Okay, guys. I swear that I am not yet a meth addict. I tend to have a strong resistance to addiction, and I only use methamphetamine on occasion. For whatever reason (perhaps my disorder), I feel no dopamine rush from the stuff. Only the seratonin and the body high, and the focus (which is primarily why I enjoy the rare occasions). Nonetheless, my brain seems to have automatically trained itself to irrationally search the floor for no damn reason. I've done it with coke when coming down, obviously feeling a bit like an addict. But that was more rational and shameful due to the cash and those quick, dirty comedowns. With meth, though, I can have a quarter ounce of dope in front of me for the taking and still unthinkingly start searching and get horribly stuck on the floor. I swear I can't even avert my gaze at times. It doesn't happen when I'm sober or I'm coming down or even when I'm out of dope. It usually happens with a full (well, considering my usage) bag in front of me after I've just done a nice rail or smoked a bowl. Sometimes right after I've begun the night. I hate getting stuck like this, as it seems I usually just have to ride out the experience for hours. For no darn good reason. If I were jonesin, it would at least make sense to me, and I would get the heck away from the dope. But I believe this happened almost automatically even the first time I got high, when I was slightly convinced that something had fallen. But now I just get so, so focused. And I usually end up warning myself not to do it, or praying that I won't. Which basically ensures that I do. I know I can enjoy this stuff responsibly once a month or so, but this situation can really hinder my enjoyment at times. I was just wondering if anyone knew any tips for getting unstuck from this or any other activity, for that matter. I know I should get involved in something else. I get just as focused and stuck on other things, and it's definitely difficult to pull away. But searching irrationally is such a darn waste of time and of the high. Please no lectures about the drug. I know the risks, though I've been doing meth about once a month for a year now. I'll take my own chances. I was just wondering if anyone could provide any advice, maybe something you've discovered over the years that might help me get the most out of my recreational experiences. Some trick for altering my focus. I really want to enjoy it responsibly, but if I cannot get away from this situation, I might just give up use completely. I know that's a good idea, but I'm really not ready if I don't have to be. So anything, please? Maybe I'm doing too much for my tolerance? Just getting too tweaked?
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OD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic
Stimulants Any tips for getting unstuck (esp crack crawl)
- Thread starter soneal97
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Crashing
Bluelighter
Just a thought, but maybe meth is bringing out a latent mental abnormality.. Obsessive Compulsion comes to mind. But you said you have a disorder already, so that must play a significant role in this. The activity you are describing seems like a product of psychosis, even though meth often causes fixation, this seems to be a unique case. How much are you actually doing and are you on medication?
I do enough to get me wired, more than just laid back and euphoric. (my first experiences with small lines were the opposite of "speediness") Not an unreasonable amount, though. I can sit still if I need to. Maintain. I'm not sure how I'd estimate the dosage. But I'm not really geeked out and sweating and paranoid like some of the fellows I know who'll drop fifteen or twenty and freak me out a little with their intensity. It's still pretty mellow. I don't really stay up, and the dosage is moderate enough to feel like a clean high, otherwise. I have ADHD. Crazy excessive energy when I'm sober. I don't think I have nearly as much loose energy after my doses. The energy I have is just more focused.
I'm not on medication at all. Was diagnosed when younger, but my parents don't really believe in using drugs, even for legitimate, legal purposes. So never had any amp or anything similar. Just lived with it. My first amphetamine experience was meth for recreation. Is psychosis not always the result of a lack of sleep caused by the stimulant? Could it be induced even when I'm completely rested and alert? First hit of the night?
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Captain.Heroin
Bluelight Crew
You are experiencing compulsions to go through the carpet? Stop using methamphetamine, don't do it anymore. The compulsions to do OCD like tendencies make me absolutely dislike other people who use stimulants.
It's not a good drug to be using.
It's not a good drug to be using.
sekio
Bluelight Crew
The reason meth leads to compulsive behaviour is thought to relate to its powerful monaomine release interfering with reward pathways in the brain. The release of dopamine in particulare is known to cause complusive tic-like behaviours - from picking at skin, to cleaning, to, sex, to playing WoW, to chain smoking, to taking apart alarm clocks and reassembling them. It's an overarching side effect of amphetamines being 'focus drugs'. In the extreme case they will make you focus on whatever seems the most rewarding at the time, because your brain has just been encouraged by a humongous burst of reward chemicals.
Tics are either a sign your dose is too high, or meth interferes with your reward circuitry in ways that you don't like.
Try reducing your dose, and be sure to stay well hydrated and well-fed. Or, smoke your ice somewhere else, that is well-lit and not carpeted, and set an alarm on your phone or something so you can leave the area and be assured there's no crumbs left after your session. Another alternative might be to hang out and do your ice with someone who will remind you when you inadvertently go on floor patrol.
You could also try snorting, plugging, or eating your speed instead as all of those routes result in less of a humongous rush of monoamines getting you fucked up, and a more gradual climb into stimulation.
If you find the tics remain even with small doses, you probably should stop using meth - as C.H. points out nobody really likes hanging out around people who have drug induced compulsions.
Tics are either a sign your dose is too high, or meth interferes with your reward circuitry in ways that you don't like.
Try reducing your dose, and be sure to stay well hydrated and well-fed. Or, smoke your ice somewhere else, that is well-lit and not carpeted, and set an alarm on your phone or something so you can leave the area and be assured there's no crumbs left after your session. Another alternative might be to hang out and do your ice with someone who will remind you when you inadvertently go on floor patrol.
You could also try snorting, plugging, or eating your speed instead as all of those routes result in less of a humongous rush of monoamines getting you fucked up, and a more gradual climb into stimulation.
If you find the tics remain even with small doses, you probably should stop using meth - as C.H. points out nobody really likes hanging out around people who have drug induced compulsions.
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Meth specifically, eh? I certainly don't get these effects from cocaine. On the contrary, I lack the ability to focus when I get blitzed the way I like on some llelo, and I definitely can't function in public. Then again, I'm also much happier and higher, smiling like a madman. I know I'm smoking correctly, and yet I swear I've never gotten a dopamine rush like I get from good coke. I suppose it's just the makeup of my brain. I mean, if I feel no rush, I suppose it is a little ridiculous to be attacking my dopamine receptors for no reason. I see others high as hell, but I just can't get there. I'll blame it on the makeup of my brain. I'll adjust the dosage, perhaps so that it is equivalent to a pharmaceutical dose of adderrall. Screw the high. Give it a couple more tries. After that, I guess I'll seriously consider saving my health. But that means I'll be going back to coke, I'm sure. And with the ridiculous impurity and bunk stuff everywhere I look, it's going to be much more expensive and much more of a hassle. And I still crave the stuff on occasion when drinking, so bleh.
People swear I'm crazy or think I'm lying, but I can be blitzed on the seratonin from smoking, but with no mental high. And I can do a line of coke while I'm otherwise spun out and strongly feel the euphoria that wasn't there before. Just, what?
I do have quite the fear of meth's neurotoxicity, but I have heard that MDMA is even more neurotoxic. On a once a month basis, using my multivitamins and supplements, I'm not too uncomfortable with my usage. I never stay up, I use all the harm reduction techniques I could dig up, and give my mind ample time to recover. I believe in strict moderation. And only taking a couple huge hits to get high, not continuous smoking throughout the night. Only redosing when necessary. I trust myself. But sorry I'm the sort of fella that annoys you, Captain Heroin. I can understand, though. I would annoy myself if I saw me in that condition. Maybe it's just time to stop living hard.
People swear I'm crazy or think I'm lying, but I can be blitzed on the seratonin from smoking, but with no mental high. And I can do a line of coke while I'm otherwise spun out and strongly feel the euphoria that wasn't there before. Just, what?
I do have quite the fear of meth's neurotoxicity, but I have heard that MDMA is even more neurotoxic. On a once a month basis, using my multivitamins and supplements, I'm not too uncomfortable with my usage. I never stay up, I use all the harm reduction techniques I could dig up, and give my mind ample time to recover. I believe in strict moderation. And only taking a couple huge hits to get high, not continuous smoking throughout the night. Only redosing when necessary. I trust myself. But sorry I'm the sort of fella that annoys you, Captain Heroin. I can understand, though. I would annoy myself if I saw me in that condition. Maybe it's just time to stop living hard.
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Captain.Heroin
Bluelight Crew
It's more disturbing than annoying. I've seen people go through stuff like tics and compulsions. It's hard for me to watch someone go through stuff like that because it's in general unnerving to watch someone go through that.
It's really the only particular thing I've found myself doing compulsively, so it is a little out there. I usually put in a ton of effort and tear myself away if I'm around a group. But if I get home, still high, and by myself.. I'm going to try my best to practice self-control. I think a lot of times I can't quite decide what I want to do with my time, and that increases the chances of it happening. Lack of brain stimulation, maybe. Too much sitting around doing nothing in a group. I'll want to talk sometimes and the others will be focusing intently on Scratch-Off Bingos all night or something like that, not really into conversation. I've finally started joining in lately, and I certainly get into it. But these guys have fun with scratch offs sober. Not my thing. I need to pick up a guitar, read a book. Something. I bet it's my environment and the people around me while smoking that contribute to this problem. They're all doing something and I'm just sitting there letting my mind drift into nothingness.
Professer
Bluelighter
Can I ask what a 'necessary' situation would be?
You sound like you've got some skills with self control/moderation and have a good head on your shoulders, but never underestimate the power of this stuff. Even with all that mentality, it can be easy to trick yourself into thinking that you're a bit better than you actually are and slip under.
I like to use stims on occasion too. I only have experience with Vyvanse and Ritalin so far. I was plugging the mehtylphenidate for a really nice rush, but it'd peak within 30min and I'd feel bad coming down after 1hr. Was too much of a chaser, rise/crash drug given the nature of my chosen ROA. It also lent itself to a bit over-excessive re dosing. I tend to prefer slow come up's, a plateau, and a slow comedown in a drug so naturally vyvanse appealed to me. Much easier to resist taking more since I can still feel some of the stimulation 24hrs after red dosing, and I typically wouldn't want to be stimmed up more than 24 hrs.
Anyways, I hope you maintain a balance that works for you. Be very careful though, these are powerful substances. Don't have much to add about the compulsive behavior. I tend to want to pull out facial/nose hairs, they really bother me. I can resist it or catch myself and not give into it.
so I guess I default instead of doing what I want to do. Being productive, because I see the potential. It's just seems awkward for me to be doing my own thing in a group, even if they wouldn't give one darn, being in their own little worlds.
Professer
Bluelighter
I should add, I too do find it somewhat difficult to find things to do and stick to while stimming. So far it only seems like talking, listening to music, reading, and playing guitar are the few enjoyable activities I can do with the high. Otherwise I'm just floating between random things, or just sitting and listening to music and enjoying the feelsgood.
Hmm. When I first started, I was used to cocaine. So I wanted to redose compulsively like I had become accustomed to, but I was told of the dangers and especially the waste, lol (by a tweaker friend of mine. The only regular user I actually trust, to be honest.
Very functional, somehow). So even if I start with what I consider an inadequate dose, I allow several hours (five to six, usually) to pass before I do anything else. And because these experiences aren't really binges, I really only redose a couple of times at all over
the period of my use. Plus, with smoking especially, one more hit than I need can tire me out and make me sleepy enough to feel strung out after a while, but never enough to actually fall asleep. Same with snorting.
Too much rush can make the experience miserable very quickly if I'm not careful. I heard that sleepiness is like the lightheadedness you feel after an orgasm. I've never been able to sleep for hours after sex, so even if I did stupidly overdo it on purpose to knock
myself out, it wouldn't work. I'd just hate myself. I've seen others doing too much over a period of time who have fallen asleep after the exhaustion and the hits. I can NEVER fall asleep. I'll be wired but tired as hell until the comedown. So it's not even the neurotoxicity
or the addictiveness that keeps me careful, just my want to actually enjoy the experience. Meth has WEIRD effects on different people, it seems. And I seem to get strung out much faster than some others, I know. So binging isn't fun at all. I gave up the idea after
the first couple times I did it. Just not worth the sketchiness. And once I've overdone it, that one hit too many can just zap the high away.
Very functional, somehow). So even if I start with what I consider an inadequate dose, I allow several hours (five to six, usually) to pass before I do anything else. And because these experiences aren't really binges, I really only redose a couple of times at all over
the period of my use. Plus, with smoking especially, one more hit than I need can tire me out and make me sleepy enough to feel strung out after a while, but never enough to actually fall asleep. Same with snorting.
Too much rush can make the experience miserable very quickly if I'm not careful. I heard that sleepiness is like the lightheadedness you feel after an orgasm. I've never been able to sleep for hours after sex, so even if I did stupidly overdo it on purpose to knock
myself out, it wouldn't work. I'd just hate myself. I've seen others doing too much over a period of time who have fallen asleep after the exhaustion and the hits. I can NEVER fall asleep. I'll be wired but tired as hell until the comedown. So it's not even the neurotoxicity
or the addictiveness that keeps me careful, just my want to actually enjoy the experience. Meth has WEIRD effects on different people, it seems. And I seem to get strung out much faster than some others, I know. So binging isn't fun at all. I gave up the idea after
the first couple times I did it. Just not worth the sketchiness. And once I've overdone it, that one hit too many can just zap the high away.
GustavoFring
Bluelighter
I'd probably give up the shard man. Two my friends ended up in institutions and both were heavy carpet crawlers -- Magnifying glasses were used one time.
Yeah. I know I need to give up everything. Alcohol was my thing in the past, and maybe it should be again. I still overdo it, but at least it's not QUITE as damaging. I've always said I'm not addicted to anything specifically, just inebriation in general. Have some pothead friends who continuously ask why I don't just smoke weed. Honest truth: don't like it. Go back to it every once in a while, even the good stuff, and it's just not something I can maintain. My taste is unfortunately for hard drugs, so it's going to be all or nothing at all. Weed just pisses me off in habitual use. Doesn't seem right as a social drug. Like other hallucinogens, I'd rather have a purpose before getting stoned. Just no purely recreational appeal. and jesus, dirt weed is the worst high I've known. I've smoked ice to get the hell away from it.
GustavoFring
Bluelighter
Do you experience any OCD symptoms when smoking weed?
I know it's supposed to be so strong, but I know that dopamine release is the real addictive point of stimulants, and even if I'm getting that release, I swear I've never felt it. I have a friend who always goes on about the positivity and contentedness he gets from it, regardless of the ROA. He's a little manic depressive anyway, so I get a bit worried about him at times. Even my first time with the stuff, no mood change whatsoever. So I don't crave any mental euphoria. I know what a dopamine release feels like, and it's always missing from my experiences. I'm a little grateful for it, I guess, because I can't imagine anything greater than the head rush from good coke. Maybe it would do me in. Me and my bro for the longest while had the impression that all meth did was keep you awake. Never understood the appeal. Good quality stuff, and pretty much nothing but awakeness or wiredness. Never got a high at all until smoking, and then it was only the body high. Where's the head rush? Frustrates me terribly cause I could never identify with others who just get blitzed as hell on the stuff. Kept saying it's "the stronger drug" compared to coke, and I just thought they were insane. Still prefer coke. I like what effects I do get, but that amazing, incomparable euphoria.. nah. Never even got close.
Not denying it's there. I guess I'm just incapable of that high, for whatever reason. Has to be me. Makes me feel left out sometimes, though. I mean, meth having anything on crack doesn't seem even possible to me. Crack is a ridiculously short-lived god taking over your body. Meth compares? When? Better? You're insane. Some people can do fire cocaine several times and just not get the appeal. Tell me they don't like stimulants. To me, it has nothing to do with being wired, it's the mental euphoria that's impossible to resist. But some others don't understand, and I guess I'm the same way with meth. We are so completely lost to each other, these people and I. Really wish I understood. The quick transition to addiction doesn't make sense for me at all, personally. It's just always seems so underwhelming for a hardcore stimulant, more useful for completing tasks. Or having the time pass by if you need it to. Most anything can make me "happier" and smile more, even weed. It feels incomplete. Though I know it would rewire my brain after a while, regardless, forcing me to crave it. Or at least catch me with the running down of the body and the needing it to move after daily use. Just, the high itself. Mind blowing? Nah. But a friend and I can do the same dosage, and he goes crazy, loses self control, while I'm just staring wondering how we could have just done the same substance. Shoot, I know a guy who's been tweaking for years and tolerance doesn't seem to matter. We'll both do a large amount and he'll be tweaking and talking at a thousand miles an hour while I'm just sort of there..
OCD with weed? Nah, it brings out anxiety. Makes me nervous. Even when I've developed a tolerance.
Not denying it's there. I guess I'm just incapable of that high, for whatever reason. Has to be me. Makes me feel left out sometimes, though. I mean, meth having anything on crack doesn't seem even possible to me. Crack is a ridiculously short-lived god taking over your body. Meth compares? When? Better? You're insane. Some people can do fire cocaine several times and just not get the appeal. Tell me they don't like stimulants. To me, it has nothing to do with being wired, it's the mental euphoria that's impossible to resist. But some others don't understand, and I guess I'm the same way with meth. We are so completely lost to each other, these people and I. Really wish I understood. The quick transition to addiction doesn't make sense for me at all, personally. It's just always seems so underwhelming for a hardcore stimulant, more useful for completing tasks. Or having the time pass by if you need it to. Most anything can make me "happier" and smile more, even weed. It feels incomplete. Though I know it would rewire my brain after a while, regardless, forcing me to crave it. Or at least catch me with the running down of the body and the needing it to move after daily use. Just, the high itself. Mind blowing? Nah. But a friend and I can do the same dosage, and he goes crazy, loses self control, while I'm just staring wondering how we could have just done the same substance. Shoot, I know a guy who's been tweaking for years and tolerance doesn't seem to matter. We'll both do a large amount and he'll be tweaking and talking at a thousand miles an hour while I'm just sort of there..
OCD with weed? Nah, it brings out anxiety. Makes me nervous. Even when I've developed a tolerance.
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Man from all your posts I would avoid meth like the black plague. I know you say that you can control it but honestly man there's no controlling something that hijacks your brain on the neurological level and gives it everything that it is programmed to want out of life.
You know, I'm honestly and strangely (at least according to most) the happiest and most laidback person I've ever known. I'm the last person in the world who would use any drug to fill a gap or cover up an underlying issue. I don't really feel that I have any. Never
sad, never angry, never pessimistic. Things just roll off of me. Even if I did get a dopamine release, it wouldn't be making up for anything. I have to go all out to enjoy euphoria from a drug, because it's very difficult for me to feel any happier than I feel naturally. If
anything, ice calms my exuberance and levels me out. A subtle coke high? I wouldn't feel it, honestly. It's blitzed to a ridiculously unnatural level or not at all. People, even friends, say I'm out there because I'm never upset and I'm such an "optimist". But an
optimist, I'm not. I don't make any effort at all to be happy and positive. It just comes naturally for me. I let things go, I guess. And it just bewilders me how people can let things bring them down, especially those who don't suffer from clinical depression of any sort.
I find it hard to identify with most people's attitudes and their reactions to circumstances, and I know my constant smile annoys them at times. And their refusal to be happy annoys me, but I know I'm the unusual one, so I try my best to sympathize. I use drugs
in strict moderation because I believe they can afford insight and be beneficial, even stimulants if used responsibly. They can bring people who know each other closer, for sure. But even if you're like my friend who is a manic depressive and you use a stimulant for
a brief period of time, and are able to walk away, you can gain insight into positive thought patterns that may be unfamiliar to you. And even though the happiness is artificial, you can use what you learned from the stimulant to alter your mind once you're sober.
Some don't even seem to know what positive thinking resembles until they try stimulants. But people think themselves happy, and maybe after one or two responsible uses, you will know better the way a positive outlook works and perhaps be able to adapt your
mind to the same patterns. Habitual use is certainly living a lie, and it's lazy if you find yourself to be a depressed person. But I believe you can gain perspective with anything: acid, shrooms, coke, meth, whatever. I did coke for a year, but I always respected it.
and though the worries of others may have influenced me to worry about myself, my careful attention to myself on the drug allowed me to never become enemies with it. After all my use, the positives personally still outweigh the negatives. And really, the
responsible use only assured that I was able to get just as high as I wanted every time I touched it. But it's all fun, it's all partying and all social. Never done dope alone, but I honestly believe a life lived without at least a little experimentation is a life wasted. Why is
altering the mind such a bad thing? We have tools. We should not abuse them or use them in a shallow fashion all our lives. We should seek to learn and gain insight about ourselves and others around us. Learn how to live better, in general. To see the POV of
others. I think it can be done. Addiction is not necessary, even with harder drugs. Use rarely enough and you should be able to avoid the quick rewiring of the brain. Easy enough. Or maybe it's just easier for me, seeing that drugs don't give me anything genuine o
r worthwhile that I don't feel I need or don't already have. I don't have to seek my happiness at all. It's just there. Narcotics as a useful apparatus, not as a falsity or artificial reality. It's possible. Alcohol is probably the main and most influential factor that brought
my brother and I so close together when we finally started hanging out when he was around 24 and I around 16. We could express our worries and concerns about each other. He gave me advice from the heart, warned me to be careful. Told me if I ever become a
junkie that he'll chain me to a wall. We were so open with each other, at first only while drinking, but drinking together then made us much more comfortable with each other sober and throughout our daily lives. It definitely opened up our communication pathways,
and I can assure you it would have taken much longer without this sort of "brotherhood" we enjoyed. He became my best friend. With or without alcohol. I can't help but admit that it gave our relationship a kick start. I think every substance has potential to produce
positive change, especially when shared with someone who you trust.
sad, never angry, never pessimistic. Things just roll off of me. Even if I did get a dopamine release, it wouldn't be making up for anything. I have to go all out to enjoy euphoria from a drug, because it's very difficult for me to feel any happier than I feel naturally. If
anything, ice calms my exuberance and levels me out. A subtle coke high? I wouldn't feel it, honestly. It's blitzed to a ridiculously unnatural level or not at all. People, even friends, say I'm out there because I'm never upset and I'm such an "optimist". But an
optimist, I'm not. I don't make any effort at all to be happy and positive. It just comes naturally for me. I let things go, I guess. And it just bewilders me how people can let things bring them down, especially those who don't suffer from clinical depression of any sort.
I find it hard to identify with most people's attitudes and their reactions to circumstances, and I know my constant smile annoys them at times. And their refusal to be happy annoys me, but I know I'm the unusual one, so I try my best to sympathize. I use drugs
in strict moderation because I believe they can afford insight and be beneficial, even stimulants if used responsibly. They can bring people who know each other closer, for sure. But even if you're like my friend who is a manic depressive and you use a stimulant for
a brief period of time, and are able to walk away, you can gain insight into positive thought patterns that may be unfamiliar to you. And even though the happiness is artificial, you can use what you learned from the stimulant to alter your mind once you're sober.
Some don't even seem to know what positive thinking resembles until they try stimulants. But people think themselves happy, and maybe after one or two responsible uses, you will know better the way a positive outlook works and perhaps be able to adapt your
mind to the same patterns. Habitual use is certainly living a lie, and it's lazy if you find yourself to be a depressed person. But I believe you can gain perspective with anything: acid, shrooms, coke, meth, whatever. I did coke for a year, but I always respected it.
and though the worries of others may have influenced me to worry about myself, my careful attention to myself on the drug allowed me to never become enemies with it. After all my use, the positives personally still outweigh the negatives. And really, the
responsible use only assured that I was able to get just as high as I wanted every time I touched it. But it's all fun, it's all partying and all social. Never done dope alone, but I honestly believe a life lived without at least a little experimentation is a life wasted. Why is
altering the mind such a bad thing? We have tools. We should not abuse them or use them in a shallow fashion all our lives. We should seek to learn and gain insight about ourselves and others around us. Learn how to live better, in general. To see the POV of
others. I think it can be done. Addiction is not necessary, even with harder drugs. Use rarely enough and you should be able to avoid the quick rewiring of the brain. Easy enough. Or maybe it's just easier for me, seeing that drugs don't give me anything genuine o
r worthwhile that I don't feel I need or don't already have. I don't have to seek my happiness at all. It's just there. Narcotics as a useful apparatus, not as a falsity or artificial reality. It's possible. Alcohol is probably the main and most influential factor that brought
my brother and I so close together when we finally started hanging out when he was around 24 and I around 16. We could express our worries and concerns about each other. He gave me advice from the heart, warned me to be careful. Told me if I ever become a
junkie that he'll chain me to a wall. We were so open with each other, at first only while drinking, but drinking together then made us much more comfortable with each other sober and throughout our daily lives. It definitely opened up our communication pathways,
and I can assure you it would have taken much longer without this sort of "brotherhood" we enjoyed. He became my best friend. With or without alcohol. I can't help but admit that it gave our relationship a kick start. I think every substance has potential to produce
positive change, especially when shared with someone who you trust.
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