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Assaulted or deserving?

  • Thread starter Thread starter facelessgirl
  • Start date Start date
Vivian said:
This sounds like a girl regretting letting someone fuck her and then deciding that she would feel better about herself if she said she was raped.
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Yes, and I'm sure that's why she's posting about it anonymously on a forum and talking about how horrible she feels like it's her fault.

Snide remarks like this are what encourage date rape to go unreported and victims to feel like it was their doing. You should be ashamed of yourself. You're disgusting.
 
mooncaller said:
You can also bet that he was completely aware of what he was doing.
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So they went out drinking together, she was so drunk she didn't really know what was happening but he must have been completely aware of what he was doing and what was going on?

I'm going to bow out. Usually I'm the first to spring to the defence of women in these situations, but something about this just reads wrong to me. I can't quite put my finger on it. Perhaps the fact that everything was fine while she was being pleasured, but when he gets his cock out all of a sudden she is repulsed? Maybe it's the fact that she was so incapacitated that she couldn't deal with the situation, but then afterwards she gets in a car and drives somewhere? Maybe it's something else. Maybe I just don't want her to put herself in the victim role because it seems that doing that is what allowed this to happen in the first place.

I'm not trying to throw blame on the OP for what happened, but it seems to me that she might have problems that stem from something that happened before this incident.
 
Beatlebot said:
So they went out drinking together, she was so drunk she didn't really know what was happening but he must have been completely aware of what he was doing and what was going on?
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Being that she remembers the situation she was obviously aware. They were both aware. Alcohol is not a dissociative. Unless someone is just straight up passed out drunk they are usually aware. I know that every time I've been drunk, even when so drunk I couldn't stand up I've been perfectly aware of what I was doing and if what I was doing was an assholeish thing to do I knew it and didn't really care.
 
^I don't think you're in a position to try and tell anyone what was going through this guy's mind when this happened.

We have two friends out having a good time getting wasted in a dark park late at night. We have a kiss with no indication that it was unwanted. We have manual sex that appeared to both parties to be wanted. We then have a confusing moment where the OP seems indecisive on whether or not her vocal protests were apparent to the other party. Then we have sex with no protest or resistance. I'm not saying that I know whether the guy thought he was forcing himself on her or not, I'm saying that you don't.
 
I am going to have to fall on the assault side of this question, however I can also appreciate what GM and others are saying here.

The OP made some bad choices with the guy in question. She knew the guy had a serious crush on her and he had made passes before yet here she is getting crazy drunk with the guy and allowing him to kiss her. The moment he went in for the kiss was the logical time to back out. By going onto letting the guy stimulate her the doors where thrown wide open.

The OP made a mistake and metaphoricaly loaded the gun, however IMO it was the guy who fired the fatal shot. He chose to continue on with a girl who saying no, crying and in a limp motionless state. I have been in a situation personaly where I was in bed with a girl got to the point where I was stimulating her and she, for whatever reason, did not want to go ahead. She began crying and saying stop, so that exactly what I did. I didn't just ignore it and continue on like everything was normal, quite obviously it wasn't.

Obviously thats just my opinion based on the side of the story I have been privy too. Its a very debatable point and I think we can all only really postulate as to the events of that night. One can assume that the OP was clearly audible when she said no, when she wimpered and cried and was very obviously stunned when she went limp. One could also assume that her cries of no and requests to stop where not audible and the stunned state was not so obvious. Only two people really know.

Outside of that though one thing is definate, that is a person is deeply hurt and scarred by this event. The best thing for the OP to do is to consult with a professional counselor or therapist who is specialised in these matters.
 
You said no and cried. He raped you.

He couldn't control himself when he saw his chance. You can say no at any time, even after he's fingered you.

He raped you and it's not your fault.

Pretty straightforward as far as I'm concerned.
 
Sounds like he certainly took advantage of the fact he was heading back to his home country shortly after the incident. She was young, immature and naive. She isn't the first girl to get herself into a bad situation. And she wont be the last. But if she was crying, sobbing and showing obvious signs of distress and he just kept going, she indeed was raped. It doesn't matter if he was intoxicated as well - he raped her. End of story.
 
You said no, simple, it is rape. Unfortunately, court would just be stressful and useless, as you require physical evidence. Your word against his fails 99% of the time.
 
I believe she said no, and stated how she whimpered etc. But it would be good if the OP could come back and clarify to be certain. It is left a little unclear.
 
did you really just refer to "whimpering in protest" as though that wasn't an obvious no? being one who has said no and literally gave up and said fine during the act, i can appreciate the view that some people aren't being strong enough in their defense, but there is a limit. her post reads as though she was consistent in her protests, and it sounds attrocious, and frankly, i am annoyed that her emotions have to be further entrenched in self doubt with this post when it could be a cry for help.

OP, an event like this can't be broken apart on a website forum and you need to be open and honest with a therapist, like others mentioned. and whether or not this was "deserved" or this guy was malicious in his act isn't even important to be honest. what matters is that it is harming you emotionally now, and that needs to be addressed.

good luck. you can pm a lot of people on here if you need to chat. anyone who has been supportive in this thread would be willing to listen i assume. i don't spend a lot of time on here, but i would be too, but don't be offended if i don't respond quickly. but i strongly suggest you seek someone out in your life that you respect and trust, if not professional help...to speak with about this.
 
Just a quick point regarding the 'giving alcohol to a minor' that has been mentioned a couple of times: at no point in the post does the OP say she is in the US. In fact, her use of the words 'mate' and 'university' (as opposed to 'college') indicates that she probably isn't (either NZ, UK or Australia would be my guess). The legal drinking age in these places is 18, not 21. Please be aware that the US isn't the only place on earth!
 
also poster, please be advised that you are sincerely unaware at the lack or the lack thereof with regards to any acuity in your mind and what went on that night. i hate to think someone is sitting there reading this shit and making them feel more awful than they already do.
 
DarthMom said:
her post reads as though she was consistent in her protests
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Weird, I was just thinking the opposite. Story time:

I was once fooling around with a young woman while we were drunk. She seemed receptive yet nervous to what I was doing. I started to go down on her and she seemed to get uncomfortable and shook her head. I came back up but we still ended up having intercourse. Does that mean I forced myself on her and I'm a rapist? No. It means that she was uncomfortable with me performing oral sex on her for whatever reason. Maybe she didn't like oral sex or maybe she wasn't comfortable enough with her body to have me down there, who knows. The point is that she seemed to enjoy everything else I did(later confirmed by her). Guys aren't mind readers. What I perceived as nervousness on her part could have very well been some massive internal struggle she was going through as she thought she was being raped.

Granted, the guy is an asshole for making her manually stimulate him even though she expressed discomfort from it, but I'm sure she had plenty of opportunity to say the word No or Stop while he was pulling down her pants, while he was getting on top of her, while he was prodding around, or during the sex itself.

I feel bad for the OP and I'm sorry she had to experience something like that, but sexual responsibility falls on both parties. You can't expect a man(or woman) to know what's going on in your head.
 
Do you have access to any counsellors or someone like that you could speak to ? You have been trying to put it out of your mind from what you said at the start but that will only make it manifest itself in otherways. You are probably trying to get some answers as to why it happened by making this thread but you probably wont get many because the truth is we cant give you any. All people can offer here is opinions on something that was described to them and most of those will be polarized by which side of the fence they are sitting on. Good luck matey and take care aye.
 
If it was rape in her mind, then it was rape.

We shouldn't fault her for getting raped, or for the fact that she didn't really stand up for herself when the time came down to it. The rape did happen and she really did very little to stop it, and that's sad.

However, judging by the posts in this thread, she would have a hard time convincing people beyond a shadow of a doubt that it was rape. We can't even agree that a rape happened and all we've been given is her side of the story. A jury would have an even harder time letting this go to trial, let alone convicting him.

This is just a very unfortunate circumstance.
 
airforlife said:
If it was rape in her mind, then it was rape.
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The notion that the "victims" perception of events are the basis for fact, gives one a narrow, biased view of the events, that does not necessarily reflect reality.

If it was rape in real life, taking into account all evidence and all points of view, not if someone perceives in their mind that it was rape.
 
If a woman thinks she's been raped, then she has been raped.

The local police may not decide to move forward with the case because of the objective facts, and may not deem it a legal case of rape. However, if the woman feels she's been violated, who has the power to tell her she hasn't? No one, because in her mind, she'll always think that she's been raped.

This is not an objective measure of rape by any means, nor a legal one. However, the person the most affected by a rape is the one who was raped (or believed they were), so the definition of a one-side perceived rape fits for the person who it applies to the most, the "rape" victim.

The woman believes she has been violated. She was unable to stop unwelcome sexual advances, and thus the rape has occurred in her mind. The police probably won't agree with her, but just because she failed to stop the person who wanted to have sex for her, or provide some evidence to make the guy culpable, that doesn't mean she wasn't raped.

And recons, that definition doesn't have to reflect fact. For the only applicable person that this definition is important to, it worked.
 
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