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Alcoholism Discussion Thread Version 6.0

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Allein said:
^^ Thanks, a very timely thread for me at least.

It's been about 3 years since I stopped drinking altogether and apart from one very minor slip up (most of the bottle went down the sink) I've managed to stay away from the stuff. I suspect although my drinking had become quite bad, at least a bottle of whiskey a day, it wasn't for that long as I was never interested in alcohol in my younger years.

I'm still finding the social situations quite hard, I had to go out with a group of people for drink and a meal last weekend and was the only person not to be drinking.

What do other people do in terms of explanation to others, I've tended to just tell people (that I know at least a bit and not work related) that I gave it up as I had developed a problem with it. Honesty seems the best policy but this weekend at least I got the impression it made other feel uncomfortable,not knowing what to say.
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I do drink now, socially, but for years when I was on opiates, I disliked alcohol because it made me feel shitty since I was always mixing it with opiates. People did sometimes think it was weird that I didn't drink but I just told them I dislike how alcohol makes me feel, which was true, and that I'd prefer not to have any... people were fine with that. I didn't need to mention having a problem (my problem wasn't with alcohol but it was with drugs).

And yeah, alcohol is one of the heaviest drugs, one of the most powerful and destructive and it has the greatest capacity out of almost anything to make people lose control. It's so ridiculous that the social norm is to talk about "alcohol and drugs", as if alcohol is not a drug.
 
I was never that interested in alcohol, I went through a short phase of binge drinking between 12-15 then discovered cannabis and barely drank until my 30s. The stuff crept up on me and various things led to me developing quite a nasty habit.

I can't contemplate social drinking ATM, I'm pretty certain I'd be back to everyday and way too much in weeks or less. I don't really enjoy many 'normal' social situations and avoid them where possible but sometimes you have little choice and that doesn't help when your trying to avoid other chemical solutions.

This time of the year brings more challenges than usual, I swear if my father in law asks me aaaagain if I want a drink I will scream ;)
 
Xorkoth said:
I do drink now, socially, but for years when I was on opiates, I disliked alcohol because it made me feel shitty since I was always mixing it with opiates. People did sometimes think it was weird that I didn't drink but I just told them I dislike how alcohol makes me feel, which was true, and that I'd prefer not to have any... people were fine with that. I didn't need to mention having a problem (my problem wasn't with alcohol but it was with drugs).

And yeah, alcohol is one of the heaviest drugs, one of the most powerful and destructive and it has the greatest capacity out of almost anything to make people lose control. It's so ridiculous that the social norm is to talk about "alcohol and drugs", as if alcohol is not a drug.
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It's been a few months since I quit opiates and I still can't drink. The highs terrible for me, like a deliriant.

One with a meals okay, but that usually sucks me into more, so I steer clear of even that one drink.

I think my early 20's alcohol abuse hasent healed at all... Shit, that was nearly 10 years ago... Geez time flys.
 
Captain Brewster said:
It's been a few months since I quit opiates and I still can't drink. The highs terrible for me, like a deliriant.

One with a meals okay, but that usually sucks me into more, so I steer clear of even that one drink.

I think my early 20's alcohol abuse hasent healed at all... Shit, that was nearly 10 years ago... Geez time flys.
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DuDE I agree with you . I think I abused alcohol so much and after some sober time it doesn't work anymore
 
njirem said:
^^
I really feel for you, it must be very difficult.
Iam a recovering alcoholic, been a poly drug abuser for many years, alcohol is by far the hardest to quit for me personally. The acute withdrawal is pure misery, life threatening without proper medical help (inpatient rehab, librium, doctors etc).

There is only one way imo to quit, and that is to hit rock bottom HARD...so hard you dont want to get back at any cost.
You are holding him back in some way, he may not have the will to quit using when you dont send a clear message, that he will loose YOU if he doesn;t want to quit.

Honey, pack your bags and leave for a couple of days, to let him realise that he is not only harming himself, but also his environment, and he will not only loose his life, but you too.

ITs the worst thing to do, but the best answer to this evil drug.

good luck <3
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Appreciate the words. But as I read "Honey, pack your bags and leave for a couple of days" the tears swelled burning in my eyes. followed by a hard truth, you might be right. I don't want to lose him but if I stay i'm losing him anyway right? Am I? Leaving him would be the hardest thing in my life, it would rip my heart out, jsut the thought of it now rips at me. flippin water works here right now. Crikey.

Yes, luck would be helpful.
anyway, thanks for telling me what I need to hear. He is the best man I've ever met. I never thought I'd be in battle with a bottle but if anyone's worth this battle, he is.
 
phactor said:
JGJ - This has been going on for a long time at this point. I remember you posting when I first got clean and that was 7+ months ago so its more then a half year. Ask yourself if he the situation has gotten better or worse. Remember, that Alcoholism and Addiction hardily ever get better, it is a progressive disease. As others are advising you, you are likely enabling him. I have been telling you this for a long time. Not trying to be harsh, but its time to stop asking "what do I do" and actually take some action. I think you know what you have to do.
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Okay but I really don't get the whole, "your enabling him" thing. Enabling him by staying with him? My mere presence in his life is enabling him? nah. I can assure you he's been drinking far far less since he met me. Sure he has benders now and then but lately we've been so broke he can only afford a six pack a day, sometimes less, a day here and there with none. So there is improvement, some anyway. Is that not a sign of hope? He also finally admitted he drinks way too much and has been doing so for most of his life.
I know it's wearing on him seeing how the booze stresses me out.
I know we have great love. I'm not just going to walk away from that. What kind of woman would I be if I left for good. That's not who or what I am.

Someone suggested packing a bag for a short while. Tough love type thing. Offer him space to see what things would be like without me.

Perhaps this may happen in some time but I won 't walk away permanently. I can't. I'm his woman, he's my man and that's that.
I know I come on this site to share, to ask for helpful words and I get it. You folks do help both of us. He's a good man. A really good man and I can't imagine my life without him in it. I just can't; and this alcohol thing scares the ___ out of me... How I wish it could materialize into a physical form so I could kick the living ___ out of it and tell it to leave us alone. How I do wish that.
anyway, yes its been some time but there is some improvement on the amounts. I'm not backing down ( and to me, that's taking action)
Appreciate your insights though. Congrats on the sobriety btw; good on you.
I just needed to share.
With this beast, I have met my match and by 'beast' I mean 'the beast of booze' I have every intention (although some will think i'm delusional) of beating this thing that grips my beloved, every intention.

kind regards and again, thanking you
jgj
I will surely be back here again
and may I say, to all in the throes of this particular battle, the strengths you have measure to none I have witnessed before. Seeing how rough this is up close like this; well I think your all amazing. Personal heroes of your own rights. Amazing.
 
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I empathize with everyone here. Alcohol has honestly ruined my life, and it will most likely eventually kill me. I enjoy helping others, though, and have considered spending the time that I have left doing so. It's difficult to do that going through this, but it's worth it. I honestly no longer care if I die but I care for others' lives. I'm sure that might sound very dramatic or even ridiculous, but I do mean it. I feel like a terrible person all the time. Drinking both heals it and makes it worse. Lately I feel bad, because I seek lives that are as bad as mine. I want to help them. And it does heal me to some extent to try to help them. Gosh I sound like an idiot, but this is all I've got left. I don't care if I die.
 
First off, I never said it had to be permanent. But at this point he very likely needs to go to inpatient treatment to have any hope. If you really want to help him, I would suggest (keyword: just a suggestion, nobody can tell you what to do) you call around and look for some free beds. Have an intervention and put it in front of him: "Me or the Booze", do this or I am leaving. If he is unwilling to stop then well..... he is basically picking alcohol over you.


Didn't you say he spent all your money on booze at one point? How is he affording his drinking.
 
phactor said:
First off, I never said it had to be permanent. But at this point he very likely needs to go to inpatient treatment to have any hope. If you really want to help him, I would suggest (keyword: just a suggestion, nobody can tell you what to do) you call around and look for some free beds. Have an intervention and put it in front of him: "Me or the Booze", do this or I am leaving. If he is unwilling to stop then well..... he is basically picking alcohol over you.


Didn't you say he spent all your money on booze at one point? How is he affording his drinking.
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What am I suppose to do? Watch him suffer? It isn't safe to go cold turkey with alcohol right? So yes, he does use household money. I appreciate your suggestions, I really do; it's just he absolutely refuses and I mean refuses to go anything like inpatient or outpatient treatment. REfuses.
So yeah, I could do the whole tough love scenario and not provide the dosh for beer; but what good would that do? It isn't safe and I can't watch him suffer like that.
So yeah, I guess I am The Enabler.

anyway, kind regards. again, appreciate the insight
JGJ
 
phactor said:
First off, I never said it had to be permanent. But at this point he very likely needs to go to inpatient treatment to have any hope. If you really want to help him, I would suggest (keyword: just a suggestion, nobody can tell you what to do) you call around and look for some free beds. Have an intervention and put it in front of him: "Me or the Booze", do this or I am leaving. If he is unwilling to stop then well..... he is basically picking alcohol over you.


Didn't you say he spent all your money on booze at one point? How is he affording his drinking.
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What am I suppose to do? Watch him suffer? It isn't safe to go cold turkey with alcohol right? So yes, he does use household money. I appreciate your suggestions, I really do; it's just he absolutely refuses and I mean refuses to go anything like inpatient or outpatient treatment. REfuses.
So yeah, I could do the whole tough love scenario and not provide the dosh for beer; but what good would that do? It isn't safe and I can't watch him suffer like that.
So yeah, I guess I am The Enabler.

anyway, kind regards. again, appreciate the ijn
JGJ
 
He doesnt HAVE to suffer though. Its his choice to not go inpatient. If he did, his suffering would be greatly diminished. I know you love him but i agree with above, if you say youre leaving if he doesnt quit and he says "ok,go..." Is that s good man? Is that treating you well? You cant compartmentalize his drinking and say "oh hes good except for this". Spending your money on booze, making you worry...

Im not saying hes a bad guy, im really not. Im a heroin addict, ive done fucked up things for dope too. But if someone i loved, really loved, said its me or heroin.. Id choose my love. I know how addiction works... And if someone was content to stay with me snd let me use their money to get high i probly wouldve done it too. I probably also wouldve said "no, i refuse to get help", knowing the person loved me too much to kick me out or threaten to leave til i get clean. Yes, youre enabling him.

I understand passionate, faithful love, i really do. But your passionate, faithful love to him is not helping him right now. If you two are going to have any real future where youre both actually happy, he needs to get clean. Soon, not in another year or three years or eight years when his cirrhosis of the liver is so bad that you only have a year left together with him sober.
 
junegreenjeans said:
What am I suppose to do? Watch him suffer? It isn't safe to go cold turkey with alcohol right? So yes, he does use household money. I appreciate your suggestions, I really do; it's just he absolutely refuses and I mean refuses to go anything like inpatient or outpatient treatment. REfuses.
So yeah, I could do the whole tough love scenario and not provide the dosh for beer; but what good would that do? It isn't safe and I can't watch him suffer like that.
So yeah, I guess I am The Enabler.

anyway, kind regards. again, appreciate the ijn
JGJ
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Of course he doesn't want to go to inpatient, he is an alcoholic and has been. That is why things like interventions and bottoms are needed to convince an addict/alcoholic to actually change. Look into the concept of denial. The fact that he is recognizing he has a drinking problem is good but that will not get him clean. I knew I was an addict and used for another decade. I didn't want to go to inpatient either.

If you are buying his beer, you are keeping him sick and helping to kill him. No offense. You are paying for the process of a slow suicide. Not to mention, you have written about some of the issues that his drinking has caused you. I remember your first post you had to stop writing because he was coming around you. I also remember the post about the incident in the hotel and what happened with your own family. I also remember you trying to drink with him.

I believe he was starting to show signs of liver damage correct? Yellow Eyes and organ pain possibly. Yet you are still paying for him and watching him drink?

Just stop and think about this, you are not alone, you are not "bad" and you are not the only person experiencing this. Help is out there. Help beyond what we can provide.

Please don't be offended, but I am writing these things in the hope that you take responsibility for your role in all of this.

Go to an Al-Anon or Nar-Anon meeting or two, not an AA/NA those are for addicts... Al-Anon and Nar-Anon are for people in your situation.

Try to flip it around and look at the whole intervention/inpatient as an act of love. When my family had their interventions they did it out of love and it saved my life. I was faced with the choice of them or my drugs and I chose them. It still took me a few tries to get clean and this last time really was/is my last chance. Now, my life is so good its unbelievable and I only have 7 months. I have a job, a girlfriend, my family is proud of me, I am in graduate school etc etc. All things are possible clean.

"So yeah, I could do the whole tough love scenario and not provide the dosh for beer; but what good would that do? "

Potentially save his life.
 
I'm almost 2.5 years sober here. I sometimes miss alcohol, and other drugs like cannabis, and mushrooms; but I've had some personal issues right now and using any drugs even just cannabis, or especially mushrooms would not help.
 
Okay. Bluesaffron, Phactor, with a heavy heart and of course I'm scared to lose him either way; to liver failure or because I go full throttle on the intervention. I'll need a little time to organize this. gee wiz, water works again. gulp.

A few days ago he had a bender and became 'Hyde' again. Been awhile since I've seen or had to deal with him. My sweetheart has been drinking less and telling himself (fooling himself I suppose) that if he drinks less but still daily, everything is fine but it isn't is it. Daily drinking is still too much.

Two mornings ago I told him I couldn't do this, wouldn't do this and told him it was me or the beer. He chose me but he didn't give it much thought so I doubt the intentions there fully.
Yes, I am enabling. Never thought I'd be in a position where I couldn't have a glass of wine around because he'll drink the rest of the bottle. He's going to be miserable.
He honestly thinks that if he could reduce the amounts there's nothing to worry about. He also tries telling me I am a drinker too though I rarely drank before I met him aside from when I saw my family or went out for pool game and a pint.
I will need to include his family on this one. AFter the Christmas Season I will call his Mother. She dealt with the same thing with his Father. His FAther passed away from drink.
So basically I risk losing him but saving his life. Well time tell then won't it.

He's still the best man I've ever met when he's sober or just lightly buzzing. But when 'Hyde' comes out or the 220 pound 3 year old being difficult for silly reasons, I know I don't have what it takes to cope for too much longer.
Another thing is this. He truly believes that beer helps his heart slow down. He has hyper tension issues and truly believes that beer helps with that, anxieties, group situations, on and on. He is convinced that beer is part of his daily health regime. I found him a Dr. but he lied to him about the amounts.
I will look into local programs. I will stop giving him our food money for beer and take what ever he throws at me. I will call his Mother soon about this. I know we're both gonna cry. She loves him very much. Maybe this is why I'm here. Okay. Thanks folks. Will keep you updated as we go.
I can't believe this is happening. I finally meet my man and he's cletched in this monsters grip and he likes the monster. We'll see what he chooses; monster or me and him
 
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Okay; so I did it; I got off this thing after my last post and called and looked around. There's a free detox program the next town over; needs a referral from his Dr so I made appointment with Dr for 6th of Jan. If he gets it there's only a 2 week waiting list to get in. They only do detox but will provide other programs for support afterwards.
He's still in bed. I will tell him what I've done when he wakes up and gets the cobwebs out, a few hours later. So there it is.

You guys are right. This won't go away on its own and if I waited and hoped for a solution yet none came and then something bad happened to him, I'd lose the will to go on.
You know I'm taking a risk here. I know he loves me but that's what everyone says. I will find out allot more of his true feelings towards me. But hey, if he's not willing to fight for himself, I am. If he hates me for doing this and we don't make it, at least he'll know I tried.

flippin water works here

I'm not going to tell his Mother. If this happens, this one will be on us. From what you guys say, this could take many tries
 
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I would bring his mother in on it and as many people that love him. You can talk to people about how to do an intervention. Keep in mind that during an intervention everyone must be on the same page. He is likely in massive denial and simply does not realize how much harm he is causing his loved ones.

Want to know what else always scares the shit out of me? I realize that my ability to even love my loved ones was greatly depressed during my active addiction. It wasn't until I got clean and looked at my niece that I realized what true love and caring felt like. It was a huge epiphany. Thats how impactful addiction is.

Essentially, when you get clean you have to learn how to live all over again.

"But hey, if he's not willing to fight for himself, I am."

This sounds cruel, but if he is not willing to fight for himself there is nothing you can do to get him clean. You really really have to accept this fact if you want to help him. To put this in perspective: Even a healthy fear of death is not enough to get an unwilling addict clean. I knew I was killing myself, but I kept using.

Keep in mind that when he is in active addiction, he is in a major state of denial. All the stuff you are saying he said above is the same shit I would say. There are threads on here documenting my YEARS and YEARS of trying to figure out how to drink/use successfully. I can't, I am an addict.

My life is going so good now and keeps getting better. I can say I truly love my family and relatives, my girlfriend and most importantly MYSELF. What a gift that is. So grateful to be clean today.
 
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