Anti-depressants and psychedelics

[EternalDreamer]

I have pretty bad anxiety and was just recently prescribed a TCA (tricylcic antidepressant), called Nortriptyline.

Does anyone have experiences with TCAs and psychedelics?

Will I be able to have psychedelic experiences following cessation of TCA use?

I was originally prescribed Zoloft, but I read that SSRIs inhibit psychedelic experiences (and posts on here somewhat concur), whereas TCAs can actually potentiate it (apparently). So, I decided in favor of a TCA. But I'm still worried about it. To be clear, I'm not using psychedelics while taking the TCA. At some point though, I want to get off the TCA and take psychedelics, but I am paranoid that using the TCA will permanently prevent me from having psychedelic experiences even following cessation of the TCA use. Who knows what it can do to you permanently? Can any of you comment on this?

 

[Chris Timothy]

I wouldn't worry, most ADs work the same in that sense in that they merely downregulate serotonin 2A receptors. There shouldn't be a reason why TCAs are worse.. especially if Nortriptyline tends to amplify various substances where the others don't. I can't even imagine a mechanism by which you'd be able to permanently lose just your tripping ability.

Because if you'd lost your entire 5TH2AR complex, you would basically be without fight-flight-freeze response. They're much more than neuron holes to put acid in (even though acid fits rather uncannily), they're involved in brain states generally responding to critical, traumatic circumstance, mediating the behaviour needed to adapt to them.

So if that happens you'd have bigger worries than not being able to trip anymore!

 

[Chris Timothy]

@heatlessbbq
Whatsa matter, buddy? It's much harder to do mind reading while sober, you'll have to elaborate on exactly what's angering you if you want me to do anything about it. I'm keeping with my general skepticism on the topic of pharms, don't worry. But they do work in a small percentage of cases, and OP seems like he indeed would be a fit.

 

[EternalDreamer]

Thanks Chris Timothy. Very helpful. Do you know someone who took TCAs? Can anyone on here comment about the combination?

It's ironic, but my anxiety is actually preventing me from taking anti-anxiety medications. I'm paranoid it will permanently prevent me from having psychedelic experiences, but I know that sounds very stupid. Then again... how can I ever be sure? You really can't be sure about anything... walking out in the street, you can be hit by a car, but you take that risk. Ahh... I really just don't know. I am so worried. I will never forgive myself if I lost my tripping ability.

The thing that has me concerned is that it's an antagonist for 5-HT2A, so wouldn't it destroy it over time or make it faulty somehow?

 

[Chris Timothy]

There's only so much I can do through the logic of words if there's an emotional state bypassing it. If you study the fine mechanics of science you come to the odd conclusion that there's always ways to doubt every single argument. This is illustrated through the existence of conspiracy bubbles. Those communities can have a surprisingly strong internal, logical consistency, the mistake isn't occurring up there. But they somehow do fail to weigh off likelihoods properly, the switch they ought to make at the emotional level for assuming the outside perspective isn't quite taking place. Or at least not yet.

So you're summarizing perfectly really. Your anxiety prevents you from breaking out of your anxiety. Nothing that can be added to that. Just keep that mechanism in mind, look at it, and try to see the humour in it.

For the record, I don't have first or second hand experience with the TCAs specifically. But that's the thing with ADs, much of it is illusory diversity. Most others downregulate serotonin 2A receptors as well, and if that would tend to truly cripple tripping ability then we simply would have heard about it by now.