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Anyone experienced simultaneous amphetamine & benzodiazipine withdrawal? (shortterm)

C

cuberun

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Nov 26, 2008
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Anyone experienced simultaneous amphetamine & benzodiazipine withdrawal? (shortterm)

Has anyone experienced amphetamine (sulfate in my case) and benzo / GABA agonist withdrawal simultaneously? (short term <30 days use. I seem to have a built in switch that just stops me from going past 3 weeks with benzos)
They've opposite effects that mostly cancel eachother out in use. The WD symptoms are opposite in the insomnia department/racing thoughts department, would this cause some odd preventation of insomnia; to me the worst part- don't really have to worry about other shit such as seizures as I haven't done the benzos long enough. The depression and lethargy I don't care about.


-- following is probably convoluted amph induced information pertaining to the question but not necessary --

I have used amphetamine for about 30 days. About 2 grams of high purity (92+%), no hero doses and not too many stay awake binges. Although with this purity it's quite a lot. Although my tolerance now I would require 50mg to feel "normal boosted focus" 75-100" probably for recreational use but, I haven't been using it recreationally. I've been using lower dosages and boosters lately too...

I've used GABA-a agonists for 23-24 days. used Phenibut (gaba-b£ for the first while but it loses efficiency quickly and has random effects and tolerance, but no cross tolerance with benzos for me.

I have no psychological desire or addiction to benzos and never have. I've withdrawn physically From them a few times 2-3 week max use. Only reason I get hooked on them is for amph crashes. This is the longest I've used amphetamine.

Should note that I had a two day break 10-8 days ago. During this break I used Phenibut which stopped amph craving and didn't experience that much of the gaba wd. Just the two day break sorted my tolerance quite a bit, even though Phenibut has some type of dopamine effect.

Now don't think I've ever had amphetamine wd before but I've survived GABA a&b wd which I can only assume is 10 times worse (mainly insomnia and dysphoria).

From what I read amph wd has opposite wd symptoms to (short term) gaba-a agonist use. People sleeping for 14 hours a day etc.

Will the sleepiness and fatigue somehow cancel the minor benzo wd I'll have (I've used quite heavy amounts mainly at the start but my tolerance hasn't changed. I only need 0.5 mg clonazepam / Xanax to counter speed effects and sleep- but I'm certain there'll be days of insomnia difficulty ( I will use Phenibut to resolve it at the worst point but. It anymore than that).

I actually have plenty of amph and GABA agonists left. Also have Some indica weed. But I figure I'll call it quits for a while before the benzos truly sink their physical addiction into me. Amph wd doesn't phase me.. Tbh the whole thing doesn't phase me. Not been on either of them long term.

I could just stop the amph first but, jus curious to know if in some magical strange way it will be better to wd from both simultaneously, I don't mind sleeping 16 hours a day while my gaba restores :) (mind this is all short term use but long enough to cause some wd)


(Irrelevant use list)
Used:
(in 24 past days with a 2 day break period 10-8 days ago)
8 x 15mg zopiclone (err.. whatever brand name it is)
19 x 10mg zolpidem (ambien)
28 mg alaprozolam (xanax)
22 mg clonazepam (klonopin)
110 mg nitrazepam (uh)

I haven't used zolpidem or nitrazepam for 2 weeks. xanax I used mainly for a few days at way higher dooses than required. I've been using mainly 1-0.5mg clonazepam. Didn't use xanax for a week until yesterday (only 0.5mg)
Fact that 0.5mg of clonez or xanax can sort me to sleep I supppose indicates that I don't really have much tolerance (even though the first few days I jumped right on taking 2-4mg xanaxes n shit).
I don't enjoy benzos on their own, or recreationally. I never use them on their own, I just use them to help come down from stims or if I feel a bit overstimmed.

I don't see the point in tapering since I've been using 0.5mg clonazepam recently I feel the HL should make it gentle enough.
Also I think I've been hitting different GABA-A subunits rather than acting on the same all the time which I think should give me a little leeway.

If I find it problematic I'll just take 0.25mg clonazepams or something and do a mini taper but I've come off worse.
 
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tl;dr go get some sleep.

I went cold turkey from dexies 30-40mg per day long time, nothing a coffee couldn't fix apart from a bit of depression but you just need to distract yourself. As for the benzos i been taking 20mg vals while on the dex, cut the dose in half since stopped the dex with no noticeable effects.

Taking benzos to counteract stims is a quick road to addiction and you need to stop now.
 
Yeah I have had both amp/Benzo w/d and amp/Ghb withdrawal simultaneously.

It's completely unpleasant as the best part of amp withdrawal is in that you can sleep off the depression, but with benzo withdrawals it's often impossible to sleep.

So I'm stuck in bed experiencing those superficial "omg life sucks" feelings and am not able to sleep.
 
If you're having withdrawals from BENZO-(or alc,ghb) - do not use ANY STIMULENT. I know it would on good ionyour mood but BENZO wd would be VERY bad and even a leveling amount of a stim would be bad. A different drug but GABA - whem I was addicted/dependent on GBL I could not use stims without it or benzos - usually going out I would hit the mephedrone, without calming myself I'd snort 30-50mg and feeel like I was gunna die (heart racey) so it was a Xanax or GBL - I remember that night ages ago 30-50 near killed me (well felt) till 0.5mg Xanax was done then it became 300-500 LOL!!!! STIMS should be avoided with benzo wd.

I once felt aweful I messed up with my ddu and had no script it worked out for two week so I lived on Heroin nw normally heroin wd may not be bad but it would for someone who's prevously been on a bupe/done script etc - I mostly survived but at the end I was fooked day before bupe starts none, no h it was getting late so I just never slept I wanted to be sure I get myself there and all that morning, non! I finally had GBL though too so fuck it, boshed it then thought fuck that Methylone and hammered both till I overcame the wds and went in early I never wanted to say I did 36-48hr wo/ he may think your wds aren't that bad you'd be better fighing it off for a few more.I told him roughlty 24hr hoping to get more bupe and I weny to 6 (from 4) MG. Was hoping for 8-10MG but I just wanted out the bus home was near an hr or seven hours I should say, bupe done and felt better later though the heroin came about that night and Methylone was -lonely - no idea why I told this think it's the same though OPIATE WD + USING STIMS isn't a good idea but not for the reason of benzos just stims thrash you just till you can get your opiate, benzos wd+ stim might kill. The day after 12mg bupe then 16mg of bupe day after (this is as bupe treatment needs a step dose)

During this OPIATE WD time I had BENZO/GBL withdrawal too. Now at a peak that would be mental.

Just read your thread more.


I know when Mephedrone was popular necking 40mg of Diazapam at night was the thing for alot of people. I used to say it soo much NOT to, people got used to it and ignored LOL - serious note alot of those people stopped Meph for days or holidays or when banned or cannie of got any and Meph was fine but day or so after Diazapam wd hits and they know they've a problem. EVEN using DIAZAPAM twice a week and it's long enough to always be in you considering people try jumping off 2-5mg (even .2mg-1mg) so it's really not a coming down thing. Insted shorter half life, Xanax would be MUCH better for that - that's what I used or GHB/GBL when needed would mininise the risk. Bottom line you want the drug for sleep, so it's needed for an hour or so to get you out for the cout having it in your system for more than needed aint good. I get what you're saying, you can't stim without summit to help you kip, I stim daily on RITALIN/MPH/ETH (amp-like) - I use GBL to sleep, however I've been addicted to it (GBL) on and off for 5 years and grew diazapam addicted too which I am tapering off quick. If you think benzos feeel nice sometimes, I agree but once dependent they don't even hitting alot more just makes you in three days have less trouble remembering stuff.
 
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Hello.

I agree benzo WD's I know are hell, but I think I got lucky somehow. I've gotten WD's from just 2-3 weeks of xanax. a 1.5 week of etizolam high dosage (3-4mg a day). Although once I used 250mg etizolam (powder) no tolerance somehow IN 4-5 days and had no real wd other than a restless night or two (well not really, it wouold've been but I took doxylamine and phenibut to sleep fine since neither have cross tolerance). Since then I opted against acquiring large amounts of benzos in powder form. Especially a euphoric one such as etizolam.

Just an upate.
So basically i ran out of the amphetamine after using it for 30 days. I just couldn't stop it. I had some 50% dutch 1g in addition which I used up rather quick once the good stuff ran out.
At this point I was only using 0.5mg clonazepam a day and it was still efficient enough. I mixed in a day of zopiclone here and there instead of the clonazepam.

I did experience the Amphetamine WD. During this time I kept taking and doing a quick taper of the benzos. The amphetamine WD was nothing really, I felt a little depressed and SLEPT a lot. Like I could go to sleep on demand. At first I didn't realize it was the amph WD since I never had one before. On day 6 post using amphetamine for 30 days I suddenly felt quite good and normal again.
I decided not to quit both at the same time and just quit the amphetamine first (Well, I ran out of amphetamine first). As I've read taking a stim during Benzo WD is near suicidal.

So I used the mix of benzos, quite a large amount over 35 days or so.. I found the tapering with clonazepam effortless. I actually found 10mg diazepam too. The last 4 days I took (2days) .25mg clonazepam and (2days) 5mg diazepam and it had no negative effect dropping to that from previously taking 2mg xanax / clonazepam a day.

Then I quit taking it all together. I was bracing for at least a weeks WD or something... but, 24 hours past- nothing.. 48 hours past. I felt some difficulty sleeping so I took 1.5g phenibut and fell asleep feeling nice. Since diazepam and clonazepam have long half-lives I thought the WD might start at the 3 day mark but nothing.

Very very strange. This is the longest time I've taken benzos and it seems I just had no WD at all. I got lucky I suppose but.. I did mix and use different benzodiazipines. In fact the last few days when I only required 0.5mg to stop an amphetamine high.. I was feeling quite positive because I thought my tolerance would've ramped up quite a bit so that 0.5 mg wouldn't be enough.

I took phenibut (gaba-b agonist) for 2 days maybe this stopped some light insomnia but... I actually felt perfectly fine. THe amphetamine WD was really nothing compared to benzo/phenibut WD's i've had. All I had to do was sleep mostly!

I think If I had been taking the same benzo, such as xanax for the 35 days I would've had a bad WD. I just got lucky I guess by mixing up the benzodiazipines and z-drugs. Also the 2 day break in the middle of the 35-36 day use of the benzos might've helped.

I used quite a lot in the end. (Might've been more, can't be bothered counting my stash)

11 x 15mg zopiclone (err.. whatever brand name it is)
19 x 10mg zolpidem (ambien)
34 mg alaprozolam (xanax)
30 mg clonazepam (klonopin)
140 mg nitrazepam

I'm quite confused and GLAD I didn't have a benzo WD. i don't know the exact reasons for this as I've experienced benzo WD from just 3 weeks of use, of lesser quantities. I mean I used like 49mg xanax in 2 weeks and had some WD for 4-5 days. Perhaps using different benzos and z-drugs- in conjuction with a drug that cancels CNS depressant action a bit helped me get lucky. At the end I only used clonazepam/nitrazepam and the 10mg diazepam in low dosages for a quick mini taper (4 days mini taper)

I still have 20mg xanax, some nitrazepam, zolpidem and zopiclone left. I've absolutely no urge to use them. I don't enjoy benzodiazippines alone recreationally (the only one I enjoy is etizolam but that only creates euphoric effects for 2-3 days of use). Oh and doxylamine really helped me sleep too.

I understand benzos are very easy to get addicted to but personally I have no affinity for htem other than assisting with stim comedowns / anxieties. That said, if you're GOING to get into a short habit... maybe there's some merit to getting a variety of z-drugs and benzos to come down from the amphetamine.

I read that zolpidem effects the least amount of GABA-a subunits and I used this for the main days. Zopiclone more subunits while stuff like diazepam and clonazepam affect all I believe. The xanax I never used for more than 2 days at a time then a 4 day break while using other downers (kpins, nitrazepam, z-drugs).

I did smoke about a gram or two of Santa Maria (very indica anti anxiety like strain) the days following quitting mostly out of boredom at not having amphetamine anymore.

TL;DR.

Took lotsa different benzos and z-drugs for 35 days or more- oddly enough had no WD. Did have amphetamine WD from 30 days daily use which was a walk in the park!
I really advice anyone against it. I just got lucky I guess.

Right now I'm clean off everything. Next time I get amphetamine sulfate I'll make sure just to get 1 weeks worth and not use every day. I don't wanna gamble and get lucky, and I don't want to sleep 16 hours a day for 6 days either :) Don't screw with your GABA-A receptors... but if you do, I think zolpidem is best for me at elast to sleep after amphetamine. Short half-life and effect GABA-A the least.
Phenibut might also be an option (but this causes WD same as benzos after a much shorter period).
 
Tony Williams said:
If you're having withdrawals from BENZO-(or alc,ghb) - do not use ANY STIMULENT. I know it would on good ionyour mood but BENZO wd would be VERY bad and even a leveling amount of a stim would be bad. A different drug but GABA - whem I was addicted/dependent on GBL I could not use stims without it or benzos - usually going out I would hit the mephedrone, without calming myself I'd snort 30-50mg and feeel like I was gunna die (heart racey) so it was a Xanax or GBL - I remember that night ages ago 30-50 near killed me (well felt) till 0.5mg Xanax was done then it became 300-500 LOL!!!! STIMS should be avoided with benzo wd.

I once felt aweful I messed up with my ddu and had no script it worked out for two week so I lived on Heroin nw normally heroin wd may not be bad but it would for someone who's prevously been on a bupe/done script etc - I mostly survived but at the end I was fooked day before bupe starts none, no h it was getting late so I just never slept I wanted to be sure I get myself there and all that morning, non! I finally had GBL though too so fuck it, boshed it then thought fuck that Methylone and hammered both till I overcame the wds and went in early I never wanted to say I did 36-48hr wo/ he may think your wds aren't that bad you'd be better fighing it off for a few more.I told him roughlty 24hr hoping to get more bupe and I weny to 6 (from 4) MG. Was hoping for 8-10MG but I just wanted out the bus home was near an hr or seven hours I should say, bupe done and felt better later though the heroin came about that night and Methylone was -lonely - no idea why I told this think it's the same though OPIATE WD + USING STIMS isn't a good idea but not for the reason of benzos just stims thrash you just till you can get your opiate, benzos wd+ stim might kill. The day after 12mg bupe then 16mg of bupe day after (this is as bupe treatment needs a step dose)

During this OPIATE WD time I had BENZO/GBL withdrawal too. Now at a peak that would be mental.

Just read your thread more.


I know when Mephedrone was popular necking 40mg of Diazapam at night was the thing for alot of people. I used to say it soo much NOT to, people got used to it and ignored LOL - serious note alot of those people stopped Meph for days or holidays or when banned or cannie of got any and Meph was fine but day or so after Diazapam wd hits and they know they've a problem. EVEN using DIAZAPAM twice a week and it's long enough to always be in you considering people try jumping off 2-5mg (even .2mg-1mg) so it's really not a coming down thing. Insted shorter half life, Xanax would be MUCH better for that - that's what I used or GHB/GBL when needed would mininise the risk. Bottom line you want the drug for sleep, so it's needed for an hour or so to get you out for the cout having it in your system for more than needed aint good. I get what you're saying, you can't stim without summit to help you kip, I stim daily on RITALIN/MPH/ETH (amp-like) - I use GBL to sleep, however I've been addicted to it (GBL) on and off for 5 years and grew diazapam addicted too which I am tapering off quick. If you think benzos feeel nice sometimes, I agree but once dependent they don't even hitting alot more just makes you in three days have less trouble remembering stuff.
Click to expand...

If you're still addicted to GBL I suggest "downgrading" to perhaps phenibut. It's cross-tolerant but I think it has less side effects and isn't as strong as GBL. Effects GABA-B as well. Use the phenibut, taper it. Then if you have no benzo addiction you can use benzos for 5-6 days to nullify the phenibut WD. I've done this before. If you're addicted to both benzos and GBL you're pretty screwed lol. I really suggest you QUIT the GBL FIRST. Then taper the diazepam. Not the other way around. I believe the GABA-B agonists lower your seizure threshhold so you're better off quitting the GABA-b's before the benzos. Personally I don't enjoy benzos since by themselves since they just make me a bit dumb & numb. Only flunitrazepam and etizolam are bad for me so I don't use those at all.

Ritalin & mephedrone are quite different from amphetamine sulfate (mine was very high purity dextro type- low on bodyload etc didn't make me super horny). Mephedrone is probably way more dangerous I would never use it long term, as I believe it touches serotonin quite a bit (from my understanding dopamine + serotonin release simultaneously causes, supposedely more neurotoxocity- but might be wrong.. I know meth has serotonergic effect too which makes it more neurotoxic than regular amph). Ritalin is a Dopamine reuptake inhibitor like cocaine rather than amphetamine sulfate which just increases/releases dopamine levels.
Personally I don't enjoy ritalin/coke at all since they last so short and have heavy bodyload (especially coke) compared to some nice pure amph sulfate.

If you really need your dopamine tickled perhaps you should get on a dopamine releaser type drug instead of these DNRI. A script of dexedrine/vyvansee.. Or just quit em. I know mephedrone is super unresearched (I've used it a few times fine but)... that stuff really seems to be quite toxic vs ritalin and regular amphetamines.

FYI I'm not using anything right now, sorry for the long posts I'm a quick typer..
 
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I think the reason you're not having problems is because you're taking phenibut. It's alleviating/masking the benzo withdrawal for now. No way you can take that many benzos and not withdrawl painfully (I'm sorry- given what you have said about previous experience with benzos and withdrawal it doesn't make much sense)

When was the last time you took phenibut? What dose did you take it at?

Diazepam withdrawal can start up to a week after your last dose. I don't mean to scare you, but you're not exactly in clear water yet. Clonazepam is a particularly difficult benzo to stop ontop of niterazepam.

Zolpidem is the last thing I sugges anyone to use if you're abusig amphetamines. I did the same, and it ended up becoming ineffective so I started snorting it, I ten started hallucinating and doing crazy shut. The best stuff to take is promethazine. Knocks your lights out, doesn't interfere with sleep quality and stops those weird thoughts you have after binging on phet.
 
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I said I only took phenibut for 2 days if you read it. I haven't taken phenibut for 3 days now. I develop tolerance and wd from phenibut rapidly, from only 3-4 days I'll get small WD from it.

I'm perfectly fine. Diazepam withdrawal can start up to 1 week for super long term users yea.. I took 2x5 mg valium total and my last diazepam dose was 7 days ago. (I enter all drugs I take into a stopwatch app that allows labels and multiple stop watches) 10mg diazepam isn't exactly gonna build up.. I've been feeling normal for the past 3 days. I'm not gonna start having some crazy super delayed WD from 35 days of benzo use.

I hate promethazine. Doxylamine works better for me.
Maybe you do crazy shit on it. Some people do, some people don't. I just sleep on it. I never snorted it either. I didn't take it every day, I said I cycled. I've no idea why the hell you would snort zolpidem and what doses? It's known to cause psychotic behaviour especially in higher doses. I generally avoid snorting shit as much as possible... why snort a bunch of fkn binders if you've been snorting "phet"? What phet are you talking about anyhow? meth?
I used a super pure low bodyload labtested amphetamine sulfate. Never had any insane moments.

I don't do really do that many "binges".. I don't know what you mean by that.

I'm so sorry I didn't have painful withdrawal for you. I had WD's from other benzos because I used the one and same benzo and I wasn't using in tandem with amphetamine then.

I don't know the exact specifics of why I didn't WD, but I'm guessing it's because I used different GABA-a agonists every day. Different benzos and z-drugs act on diff GABA-a subunits if you didn't know... Zolpidem acts on the least subunits. Even less than zopiclone despite hitting harder.

I'm super experienced with phenibut. My standard dose is 1.5g. WD from phenibut usually starts at 32 hour mark and I don't get wd's from phenibut after only 2 days. 3 days I'll get an agitated third day. I'll dose 1.5g start of day then 800mg for sleep. Phenibut main effects generally wear out after 10 hours tops for me.

Snorting/taking more than 10mg zolpidem prone to do whack stuff. Although I took 15mg a few times and was fine. It's also all subjective. I've never been long term addicted to benzodiazipines. Xanax and etizolam are both short acting and etizolam isn't even a true benzo.

Thanks for trying but I'm fine... it'd make sense if you read it all properly.
 
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