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Are you born gay?

Damien said:
Well, I'm interested because I am a Christian and living in America. I should have answers for people when they start asking about Christianity's views on homosexuality. The second part, I was trying to make a joke about how people might be curious about homosexuality not to cure it, rather to open up the playing field and add the other 1/2 of the population to their potential dating pool (which would be bisexuality but for the purposes of my shallow joke, I thought it would work ;)).
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OH! haha, I get it, that's actually pretty funny :)
well, as far as the whole Christianity thing goes, it only really talks about two men laying together, and sodomy- but it really doesn't have much to say, as far as I know, anything about two women specifically-
but I guess that's semantics, and splitting hairs.
I once knew a very wise christian who told me what he would tell people when they asked him about homosexuals (or other kinds of sinners), he would
reply to them, "In the end, the only one who can judge them is God himself, it's blasphemy to really try and assume we know who he is and isn't going
to punish."

I always liked that.
 
Attraction to either sex is just a "fetish" if you will.

Some people like feet. Some people like small waists. Some people like women. People with a 'Y' chromosome are programmed to be much more likely to be attracted to people with 2 'X' chromosomes (ie big tits, petite bodies, no dick), and vis versa. There is nothing that guarantees this will hold true in each individual. Some XY's like XX's with more XY traits. Some XY's like XY's. Some XY's like the taste of oranges. Are they born liking the taste of orange?
 
I don't think anyone is born into anything, personally. A small child isn't thinking about whether he is attracted to a boy or girl. He/she is only trying to satisfy it's basic needs. I feel like you grow into it as you get a little older when you get to that stage of liking your peers. Only then you decide ( or realize should I say ) that you have an attraction to a certain gender. It also has to do with many other factors, but I won't get into that.
 
I hope everyone has enough evidence to support all of these claims. Anyways, how many gay/lesbian people are in this thread? to get a clear picture, you would have to ask them about their personal experiences-
But like I asked before- why do people want to know? Do they want to cure it? How would that knowledge benefit anyone? Do we want to change it?
hmm...
 
I think that the question is entirely moot for a number of reasons. As L2R pointed out, whether someone is born "gay" or decides to be "gay" is totally irrelevant: being homosexual is as legitimate an identity as any other.

I'm more interested in the word "gay" itself, which most of you have used to describe a particular identity: what does the word "gay" mean today?

Like all words, there is a constant metamorphosis of meaning occurring when it comes to "gay", and in today's climate, I don't think that it would be too far of a stretch to suggest that in the majority of cases, the word "gay" is synonymous with "shit" or "terrible".

"That film was gay"

"Oh, God. Exams are so gay".

This is not meant to offend anyone (in fact, my friends [some of them homosexual] and I have developed the word "ghey" for this exact purpose: to avoid insulting anyone that has chosen "gay" as a word by which to identify during a period when its meaning evolves into something entirely different), but I'd like to point out the power of identifying so strongly with a label.

From here, I'd like to discuss the word "queer", which was seen as synonymous with homosexuality from the 1950's (perhaps due to the phenomenal literature of William S. Burroughs) until more recent times.

But today any number of things could be queer: we might say that someone with a foot fetish is queer, that sadomasochists are queer, that role play is queer, that anal sex is queer, that water-sports are queer... the list goes on ad infinitum.

My point is, what is it to be "gay"? Many people have mentioned sodomy, but there are heterosexual males that like to be pegged by women with a strap-on and there are women that like to play out this role with men. Even though sodomy, especially when it is equated with the penetration of a male, is generally associated with homosexuality, some men that only find women attractive (and have only ever been with women) enjoy being a bottom in a sexual relationship. (And this is not to mention Male>Female anal sex).

Would anyone use "gay" to describe this behaviour, or would "queer" be a better label? Are there any other words that people would use in these instances?

My point is language (read: labels) evolves through time, and functions differently (has different meanings) for different people in different circumstantial contexts.
 
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No one can be born "gay" or "straight", as the very notion of these sexual identities is a very recent invention (indeed, perhaps 150 years old). However, people do not choose what their sexual desires are, just how they will reckon with them. And then the adoption of sexual identity is born mainly of external compulsion, as one navigates how others treat people with various desires.

ebola
 
I read that the more males the parents give birth to, the more likely the next child is to be female. Additionally, the more likely the next male child is to be homosexual because the fetus receives more female hormones. My younger brother is homosexual and hes the youngest out of 3 males. I'm heterosexual but I think I have less testosterone running through my veins than my older brother because I have less muscles and less of a temper and other things associated with high testosterone levels. I strongly suspect that people are born homosexual. The idea that it is a choice seems pretty ridiculous to me. Who would choose to be an outcast of society? I never chose to be mildly autistic and given the choice I would have been normal because being an outcast makes you vulnerable. I used to be an ignorant piece of shit that judged homosexuals like many people do but something changed in me over the years, I no longer judge them in any way and I resent the way they are demonised by this fucked up society. However, its become socially acceptable to be homosexual, some of my other views towards sexuality aren't so popular. I don't judge pedophiles and I think they shouldn't be treated any different to anyone else. Similar to how being heterosexual doesn't mean you're a rapist, being a pedophile doesn't mean you molest children. Similarly, being homosexual doesn't mean you wait for some poor fool to drop the soap in the showers in prison lol. I think it was psychedelics that instilled this sense of altruism in me, nowadays I wish good upon everyone so I can't judge people for being the way they are. The way I see it, if you're not harming anyone else then its all good. If you're harming other people then maybe something bad happening to you will show you the error in your ways. Suffering is the mother of all teachers. We all change.
 
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you might have a valid point- but I have seen that hormone levels usually don't dictate sexual preference- I am very masculine and homosexual and from all my blood work I have seen that there is nothing wrong with the amounts of estrogen, testosterone, or androgen levels . Also the introduction of
usual hormones into your body, even when you are developing (out or in the womb) haven't proven anything substantial in lab or field tests. The sex hormones you are talking about have more do to with the physical growth of sex organs, more than psychological resonance- especially after childhood development.
Not to say what you are saying is wrong- because you may have better sources. The truth is is that we have thousands of different hormones that dictate the actions of millions of different processes in the body.
I remember reading a "scare" article in Time magazine, one from the 50's, it was talking about how women should have a boy first and then a girl,
because if a girl was born first, because of the hormones you are talking about, the boy might become "sissy", and to use precaution accordingly.
Rubbish.
Geneticists and specialists ranging from doctors to the APA have denounced through decades of hard evidence that this is not that case.
But I could be wrong.
still sounds like rubbish to me
 
MikeOekiM said:
well what i think is that everything thats happens through out your life is already planned out before you are even born so yes people that are gay are born gay imo
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Wow that is deep but yet so simplistic and clearly explanatory...

I have a feeling that "being gay" has so much to do with cause and affect; the way you were brought up, and then some.
 
MikeOekiM said:
well what i think is that everything thats happens through out your life is already planned out before you are even born so yes people that are gay are born gay imo
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Wow that is deep but yet so simplistic and clearly explanatory...

I have a feeling that "being gay" has so much to do with cause and affect; the way you were brought up, and then some. (Sorry, before I get called out on this, I just airheadedly realized I pretty much summed up the same exact thing every one else already clarified, in one sentence here...I apologize).
 
hgwells said:
When I was pretty young my first crush was this guy in my middle school, and before that I had never thought girls were cute, only certain guys would give
me that "oh god I'm so nervous right now, I'm going to fall over." feeling.
I can't prove it, but I'm pretty sure I was born gay, I didn't make any decision one morning-
"Gee-golly, I think I want penis, that sounds like fun, and everybody loves gay people, I think that's what I'm going to be today, tra la la la la"

but I can't speak for everyone.
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Seconded, it's not a choice, more of a realization
 
It's quarter to 7 in the morning and been up all night so can't be bothered finding a source, I remember reading a few years ago (New Scientist maybe) that there's a correlation between homosexuality and certain hormones received during gestation, I want to say oestrogen but like I said too tired for source. So the gay gene may be possessed in our mothers.
 
I don't think people are born gay. I think it's mostly do to your upbringing and not do to any sort of genetic sort of makeup.

I think everyone could have the tendency to be attracted to members of both sexes.

The real question is, is being gay or being straight states of being which actually exist? They are nothing but words to describe activities in my opinion and it shouldn't be looked at in the same way that skin color is looked at. I believe there are black people and white people. I don't really think there are gay and straight people. I just think some people have a tendency to find certain sexes more appealing and it most likely has to do with a whole shitload of factors which we can't really even understand.

I personally had feelings for girls my whole life but then as I grew up I started have feelings for men as well. Now it's a mixture of both.
 
as almost everyone else said, which is awesome, there is a difference between gay, and homosexual...or feminine and masculine, what does it mean to have an understanding between these two points of view and emotional state ?

i dont believe our soul, if you believe in such a thing, actually comes back as a male or female each time, maybe not even a human ? it is a shame and blame game, people are born and then begin to take on traits and beliefs, fears from their surroundings, they might want to do something just to rebel. if some one feels they want to be with someone of the same sex, chances are they might feel a lot of fear and shame about it, and then begin to withdraw from their family and eventually the sense of uniqueness they were more comfortable with in the first place, we are much more happy, creative, healthy that way.


~ thunder perfect mind / in part ;-)
NSFW:

I am the Beginning and the End.

I am honored and scorned.

I am the prostitute and the saint.

I am married and a maiden.

I am the mother and the daughter.

I am the limbs of my mother.

I am barren
and my children are many.

I am she who married magnificently,
and I have no husband.

I am the one who brings children and I do
not bear children.

I am the consolation of labor pains.

I am the bride and the bridegroom,
and my husband brought me forth.

I am my father’s mother
and my husband’s sister,
and he is my child.

I am the incomprehensible silence
and the idea often brought to mind.

I am the voice sounding throughout the world
and the word appearing everywhere.

I am the sounding of my name,
For

I am knowledge and ignorance.

I am shame and bravery.

I am without shame; I am full of shame.

I am power and I am trepidation.

I am conflict and peace.

Listen to me,
For

I am the scandalous and magnificent one.

I AM ALL

<3

 
I'm an absolute skeptic of significant genetic pre-disposition to sexual orientation. I believe most aspects of one's sexual orientation stem from their experiences from birth. This is not to minimize the importance of being sexually true to oneself, because it is something very unique to each individual and should be explored and fostered (if unharmful to others). I do not believe that one is either gay or straight, or bisexual. I don't even believe in Kinsey's idea of a sliding scale for sexual orientation, no, it is far more complex. There exists homosexual and heterosexual components of oneself in everyone, on various levels. There also exists a variety of "fetishes" and alternative sexual tendencies. So, no, I don't believe you are born pre-disposed to be any sort of way sexually.
 
Most people don't prefer foot play to get off, some people don't mind/may enjoy it, and a minority of people cant get off without feet.
 
Alex000 said:
I'm an absolute skeptic of significant genetic pre-disposition to sexual orientation. I believe most aspects of one's sexual orientation stem from their experiences from birth. This is not to minimize the importance of being sexually true to oneself, because it is something very unique to each individual and should be explored and fostered (if unharmful to others). I do not believe that one is either gay or straight, or bisexual. I don't even believe in Kinsey's idea of a sliding scale for sexual orientation, no, it is far more complex. There exists homosexual and heterosexual components of oneself in everyone, on various levels. There also exists a variety of "fetishes" and alternative sexual tendencies. So, no, I don't believe you are born pre-disposed to be any sort of way sexually.
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I agree with this.

It's silly to think that people are gay in the womb.
 
To imply that one is born homosexual seems to imply that homosexuality is a mental illness.
 
Not really. You can be born female. You can be born male. Do we call either a mental illness?
...
Frankly, whether one is born with a particular constellation of sexual desires appears beside the point. At no point do we choose our desires. Such is analytic within the concept of desire as such. The question, rather, is how can we mold the process of navigation of desire and subsequent construction of identity to enlarge the sphere of human freedom?

ebola
 
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