of that rant is this: that though I personally remain a cynic, I simply cannot help but believe Hemingway's "The world's a fine place, and worth fighting for."
 
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This is a very interesting topic, i can relate greatly OP

I think one thing to consider is that businesses are like these faceless machines that are not held responsible for ethics and morals. its easy to hold an individual responsible but these businesses and organizations have become a whole new entity.

i agree very much with plato/socrates in their view of humans being essentially good/virtuous but doing bad/vicious things out of ignorance as doing wrong results in bad things happening to those who do it and no one would willingly wish harm upon themselves.

its like in movies with the good vs evil thing, the good people are all shiny and nice and want to have a good life for all and the evil side wants suffering, but the suffering includes them. In turning the world into blackness and dark castles and all that shit they too would have to live there, and why would they want that, why would their minions work for that? These illogical positions on good v evil are exactly what the Tao warns agianst.

People seem like their out of the picture on this one, the bad shit seems to come from entirely different entities, not that people arent often responsible for malicious acts.

idk im not the best at writing to clearly convey ideas but i think i'v kinda explained my position?
 
How? Its something I've pondered for a while....I do have a feeling of disgust towards humanity- yet, on an indivual level, I generally like people. I know that the people I see (and myself) are the same as the destroyers, but I can't ever feel hate towards an individual. But, in regards to the human race, I feel a great sense of disappointment. How to reconcile these feelings with the knowledge that most humans are seperately good people is troubling.....when, on a whole, our actions are despicable at times; more often then not....

Thoughts?
ignorance of the chains of "human feeding" which prop up people at the top (aka, everyone at this board) and the top top (govt) and the top top top (rich ppl)
 
Perhaps it is like a cell perceiving the sickness of the body he is part of. He won't necessary resent those like him, while at the same time knowing that where they are collectively going is wrong, and some part of the body is fucking it up for them.

Generally, human beings tend to tap into excess energy-- that of slavery, conquest/pillage, concentrated fossils, etc. It is part of our impulse towards abundance, which, in a very fair sense, is an inborn attraction that should encourage survival and growth. When whole societies become dependent on these forms of energy, it is difficult for them to be stable, as the sources are finite and insecure.

Unfortunately, many decisions to tap these large sources of energy are centralized, making citizens part of systems that do pretty horrible and stupid things. It is very difficult to jump out of them when many services and materials chains are centralized-- you need them.

Coming from a more neutral perspective on people, I think it is wise of you to (sort of) separate such systems from the people. It's helped me a lot to acknowledge that people will mainly go on their instinct. I would go as far in the "invisible/foofy realm" as to say that we've lost some subtle nonlocal and somewhat intuitive understanding of interconnectedness of everything, that our instinctive drive now is informed on a somewhat limited level (observation from indigenous peoples I work with). Now we are learning this at a clumsier/slower/piecemeal rate with information and data that illustrates it. This may be romanticizingthings a tad bit, but..

/end stoned rambling
 
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