Stimulants ADHD stimulants and heart attack risks, how risky is it?

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

It's because they are both SNRI's. Same goes for Pristiq, would never use an effexor metabolite.

I'm extremely sensitive to those serotonin messing antideps, probably because I've had LSD 250+ times between 1999 and 2008, but just one 37.5mg Effexor XR had me get huge ass pupils and I went to a party only to drink beer, and on the way I had to buy a dozen Gravols (Dramamine are called that in Canada) because of the massive stomach issues I was also experiencing. Had to take 50mg of dimenhydrinate for every 2-3 beer I drank. Got home and was still unable to sleep after all that beer and gravol. For 48 hours the starting dose of an Effexor course had me feel all sorts of bad and weird. That's how it is for me.

 

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

I read in a book from Stephen Stahl that L-Amph releases NE while D-Amph releases DA.
Then wouldn't antidepressants with NE reuptake inhibition not have similar side effects as L-Amph?
I'm currently on 90mg cymbalta (SNRI) and this shit doesn't help my depression at all.
Wellbutrin (NDRI) also didn't do anything.

NE is also what causes all those undesirable PNS symptoms. Read up on it. addforums is also a good place for such info, bibles of ADD meds await.

 

[spikeycloud]

I've tried Adderall several times, my experiences are total opposite of everyone else.......

I get very hungry & I'm a sleep within 2 hours while my friend can't eat at all & is up 30 hours straight......

All these stimulants along with coke are terrible for your heart & blood pressure.......for the life of me, I can't understand why doctors prescribe this shit to young kids with ADHD........there's gotta be something out there much safer & possibly herbal like.

Welcome in the harsh reality of the money hungry pharmaceuticals industry my friend.

 

[sacsky]

That's strange that you had such a reaction to 1 dose of effexor.
But this seems to be rare cause otherwise nobody would be on it.

 

[LearntYoung]

I had to get my heart tested first, then, after a week of methylphenidate, I had to get my heart rate and blood pressure tested again. Then I got my prescription.

 

[tricomb]

Depends on your dose, your medical records, genetic or predisposition to cardiovascular diseases increases the risk, by dose-dependent factors.

 

[sacsky]

This is scary.

What if you get regular ECGs and blood pressure tests under medication? Would this rule out serious risks or are you still at a bigger risk no matter what?

 

[PriestTheyCalledHim]

There are no risks. If you have heart problems then you are going to die just as easily from exercising too hard or just randomly because your heart is going to give out anyway.

Check your heart with the doctor and see. If you have no heart problems, it won't give you any. I've done stimulants in very high doses and also done extensive physical activity on high doses.

The key is to listen to your body and know the signals correctly. Problem is if you have anxiety you will think you are having a heart attack when it is just a panic attack, and even a single heart palpitation will freak you out.

So you need to face your anxiety of it first, which sounds like hypochondria to me, then stimulants are safe to use, even in high doses. Just start small.

^^^
This.

Plus, the doctor that prescribes the dexedrine, adderall, or Ritalin for you should be monitoring you or check you out to make sure you have no health problems or heart problems, before you start taking the medication, and while you are on it.

I know people who are tweakers who were or are into meth, and they said how crystal meth is a lot more cardiotoxic, and even neurotoxic than even extremely high doses of dexedrine, adderall, or Ritalin are. Cocaine is also very bad for your heart and body and worse than amphetamines/Ritalin are.

 

[stonedboss]

I believe how much your heart rate increases is the biggest factor in ADHD stimulants being a heart risk. IIRC it is somewhere around 10% increased risk for every 10bpm over 60. My heart rate is generally around 80-90 without stimulants, and on stimulants it is 120-130. So stimulants increase my risk of a heart attack by 40-50%. It is worth it. Why live with 40-50% less risk, when it means a shitter life without the ability to think properly?

 

[PriestTheyCalledHim]

Do prescription amphetamines damage the brain? I often read warnings about stims saying they fry the brain or cause long term damage. That would be scary.

Do people who use meth not get anything typical side effects? For example does the blood pressure not get very high?

Meth is highly neurotoxic, while Addreall/Dexedrine are not.

Very few people prescribed adderall or dexedrine take it 7 days a week/365 days a year. A lot take weekends off and a full week every month, or go for months not taking it while on vacation, thus stopping tolerance. Each comedown is your brain rebuilding itself.

Also, the tweakers I know who are/were into meth many of them did get dementia early in life, and they didn't even use meth daily and just used it on weekends but they have permanent damage to their brain from their use/abuse of crystal meth. But people who used Adderall or Dexedrine even the people who got addicted to one or both do not.

 

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

^^^
This.

Plus, the doctor that prescribes the dexedrine, adderall, or Ritalin for you should be monitoring you or check you out to make sure you have no health problems or heart problems, before you start taking the medication, and while you are on it.

I know people who are tweakers who were or are into meth, and they said how crystal meth is a lot more cardiotoxic, and even neurotoxic than even extremely high doses of dexedrine, adderall, or Ritalin are. Cocaine is also very bad for your heart and body and worse than amphetamines/Ritalin are.

Ah-huh. Bullshit. Cocaine is inherently cardiotoxic, not even meth. Go to addforums and see what the people on Desoxyn have to say about it....I say that because meth here comes in pills, and oral (yes, a lot of people do crush them to snort them, but its an inferior method to me, sure kicks in faster, effects gone 45 minutes later, especially since people tend to snort 1/4 fo pills) meth when taken in small doses is the best thing and the comedown isn't even as bad. Those pills can't even be smoked though, it's powder meth that's pressed into pills. There's a thread in Drugs in the Media about a pill pressing machine was seized when a meth weed and cocaine distribution gang was caught here in Quebec. It would make about 100 000 methbombs a day. I liked to take a half of a pill and then another half later at 3-4am when everyone I was partying with (the more girls, the better) starts jonesing for a bit more, thats why I would always get 15 pills at once. Oh those old good days....goddamn. We also had E a lot easier then too, but here there's a street code that never fails, white pills = meth, colourful pills = mdxx or mdxx + some meth.

 

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

Meth is highly neurotoxic, while Addreall/Dexedrine are not.

Very few people prescribed adderall or dexedrine take it 7 days a week/365 days a year. A lot take weekends off and a full week every month, or go for months not taking it while on vacation, thus stopping tolerance. Each comedown is your brain rebuilding itself.

Also, the tweakers I know who are/were into meth many of them did get dementia early in life, and they didn't even use meth daily and just used it on weekends but they have permanent damage to their brain from their use/abuse of crystal meth. But people who used Adderall or Dexedrine even the people who got addicted to one or both do not.

Nice DARE commercial there man. I'd trade my Dexedrine script (which I now stockpile because I hate its effects now) for some Desoxyn, alas, those never existed in Canada. I'd much rather take pharm meth orally than that euphoria devoid shit.

 

[sacsky]

Does dex not cause euphoria?

Or what about mixed amphetamines? Are they better or worse than dex?

@ stonedboss

You have 130bpm resting rate? Damn. This would freak me out. When I took anafranil I had 90bpm and this already felt uncomfortable and unhealthy.
I think that the lower the resting rate the healthier it is for the heart.

 

[stonedboss]

Dex definitely causes euphoria. In fact, a lot of people prefer the euphoria of dex over adderall.

Mixed amphetamines, or adderall, is definitely much worse on your heart than just dex. The biggest reason I made the switch from adderall to dex only was for my heart.

Ha, yeah. Well I have a hypersensitive CNS, which keeps my body and therefore my heart constantly reacting to shit (particularly being in a constant state of anxiety). So it is somewhat inevitable, and as I mentioned it is worth it to me to. I'd rather die at 50 than live to 80 with a life that I never wanted to live (deficient in cognitive functions).

 

[sacsky]

Have you tried betablockers? Propanolol seems to be good for anxiety caused heart palpitations. But I'm not sure if this would mix well with dexedrine. You'd have to ask your doctor about it.

 

[alpha_centauri]

Dex definitely causes euphoria. In fact, a lot of people prefer the euphoria of dex over adderall.

Mixed amphetamines, or adderall, is definitely much worse on your heart than just dex. The biggest reason I made the switch from adderall to dex only was for my heart.

Ha, yeah. Well I have a hypersensitive CNS, which keeps my body and therefore my heart constantly reacting to shit (particularly being in a constant state of anxiety). So it is somewhat inevitable, and as I mentioned it is worth it to me to. I'd rather die at 50 than live to 80 with a life that I never wanted to live (deficient in cognitive functions).

Adderall or racemic amphetamines are not that bad for your heart.

It's not like you're using actual meth, or cocaine which are both extremely bad for your heart.

Amphetamines are one of the drugs they've studied for decades, and even Adderall in low doses is not harmful for your heart.

You're worried about an increase in heart rate but this happens when you exercise, and it also happens when you smoke herb, or drink caffeine. If you have major heart problems you would never have been prescribed Adderall or Dexedrine at all, and would have been told to avoid all caffeine, exercise, etc.

 

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

Dex definitely causes euphoria. In fact, a lot of people prefer the euphoria of dex over adderall.

Mixed amphetamines, or adderall, is definitely much worse on your heart than just dex. The biggest reason I made the switch from adderall to dex only was for my heart.

Ha, yeah. Well I have a hypersensitive CNS, which keeps my body and therefore my heart constantly reacting to shit (particularly being in a constant state of anxiety). So it is somewhat inevitable, and as I mentioned it is worth it to me to. I'd rather die at 50 than live to 80 with a life that I never wanted to live (deficient in cognitive functions).

Yeah of course, Dexedrine provides euphoria, but not for long. Even when you stop taking it often, it stops providing euphoria more than 30 minutes and then it's comedown town.

The time I was on Dexedrine for college, 5 days out of 7, sometimes 7 out of 7, I had a BP of 110 constantly or so. 100 or so when sober. Now I'm at around 85, and it feels weird, its because of the bupe, clonidine and benzos all used together but I got no choice.

I stockpile my script since like 28 months, last time my GP renewed it no problem, didn't ask for it, just my annual visit for an exam, blood test demand to bring to the hospital to have them performed, renewing of my scripts. Now he's retired though, so 4 months left. Boy I hope I make a new girlfriend again, from 2010 to 2013 it wasn't complicated to use the extra dexedrine...not so anymore, heh.

 

[cousinskeeter]

Meth is highly neurotoxic, while Addreall/Dexedrine are not.

Very few people prescribed adderall or dexedrine take it 7 days a week/365 days a year. A lot take weekends off and a full week every month, or go for months not taking it while on vacation, thus stopping tolerance. Each comedown is your brain rebuilding itself.

Also, the tweakers I know who are/were into meth many of them did get dementia early in life, and they didn't even use meth daily and just used it on weekends but they have permanent damage to their brain from their use/abuse of crystal meth. But people who used Adderall or Dexedrine even the people who got addicted to one or both do not.

How long ago was it they were using meth and over what period of time? Same question regarding your Dex/Adderall addict friends? Surely the meth users you refer to where smoking it, possibly IVing? I would wager they were going for the gold with meth much stronger than the adderall/dex users. I'm guessing the balance of monoamine release with dexamp/amp is in a sweet spot where you don't run into too much trouble? As opposed to methamphetamine going through a secret back door?

I have read that preliminary studies found that using marijuana with meth can hep prevent most of the neurotox caused by elevated body temperature with both meth and MDMA (brain cells burnin up!) by helping lower the bodies core temp. Keep in mind I have heard nothing regarding marijuana having an effect on the main way meth is neurotoxic though.

Question:
I do not intend any meaningful synth discussion to come of this: of the known common impurities from street meth across the globe, would there be any which when inhaled, could do serious damage to the brain. I don't disagree with what you said about meth, but I think if you did a desoxyn vs dexedrine study over 60 years at daily, but normal doses, the statistical different would be evident but not nearly as wide.

I'm not trying to argue or anything man, your information is just as good or even better than mine.*fist bump* I'm no doctor or chemist, but I always loved being proven wrong, it means I get to learn something new, which is a prize in itself.

 

[alpha_centauri]

Of course foolish tweakers are going to claim that meth is fine, that it's not neurotoxic, bad for your body, or cardiotoxic, and yet low doses of amphetamines like the brands dexedrine or adderall are horrible for your body, heart, mind, etc.; but that's tweaker logic for you.

 

[PriestTheyCalledHim]

How long ago was it they were using meth and over what period of time? Same question regarding your Dex/Adderall addict friends? Surely the meth users you refer to where smoking it, possibly IVing? I would wager they were going for the gold with meth much stronger than the adderall/dex users. I'm guessing the balance of monoamine release with dexamp/amp is in a sweet spot where you don't run into too much trouble? As opposed to methamphetamine going through a secret back door?

I have read that preliminary studies found that using marijuana with meth can hep prevent most of the neurotox caused by elevated body temperature with both meth and MDMA (brain cells burnin up!) by helping lower the bodies core temp. Keep in mind I have heard nothing regarding marijuana having an effect on the main way meth is neurotoxic though.

Question:
I do not intend any meaningful synth discussion to come of this: of the known common impurities from street meth across the globe, would there be any which when inhaled, could do serious damage to the brain. I don't disagree with what you said about meth, but I think if you did a desoxyn vs dexedrine study over 60 years at daily, but normal doses, the statistical different would be evident but not nearly as wide.

I'm not trying to argue or anything man, your information is just as good or even better than mine.*fist bump* I'm no doctor or chemist, but I always loved being proven wrong, it means I get to learn something new, which is a prize in itself.

Hi, some of them used it maybe 1-5X at the most using it when other people had it or offered it to them but decided they didn't like it so stopped using the meth on their own, others used meth for a few years and others for a few months just on weekends before they quickly realized they were addicted and needed help to stop, one used it for decades on and off, and the one that IV'd it used it pretty much daily for at least a decade and died from it.

For the dex/adderall addicted friends they used it for 1-2 years, or as long as a decade or more. I have other friends who aren't addicted who are prescribed it for ADD and they take it as needed in low prescribed dosages and only take it orally.