Shambles
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That's what almost everyone I know who's tried it says, DMT - very nice but a bit OTT to be doing with any kind of regularity.
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Anyone seen methamphetamine in the UK/Europe?
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jamesmartin
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Englands to small . In america and canada its made in the middle of nowhere where people cant find them!. In the uk and europe u cant get these places . Everywhere u go theres people in the uk . It has 65 million ppl crammed on that island . Its hard not to get caught making it ! Lol
Shambles
Bluelight Crew
You'd be surprised, James. Plenty of pokey rural hideaways for stashing labs. The area I live is famous (or certainly used to be) for it's LSD labs and they're pretty well hidden away :D
It's only really the major towns and cities that are more heavily populated - loads of parts of the country where you could lose yourself and a lab
It's only really the major towns and cities that are more heavily populated - loads of parts of the country where you could lose yourself and a lab
Crankinit
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Yes
Coke in Australia is a complete waste of time, no high is worth what we have to pay per gram. Probably why meth is so popular here, it's not just the junky crowd and the gay crowd who do it, it's anyone who likes stimulants and can't afford to dump over half a paycheck on a nights supply of coke.
Shambles - as an experienced drug user and someone with more experience with methamphetamine than most of the people on EADD, do you think it's a scary drug with worrying potential to fuck up a large number of people or do you think it's just another round of marajuana and crack style drug demonisation?
If none of the above please elaborate
If none of the above please elaborate
Shambles
Bluelight Crew
Hmm... I'm certainly not the only EADDer who's partaken but in my limited experience I don't see it as being inherently more worrisome than any other addictive drug really. As I mentioned above, when the option was there not many people took it. I think this is kinda interesting. The fact that it was one option amongst others and cost wasn't really relevant as it wasn't especially expensive made a huge difference I think. I also suspect the lack of hype and surrounding bullshit played a big part.
I think the problems with meth are mostly - if not entirely - down to the situation of the user. If it's cheap and available enough and you really want to forget about everything it's a good option but heroin does a similar job and so does alcohol and many other things. I don't think meth is necessarily any more likely to fuck people over unless they are already vulnerable to becoming addicted to a drug due to personal circumstance really.
If it were to suddenly become cheap and widespread I suspect a lot of people would get into a lot of difficulties due to curiosity from the hype that surrounds it now. If you didn't know what it was it's not so different from really high quality speed (in terms of fiending and the like) and would probably just see it as that. There aren't many speed addicts in the UK at the moment as far as I know so I don't think the drug itself is necessarily going to cause great swathes of addicts or we'd already have a big culture of serious speed abuse.
I think the problems with meth are mostly - if not entirely - down to the situation of the user. If it's cheap and available enough and you really want to forget about everything it's a good option but heroin does a similar job and so does alcohol and many other things. I don't think meth is necessarily any more likely to fuck people over unless they are already vulnerable to becoming addicted to a drug due to personal circumstance really.
If it were to suddenly become cheap and widespread I suspect a lot of people would get into a lot of difficulties due to curiosity from the hype that surrounds it now. If you didn't know what it was it's not so different from really high quality speed (in terms of fiending and the like) and would probably just see it as that. There aren't many speed addicts in the UK at the moment as far as I know so I don't think the drug itself is necessarily going to cause great swathes of addicts or we'd already have a big culture of serious speed abuse.
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The Kid
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You talking about yourself again, Shammy?
It seems odd that it's not mentioned more in EADD though.
Shambles
Bluelight Crew
You talking about yourself again, Shammy?
Hehe. Yup :D
I don't recall anybody mentioning having had any in the time I've been here unless they got some whilst abroad or are just reminiscing about the good ol' drugdays.
That's kind of the impression i got. Louis Theroux covered a particular town in america that had an especially bad situation, and it was down to the situation they were in and the cheap and easy availability of meph along with a lack of alternatives that lead to the widespread problems they were facing.
Thus it's not down to luck that the UK has not been affected - we are just not in the same situation as those parts of america where it is a problem. Hopefully that's not going to change but a recession combined with a significant reduction in quality and choice of other drugs might change it.
Although i still get the impression that someone taking meph 24/7 would do more damage to their body than someone taking heroin 24/7 over a 10 year period, assuming they both had access to good quality drugs and weren't completely stupid - stimulants are just bound to be harsher.
Shambles
Bluelight Crew
I'm pretty sure chronic meth (or other strong stimulant) use would do a hell of a lot more damage than opiates ever would, for sure.
I also think the difference in circumstance is quite possibly the main reason it's never taken off here. The areas where meth seems to have caused most problems in America (and I suspect Oz too) are the most deprived. In the UK we obviously have such areas but they are comparatively small. Personally, I don't think meth will take off in anything like the way it has in some parts of the world unless something fairly dramatic happens in terms of deprivation and desperation.
It's also odd that it's only really a big problem in America, Oz and parts of Asia. Given how cheap and easy it is to make with readily available materials it's odd that it doesn't seem to have taken hold in many other countries where you'd think it would - some of the poorer parts of Europe, for example. Heroin, alcohol and standard - if strong - speed ("Polish" speed, for example) seems to be much more popular.
I also think the difference in circumstance is quite possibly the main reason it's never taken off here. The areas where meth seems to have caused most problems in America (and I suspect Oz too) are the most deprived. In the UK we obviously have such areas but they are comparatively small. Personally, I don't think meth will take off in anything like the way it has in some parts of the world unless something fairly dramatic happens in terms of deprivation and desperation.
It's also odd that it's only really a big problem in America, Oz and parts of Asia. Given how cheap and easy it is to make with readily available materials it's odd that it doesn't seem to have taken hold in many other countries where you'd think it would - some of the poorer parts of Europe, for example. Heroin, alcohol and standard - if strong - speed ("Polish" speed, for example) seems to be much more popular.
Apparently meth has become more common in the Czech Republic and south/east of there, and some of the meth pills and powders have filtered through into eastern parts of Germany, which are generally poorer (still) than other areas. Dunno if that's fully true though, just remember reading about it somewhere? 
I think meth is around in Europe and the UK, just not on a widespread, organised scale, amphetamines are way more established and popular as "party" drugs. The idea of fucked up communities getting hooked on meth is pretty grim really... seems to be pretty real in some parts of the US and Aus.
I'm quite enjoying speed atm, n would give meth a try fo sho, although with caution. I kinda hate the thought of staying up for days, and if I did, i'd rather it was on something less toxic, like dexamphet or MDPV. It's used loads out in Asia by people who basically use it just to work hard enough to survive... yaba and stuff is enormously popular with tuk tuk drivers and such in some countries. I'm sure the addiction potential is there, but I don't think it'll automatically destroy health/life for most...
I think meth is around in Europe and the UK, just not on a widespread, organised scale, amphetamines are way more established and popular as "party" drugs. The idea of fucked up communities getting hooked on meth is pretty grim really... seems to be pretty real in some parts of the US and Aus.
I'm quite enjoying speed atm, n would give meth a try fo sho, although with caution. I kinda hate the thought of staying up for days, and if I did, i'd rather it was on something less toxic, like dexamphet or MDPV. It's used loads out in Asia by people who basically use it just to work hard enough to survive... yaba and stuff is enormously popular with tuk tuk drivers and such in some countries. I'm sure the addiction potential is there, but I don't think it'll automatically destroy health/life for most...
Shambles
Bluelight Crew
I've actually heard of some US tweakers who have switched to MDPV as their stim of choice. Can kinda see why too cos it's not a billion miles away. It's nowhere near as euphoric but has the horniness and general "tweak" of meth in a way. IV MDPV (tan stuff) I actually found was more euphoric and more intense than meth was IV. Has the added benefit of being cheap and legal too
That's interesting. Personally i seem to have a low tolerance to stimulants and find regular amphetamine too strong. I wouldn't even think about trying methamphetamine. My main stimulant of choice is caffiene in the form of tea, pg tips, hot.
For some reason however, mdpv seems to really agree with me. I've not experienced any paranoia up to about 15 or 20mg and not had too much trouble with the fiending some people report (although i will admit to redosing once or twice on a few occasions). I have only sampled the white stuff though. I was quite nervous when i first tried it so i'm surprised it's been so easy on me. I have only taken 100mg in total (over several weeks) so i'm not all that experienced with it.
It's never even given me much of a hangover beyond slight tiredness the next day, which is the minimum i'd expect from any proper stimulant really.
I think to add a note on this thread that the real hardcore meth users I came across in OZ were not from deprived backgrounds or living in deprived communities by any stretch of the imagination.
I did meet people that were scarily into it and they were intelligent beings who had not come from deprived backgrounds etc.
Alot of them were just standard recreational drug users / ravers etc. who had crossed a line (which I think is easily done with meth). Looking at the consequences I would be careful with this drug (although I also met many casual users who did not have a problem, I guess the same goes for pretty much any drug).
I liked its affects but it did leave me pretty twisted and moody (although I am not really suited to phet comedowns in general, that is if anyone actually enjoys them).
Will watch that Louis T show tonight as interested in this, still surprised it not surfaced in the UK and I have asked around alot and not even on the periphary of my networks,
I did meet people that were scarily into it and they were intelligent beings who had not come from deprived backgrounds etc.
Alot of them were just standard recreational drug users / ravers etc. who had crossed a line (which I think is easily done with meth). Looking at the consequences I would be careful with this drug (although I also met many casual users who did not have a problem, I guess the same goes for pretty much any drug).
I liked its affects but it did leave me pretty twisted and moody (although I am not really suited to phet comedowns in general, that is if anyone actually enjoys them).
Will watch that Louis T show tonight as interested in this, still surprised it not surfaced in the UK and I have asked around alot and not even on the periphary of my networks,
Shambles
Bluelight Crew
^ I would think that once a drug like meth is established in the more deprived areas it will naturally migrate to more affluent, mainsteam drug users just due to availability and "cool, ghetto" factors. Is my theory anyway.
The Louis Theroux documentary was shit, incidentally
You may disagree, of course
^^ The white stuff is a lot less potent and doesn't have the same feel to it as the tan really, MrM. Even so, it depends on how you take it. Snorting, eating and plugging don't have anywhere near the fiendish potential as vapourising (or also injecting in the case of the tan - injecting white peevee has no effect at all that I could discen oddly enough).
If you vape it then even the white stuff will have you up for days constantly redosing. The white seems to have more of a "ceiling effect" though - after a while it just sends me to sleep whereas the tan seems to keep its intensity for a lot longer. I could see tan peevee making a decent alternative to meth in some ways, although they are clearly quite different in many ways too.
I believe MDPV is the only 100% dopamine agonist which would explain the extreme fiending but relative lack of feelgood factor compared to amphetamines which also have serotonin activity maybe? Dunno, my chemistry is just not good enough but it's my "working hypothosis" - ie wasted wonderings :D
The Louis Theroux documentary was shit, incidentally
You may disagree, of course
^^ The white stuff is a lot less potent and doesn't have the same feel to it as the tan really, MrM. Even so, it depends on how you take it. Snorting, eating and plugging don't have anywhere near the fiendish potential as vapourising (or also injecting in the case of the tan - injecting white peevee has no effect at all that I could discen oddly enough).
If you vape it then even the white stuff will have you up for days constantly redosing. The white seems to have more of a "ceiling effect" though - after a while it just sends me to sleep whereas the tan seems to keep its intensity for a lot longer. I could see tan peevee making a decent alternative to meth in some ways, although they are clearly quite different in many ways too.
I believe MDPV is the only 100% dopamine agonist which would explain the extreme fiending but relative lack of feelgood factor compared to amphetamines which also have serotonin activity maybe? Dunno, my chemistry is just not good enough but it's my "working hypothosis" - ie wasted wonderings :D
I guess that makes sense but although I am one against media hype / outcry I see how Meth has alot of potential for abuse and damage having seen it first hand.
That said I would still take it myself (although responsibly as possible) as I think all drugs have this.
The reason I keep posting is that I think there must be other underlying factors which have prevented widespread use of Meth in the UK,
We have had preference to normal speed,
Access to better drugs (i.e. cocaine) vs. Australia etc.
A different culture / less deprivation?
None of these seem like concrete reasons to me given that there will always be some who get into things bigtime and then trends spread, just really pondering why this hasn't happened, maybe no one has the recipe?
Will still watch the Louis T thing, he does irritate me a bit though as always seems a bit patronising in his documentaries.
That said I would still take it myself (although responsibly as possible) as I think all drugs have this.
The reason I keep posting is that I think there must be other underlying factors which have prevented widespread use of Meth in the UK,
We have had preference to normal speed,
Access to better drugs (i.e. cocaine) vs. Australia etc.
A different culture / less deprivation?
None of these seem like concrete reasons to me given that there will always be some who get into things bigtime and then trends spread, just really pondering why this hasn't happened, maybe no one has the recipe?
Will still watch the Louis T thing, he does irritate me a bit though as always seems a bit patronising in his documentaries.
The Louis Theroux documentary was shit, incidentally
You may disagree, of course
^^ The white stuff is a lot less potent and doesn't have the same feel to it as the tan really, MrM. Even so, it depends on how you take it. Snorting, eating and plugging don't have anywhere near the fiendish potential as vapourising (or also injecting in the case of the tan - injecting white peevee has no effect at all that I could discen oddly enough).
If you vape it then even the white stuff will have you up for days constantly redosing. The white seems to have more of a "ceiling effect" though - after a while it just sends me to sleep whereas the tan seems to keep its intensity for a lot longer. I could see tan peevee making a decent alternative to meth in some ways, although they are clearly quite different in many ways too.
How do you go about vaporising it? I did try it once in a glass pipe with a bulb at the end with a hole in it where you apply the heat on one side of the glass and it vaporises the stuff in the glass bowl but i didn't have much success. What kind of pipe have you used?
I thought the louis theroux documentary was ok in as far as it went, but it felt incomplete and it didn't really go into much detail.
Shambles
Bluelight Crew
^ I chase it on tinfoil, MrM. The white stuff frazzles easily and leaves a lot of black and orangey crap behind. The tan runs clean and tastes like heroin - yum
Dose is around 5-10mg of the white but best to start low cos it can get very jittery and uncomfortable if you overdo it. GBL helps a lot if you have any to hand. Or benzos, but GBL seems to help more - benzos for the comedown.
I think those really are the main reasons it's never taken off in the UK. People here just aren't too fond of it when they try it and choose "better" drugs. That's certainly been my experience anyway. Certainly nothing to do with difficulty in acquiring the ingredients and making it cos people do - they just can't sell the stuff :D
On the Louis Theroux thing - the man's a legend but this documentary was pretty pointless, in my opinion. No depth to it at all![:\](https://bluelight.org/xf/BL_Images/Orig_Emoji/wrygrin.gif "wry grin :\")
Dose is around 5-10mg of the white but best to start low cos it can get very jittery and uncomfortable if you overdo it. GBL helps a lot if you have any to hand. Or benzos, but GBL seems to help more - benzos for the comedown.
We have had preference to normal speed,
Access to better drugs (i.e. cocaine) vs. Australia etc.
A different culture / less deprivation?
None of these seem like concrete reasons to me given that there will always be some who get into things bigtime and then trends spread, just really pondering why this hasn't happened, maybe no one has the recipe?
I think those really are the main reasons it's never taken off in the UK. People here just aren't too fond of it when they try it and choose "better" drugs. That's certainly been my experience anyway. Certainly nothing to do with difficulty in acquiring the ingredients and making it cos people do - they just can't sell the stuff :D
On the Louis Theroux thing - the man's a legend but this documentary was pretty pointless, in my opinion. No depth to it at all
Crankinit
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Problem with MDPV is the duration :/ I've looked into it as a replacement for meth and I still intend to give it a shot, but for most hardcore users and the majority of casual users, smoking is the ROA of choice with meth, and from what I'm told you're lucky if MDPV lasts an hour when smoked. Having to redose every hour is kind of a pain in the ass if you're doing anything other than sitting there smoking drugs.
The lack of neurotoxicity (I believe?) compared to meth is a big bonus though. That's what scares me about meth, not the addictive potential or the physical health effects, but how completely fried a lot of long term users end up. I'm very fond of my braincells and I've subjected them to enough abuse as it is.
The lack of neurotoxicity (I believe?) compared to meth is a big bonus though. That's what scares me about meth, not the addictive potential or the physical health effects, but how completely fried a lot of long term users end up. I'm very fond of my braincells and I've subjected them to enough abuse as it is.
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