• CD Moderators: someguyontheinternet
  • Cannabis Discussion Welcome Guest
    Posting Rules Bluelight Rules

A serious discussion about marijuana

It would be easier to have a 'serious' discussion about Cannabis if that original article wasn't written like a 9th grade book report.
No thats the thing dude, marijuana DOES fuck you up. Most people just choose to supress and/or ignore these problems. Memory, cognitive, and speech impairment are very real and they arent something to take lightly, they fuck you up and you go through your life not thinking properly or registering things properly, its fucked and has serious effects especially over time.

I can get drunk on a saturday night and by monday morning im fine, its as if i never even drank. I can smoke 5 or so cigs on a saturday night and by monday morning im fine, as if i never smoked. If i smoke a few joints on a saturday night, im still gonna have mental clouding on monday, im still gonna have worse off reflex's and im still gonna have worse cognitive skills. Marijuana's negative effects are not only real but they last alot longer than legal recreational drugs which is the main problem, and its because the drug stays in you're body for so long. There is a reason why marijuana comes up in drug tests longer than all the other drugs, its because ITS IN YOUR BODY LONGER THAN THE OTHER DRUGS and as long as these chemicals are in you its going to continue to have these negative effects on you.
Click to expand...
That sucks man, looks like when God was handing out genes, you were in the shitter.

It's obvious you have existing problems which Cannabis brings out in you. I find it amusing that you seem to think that drinking alcohol and smoking tobacco does less damage to you, that's a joke and you know it. Even funnier is your ignorance about THC staying in your cells. I suggest you stop posting before you look even stupider.

However I do agree with you that full unregulated legalization is not the way to go.
 
Oh yes, because i am very aware of my body and mind, i must have shit genes. 8)

Its not just me and everyone here reading this thread knows it. If you are smoking regularly and you seriously think you have NO negative effects from it, then you are either stupid or ignorant OR you are just really lucky and have some sort of super mind and body.

Most people choose to be ignorant of the negative effects. I really havnt met a single toker who doesnt have some sort of memory problems which is the most easily identifiable negative effect of marijuana. You can keep trying to convince yourself that it isnt doing you harm but once you come to your senses you will realize what is truly going on.

I wasnt saying that alcohol and tobacco do less damage, i said they cause less prolonged 'mental fogging' if i had to put a name on it. In the sense that, the immediate negative effects of alcohol and tobacco dont last as long(besides the possibility of lung cancer) as marijuana. It was in reference to someone saying(might have been in the article) that 'why can brain surgeons drink on the weekend but not smoke weed' - and i gave the exact answer.

Ask any seasoned stoner who is older(like, 40+) and im sure youll be hard pressed to find a single one who is being honest that will tell you there is no negative effects of marijuana use. Ive seen first hand what smoking weed regularly your whole life does, i know a fair few people who have done it who are now in there 50's etc.. their speech is impaired, they take long pauses to think about simple things, they forget shit all the time, they sometimes have trouble comprehending what you tell them - and you know what? I see this in every single 'old' stoner, so its not just a 1 off.
 
Last edited:
I agree with most of what you are saying except for the part about how pot gives you longer, immediate, negative effects. I can get drunk and have a bad hangover (with very bad headaches/concentration problems) that might last until I go to bed the next night, whereas if I get high right now I will feel completely normal at about noon tomorrow.
And even if I wake up feeling a little burnt, it is actually relaxing/enjoyable.

I know everybody is different but that is generally what happens among the people I know.
 
^^Exactly you see these problems in every 50+ stoner. Well guess what, I have never seen one negative problem with any casual smoker of this same age group. In fact they are articulate, very well composed, successful people.

So I'm just guessing that every instance that you speak of where people are babbling idiots probably deals with chronic pot smokers and not the normal occasional smoking base.

Lets face it, anything that you do in excess will have a negative impact on your life. Just look at any fat ass and I am sure you'll agree.
 
Yeah im using 50+ stoners as an example, because these effects are more dramatised due to prolonged use. The people im talking about.. some of them are rather successful, they are good public speakers and work there way up to the top jobs in companys they join pretty quick, but they still have these negatives aswell which is what im talking about. But these problems still effect young people too. Of course doing any drug daily is going to have some negative effect in your life but my point is that people seem to think weed is some sort of harmless drug that is perfectly safe and has no negatives, but just look at anyone whos been using it(not neccasarily daily) for there whole life and its pretty damn easy to see that weed is far from just positives.

And haikoid, if you stay hydrated(and i mean HYDRATED) you will almost always get no hang over what so ever. Lets, when comparing these drugs, hypothetically assume that the people taking these drugs are 100% healthy.
 
Moonyham, you seem to want to drive the point home that marijuana is a drug that isnt harmless, but no one is arguing with you... and your examples are ridiculously extreme. Talking about being affected for months from one time of getting high? Of everyone ive known whos used pot, whether it be once or the regular user, never have they felt the effects months on... and i dont mean being high, but mental distortion, memory impairment etc. and of course, If you do to much of anything it can be detrimental to your health. If you exercise too much, and we all know exercise is good for you, it can have a negative impact.

Im not trying to target you, but i dont get where you seem to think that everyone thinks weed is harmless, we simply want something that has been shown to be less harmful than most other commonly available drugs to be available for responsible use. If you can justify binge drinking on the weekend how can you not justify being able to get super high on the weekend? The examples you are providing are not evidence that marijuana is more harmful than alcohol or tobacco, rather that marijuana is more harmful to you than alcohol or tobacco, at least on a mental level. What you cant see is what is happening to your body when you drink that 12 pack in a night or smoke those 5 cigs that night, just because you cant feel something doesnt mean it isnt there. Alcohol is converted into a toxin when it is broken down in the body. Yes dehydration is a component, but thats because alcohol is a diuretic, staying hydrated wont change the fact that alcohol is toxic.

I just really dont see where you are going with your points here. Seems to me like you have had a bad experience with it and yet you say you are still using it. that to me seems like a dumb idea. When i notice that something is harming me, the logical thing to do is to stop or limit my use as to reduce harm. If you dont like it dont use it, its that simple. I dont like alcohol, even a couple of drinks, no matter how much water you give me, will give me a headache and make me depressed the next day. Cannabis on the other hand will not give me that effect, so i choose to use this instead. Seems like a pretty simple idea to me. I dont think everyone should smoke weed, nor do i think everyone should drink, i think they should do what is best for them.

And the people you describe as being blunt headed about marijuana's possible harm to them i see as highschool stoners. If you ask most users of pot who get off the couch each day and go to work youll see they are a little more educated than you think.
 
Last edited:
Yeah ive had bad experiences with it, but most of the time the benefits outweigh the negatives. That confusing of names for months was from the very first time i got stoned, and i never had a problem with that in the future... it was a one off but i mentioned it just as an example of some of the things weed can do. Im not trying to say that everyone thinks its harmless, i just am sick of tired of there being misinformation on BOTH sides of the fence. Its like, because the govt's and so on make it look so bad, that stoners need to try and make it look better than it really is - thats what i have a problem with. You can see it in the article in OP, nowhere does he mention drug induced depression, anxiety disorders, memory impairment or anything.. and infact this same thing goes for almost all of these 'legalize weed' articles i read.

I agree, some people have more negative effects from a certain drug than others, but almost all drugs have some sort of negative effect that happens to (almost)everone that uses it, wouldnt you agree? Much like alcohol you described having toxic effects.
 
moonyham said:
I agree, some people have more negative effects from a certain drug than others, but almost all drugs have some sort of negative effect that happens to (almost)everone that uses it, wouldnt you agree? Much like alcohol you described having toxic effects.
Click to expand...

Of course i agree. That goes without saying. Whether you get your drug from a doctor or some dude on the corner, there is always risks. The question becomes can you decide when the risks start outweighing the benefits. If you cant. chances are you either need some help to get out of the addiction, or you didnt have the intelligence to make rational decisions before you started using drugs.

I guess thats why i felt i had to comment. The cannabis users you described seem to me to be the type of person that shouldn't be using drugs. That stoner stereotype. I bet you could pick out which person would turn into the stereotypical stoner and which would remain fairly together if you got to know each person before they started using, at least in the case of cannabis. For example, all the people i went to highschool with that i started using cannabis with i could have picked out which ones would be the stereotypes, and sure enough they are making my guess a reality. The people that do nothing but get high were the people who before they started using drugs werent the most logical to begin with. I just hate that stereotype being drawn across the board. There are responsible users out there.
 
Thanks all for the responses, I'm afraid yes, the author is lacking in mentioning the downsides to marijuana, namely the problems it causes with short term memory, perhaps I'll bring it up to him. I'm a very moderate user, and can honestly say that if I have any memory problems, they're very minimal as I tend to remember things better than the majority of people I know, however, I also don't smoke more than once a day, and normally less than a few times a week. That isn't to say that I just naturally have a good memory though, and perhaps it could become worse over time, IDK?

Either way, though the author failed to mention a few things, if you take the time to read the replies to the article (which I wouldn't expect anyone to do, I barely read a fraction of them myself,) you'll see that others have made good points and that the debate has been interesting.

In defense though, I found the article to be well written, and he did a great job of compiling very compelling research pieces. Certainly I wouldn't go into a debate with someone without knowing the negative effects that marijuana can have, but this just gives a small, concise list of all of the positive things, fully equipped with credible references.
 
I am the original author. I registered here just to respond to the criticism about memory problems and mental performance problems on marijuana, which I actually spent some time debating in the original diary in the comments section:

I would be happy to aknowledge short term memory problems. These go away after you cease using. They are a side effect of constant use and not letting your body return to baseline before you get high again. They are not perminant problems and only seen in very heavy marijuana users. I would like you to copy and paste what I post here and directly paste it in that thread if possible, because this was actually part of the debate in the dailykos diary.

"Impairments depended on the frequency of chronic marijuana use, i.e., light and intermediate marijuana use (defined by use one to four and five to six times weekly, respectively) were not associated with deficits. Intermediate use was associated with superior performance in one condition (fuzzy concepts) of a Concept Formation test."

Effects of chronic marijuana use on human cognition. Psychopharmacology Volume 110, Numbers 1-2 / January, 1993. Robert I. Block1 and M. M. Ghoneim1

Another larger study:

"Some cognitive deficits appear detectable at least 7 days after heavy cannabis use but appear reversible and related to recent cannabis exposure rather than irreversible and related to cumulative lifetime use."



This other study is listed here:

http://archpsyc.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/58/10/909

The important thing to remember is that overuse of anything will lead to side effects, that the only people with impairments were heavy users (multiple joints/day), that the effects were completely reversible, and that moderate users saw an INCREASE in at least one category of intellectual performance. Overuse of water will kill you with water intoxication. Overuse of unsaturated fats will still lead to heart disease, even though its completely fine and healthy with light or moderate use.

Oh, and also, don't forget, it not only does not impair memory with light and moderate use, but it SAVES long term memory by helping prevent Alzheimers.
 
interesting

But the matter remains, even if marijuana IS dangerous, prohibition makes marijuana more dangerous. Banned pesticides, glass dust, and illegal fertilizers make it into marijuana just for the higher profit margins, because marijuana is illegal, untaxed, and unregulated.
Click to expand...

this is really the bread and butter of it for me. WORLDWIDE, not just in north america, but WORLDWIDE i've seen that people simply want to get high. the views of the public on marijuana are not in line with the views of the government, and that is a serious problem because it ultimately leads to a kind of civil war. albeit a rather weak form of it because nobody really knows they're fighting it and nobody really knows who the enemy really is. one day it's the police, next day it's the drug dealer who ices the neighbour's daughter.

anywho, i didn't mean to stray too far from the point made in what i was quoting. i recently received a bag of weed dusted with some shit. now i don't give a fuck what it was, the point is that there are callous motherfuckers out there who care more about a dollar than the well-being of customers, which is not only a big faux-pas for a human being but also a really dipshit move for someone trying to sell a product that a bunch of other people potentially sell better of.

there are two facts here. 1) good marijuana does not cause the need for hospitalization. b) unregulated marijuana that's bad CAN cause the need for hospitalization. clearly, imposing standards are what is best for us all since we WILL get high one way or another. not just you and i, but a great percentage of the entire world's population is behind us on this.
 
supernovasky said:
I would like you to copy and paste what I post here and directly paste it in that thread if possible, because this was actually part of the debate in the dailykos diary.
Click to expand...

:D I think you meant to leave that part out, lol.
 
Cannabis certainly has negative effects that are readily apparent; but I think when compared with the negative effects of other substances (specifically alcohol, opiates, benzodiazepines etc) the negative effects are relatively benign. You're still probably better off not toking regularly, but I would be hesitant to say that the occasional toke is all that harmful, and could potentially even be beneficial. Cannabis has a very long history of use in humans, now that doesn't necessarily mean its "safe," but there's a reason that humanity has not been like "fuck that plant, let's stop growing it." It's because it treats us pretty well. :)

The only drugs that have harmed me less and benefited me more than cannabis are LSD and other psychedelics.
 
hey, author guy, you should chill son that weed is making you flip ;x

No but really I never would agree that it "always" has a certain negative effect after a period or even always leave you with any kind of negative effect. What I did say though (in a somewhat joking manner) is that it definitely "can" cause a negative effect in some, though what that might be seems to be at least somewhat different for any two people who might suffer. But I am 100% positive from observation of stoners for way too long (and smoking pot) that after smoking long enough a number of folks will end up with some kind of issue along the lines of demotivation/depersonalization/depression/anxiety or just some kind of thing in that general realm and/or just fucking up your life syndrome. If you want to say i'm wrong i'm not going to argue because I know it's hotly debated in psychiatry so we could both "prove" both sides, all i know is i'm positive i've seen it happen to multiple folks (like less than 5% for sure though)

oh and as for organics/pesticides and crap you have some kind of a point except
a) i'd never buy weed from anyone that would have ever let it get toxified like that, so imo just know your growers :D but seriously
b) it is 100% legal to grow buy and consume for medical purposes once you are authorized (and i am) in california but despite that it's explicity FOR medicine there is actually absolutely no regulation of the product at all sadly and
c) the proposed full legalization in california also very explicitly contains zero discussion of any product regulation (though imo it'd have to be added if they ever got close to serious)
so basically i'm in a 100% safer position than everyone smoking legal weed in la right now, sucks huh? and they ain't looking to change that at all
 
Last edited:
I spread this the only way I could. Bulletin on myspace thats right. I want to see this everywhere the internet is obviously the best weapon we have in the war on the war on drugs.
 
marijuana helps me to be productive because it reduces my anxiety, increases appetite (i'm underweight as it is), and gives me creative inspiration. i've never experienced cognitive problems and i smoke daily. in fact, i can think more clearly after i've smoked because it calms me down (i have ADD and a LD).

it has really been a life-saver for me.
 
I think that the article's claim that pot isn't bad for the lungs is a fallacy. Don't get me wrong, I love pot, but inhaling smoke regularly is bad. While in the short term it does dilate the bronchitis and relax breathing, and can even be used for asthma attacks, over time it does gunk up your lungs, and has a negative effect on breathing, although mild.

Think about how much tar builds up in a pipe or bong just from smoke passing through it, and then think of how your holding that smoke in for a few seconds before breathing out, and consider all of that build up in the lungs after a few years. And unlike with a glass piece, you can't just wash out your lungs with rubbing alcohol.

Overall I think pot is benifitial, but nothing is perfect and it has it's drawbacks. And even if pot was horribly destructive, I'd still support it's legalization because doing something self destructive is your own business, and if your not directly harming anyone else, no one should have the authority to tell you not to do it.
 
last bump for w/e reason, just link this up people for the simple sake of spreading some good info. Then, if you want to talk about the rest of the argument do so, but this is a great Idiot's guide to that can be passed around.


Do it now, then come back with some more convo... for you US citizens, we're not gong to see change for quite a while I assume, but this is a pretty cool source If you just want to remember a concise, easily printable, source of well constructed info.

why not pass it around guys? do what you can :)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top