Alright, forget the osta cycle

Yeah brother don't bother stepping up the dose start at 500 and stay on 500 for the cycle. Just make sure you read the first cycle sticky. Also about the SARMs; I have run them my self Ostirine and GW, they have a place but largely they are shall we say additions to a light cycle or best used for a nice re-comp or even as a pre-cycle cycle.

You have a solid Idea of making sure you have all your gear and info ready before the cycle. Research is your best friend mate. No worries about the joke issue is sarcasm isnt really readable, and when we don't really know people we tend to just assume you are being for real, and then give the best advice we can. The whole group of regulars on this site are pretty cool. We just want people to be informed and to use only when they are ready and then only the right way, whole point of harm reduction mate. Stick around OP and you will gather all the info you need to set up your cycle.
 
Not trying to say you wrong anyway dude, thats just the way I see it. If your going to run something that will still shut you down or at least suppress your test and for mediocre results at best then you may as well do a cycle. Especially seeing the compound is relatively new.
 
Yeah you can get a fair bit more out of a straight cycle, but SARMs have a real place, like any thing else they are a tool and if used properly they can be a real asset. You would have to look at it from a view of a non0-body builder, some one in a more restrictive sport with weight class issues or say a sport like mountaineering or any number of other sports that a small boost in mass, with a very appreciable boost in endurance, not to mention the nutrient repartitioning and other benefits. Then you would have to take into account the users general health, and age. While a full on cycle might be iffy for say an older male, a nice light cycle of SARMs might be just what is called. The mediocre results you get is not because of the compound you used but rather your diet and training routine, and that goes with guys using grams of gear and still getting shitty gains, while their mates use half the gear and get four times the results. It comes down to diet and training, the gear is just the final tool in the box to use, once every thing else is dialed in. This is of course my opinion, but it comes from years of training. For what its worth.
 
Wow speedy.. there is so much wrong with your post. First of all I'd just like to say that I am no authority but all my research and my limited knowledge of molecular biology screams that you have no clue what you're talking about. I'll address each sentence.

MrSpeedyG said:
Dude, run 500mg Test the whole way through week 1-12, don't do that pyramid shit. IGF-1 doesn't cause hypertrophy, rather hyperplasia so it will form new muscle cells. Hypertrophy is the splitting/enlargement of existing cells. I'm not much of an expert when it comes to peptides, but if there was one I would use it would be GHRP-6 for it's appetite stimulation... then again I find smoking a cone much more cheaper and effective IME.
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First of all I know the "pyramid" thing is looked down upon on many of the major boards, but in my reading I've seen some benefits to it. It was an idea, something that I will further research and expand upon before I actually do it. Sorry, I'm not going to make a decision based on someone telling me "its shit." I want to do a 12 week cycle, but at 500mg/w that would leave me with a left over vile of oil, which I'd rather avoid. So its drop to 10 weeks, drop the dose - Ive seen many people advocating even lower for a first time with evidence to back up why, or try some sort of pyramid scheme.

IGF-1 Doesn't cause hypertrophy? Really? First of all do you know that there is a difference between endocrine and autocrine/paracrine IGF1? Do you know that there are different isoforms of IGF1 that have different actions? Hypertrophy is the enlargement of cells through increased protein synthesis as well as myoblasts fusing to the muscle fibres which also increases their size. When those myoblasts decide to create new fibres, you get hyperplasia. The mechanisms behind stimulating hyperplasia are somewhat known, and its known that through hypertrophic training that hyperplasia does occur as well. The only studies shown to have a marked increase in hyperplasia were due to stretching.

Anyway, as I said, it's been shown that endocrine or exogenous IGF1 has absolutely no effect on muscle hypertrophy - hyperplasia falls into that category as well. Hyperplasia is rarely spoken about because on the whole it accounts for a very small percentage of what goes on.

Now, after exercise in the presence of GH in the system, your muscle cells begin expression of the isoforms of IGF1, IGF1Ea, IGF1Eb and IGF1Ec, aka MGF. At first the expression of MGF is skyrocketed and it plays the major role. It tells muscle satellite cells to begin proliferation, that is, they split and form new satellite cells which are esentially stem cells. These satellite cells either take a step back to keep the satellite cell pool alive, or they become myoblasts. MGF levels are elevated for 24+ hours while this process occurs, then eventually there is a shift towards the other forms of IGF1, which begin the differentiation process. In this process the newly created myoblasts either fuse to existing muscle cells/fibres (hypertrophy) or they form their own (hyperplasia) with fusion making up the bulk. Satellite cells are also responsible for cellular repair etc. Endocrine, aka systemic IGF1 has shown ZERO effect on these mechanisms occuring, all of this occurs from within muscle cells. Now when you inject IGF1LR3 (a modified form of 1Ea/b) post workout, what are you doing? well one, you're wasting your money because a large majority of that ends up in your blood stream and doesnt get into the muscle cells. Using microdosing you may get IGF into the muscle cells, but why would you want to do that? Its been proven that it stops satellite cell proliferation and induces differentiation. So whats wrong with that? Well, one, you stop more new satellite cells from being made, reducing your pool, and two you start the differentiation process of the myoblasts before they reached their peak amount. Injecting IGF1 is lose lose all around.

Are you really saying you'd use GHRP-6 simply for its appetite stimulation? Are you serious? I'm sorry but does the GH spike not appeal to you at all? The combination of modGRF (a GHRH) and GHRP causes a considerable spike, which done 3 times a day you can easily see is roughly equivalent to or greater than 7.5iu of HG - and in fact the pulsatile manner spread out over the day may in fact be even better. There are also better sleeping benefits, there are TONS of benefits to having higher GH levels in the body. I don't know about you but smoking weed multiple times a day every day costs a lot more than 2mg of GHRP a week, not to mention the overall negative benefits there are of being in a fucking cloud all the time.

Seriously, take your broscience bullshit elsewhere
 
lol Thank you, some one else calling broscience is always refreshing; and you did your home work to defend your argument, you have no idea how happy that makes em to see other people do their research and defend their point of view. awesome mate. I happen to agree with the pot thing as well though that is largely because A- i wont by cheap pot and B- I only smoke like twice a year because it turns me into an instant moron, and I am not talking the kinna funny stoned dumb, but rather dumb as a stone, mouth breathing idiot.

And like you mate I find that SARMs have their place as valid tools. I have used them with great success on several occasions. The peptide cycle you were thinking about running should yield some results but they are not going to be super noticeable. Though if you are really strict with, diet and training you will see some results, now personally I would run the Ostairine @ 25mg a day, and some GW @ 10mg a day during the length of your peptide cycle, with that you will see some nice mass gains, endurance gains, it would be a nice intro to things. Though if you added say some testosterone even at 250mg/week you will see a night and day difference, then titrated up as per a pyramid set up to 500mg. Though I would just start at the 500mg my self, the results will be better that way, this is form years of experience. the first cycle sticky is a great way to go about it. Though the addition of the peptides would be good. Either way post up what you plan and you will get advise brother and there will be plenty of good solid non broscience advice man.

All the peptides have benefits, and cons, though to be honest if you really want to boost HGH go fro HGH, but the peptides can be a good tool if you can not run the HGH for the period of time truly necessary to run it. ( 180days min to get what you are really looking for ) the high dosage short period blast cycles of hgh are really worth less. Now Running the peptides my be more cost effective for that 6 month period, and you may get good results but not the same as running the hgh obviously, though if you train, and eat properly you can get great results. Thing is Genetic Freak and Guido know more about the peptides then I do. so they will chime in I am sure if you have specific questions about them. But I digress you seem to be doing your resea4rch and frankly that goes a long way man, and already sets you apart from the average cat. It shows that you are willing to put the work in, if you can sit and research this stuff you have the will power to stick a program. Keep us posted on what you decide on finally and what the cycle will look like , including diet. ancillaries ect ect as you know the more we know the more we can help and the more your info might help the next cat planning his cycle.
 
infantannihilator said:
When I am ready to do a cycle, which will probably be next year, I will do a basic test e cycle. Something like w1-3 300mg, w4-8 400mg, w9-12 500mg. Part of the reason I've chosen to go with the pep's is to get used to pinning in general so when I make that leap I'll be a little more comfortable and just have to get used to pinning IM. I'm taking things in steps and making sure I'm well informed and have everything down pat before I begin.
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Hey Pal, much respect to your recent post on IGF-1.....

Interesting proposal for your first cycle.. 300-400-500..
The dose you choose should depend on your body size (the amount of muscle you currently hold).. The larger the muscular frame the greater amount of AAS needed to stimulate growth (or to hold onto that growth, as on cruise)...

The amount of time you have been on AAS (on a 1st cycle this will be zero)... Research has shown AR count increases over time, when exposed to doses of anabolics above normal range. This will determine the amount of AAS you can utilise without waste to obtain benefits...

You could always choose 375mg for 12 weeks, taper off slightly, PCT..
Or: Overtime the over production of anabolic response in the body will result in some catabolic hormonal increase, which will result in reduced gains, therefore you have two options:

1. Back-off onto a cruise dose to lower the catabolic response.. Or PCT..

2. Ramp up the dose of AAS (8-12 weeks max) beyond this gains will be minimal....

There is limited genuine information available on IGF-1 (where products are not for sale)... I would appreciate a link or two, if you would be so kind..
 
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