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A critique and analysis of the bard McKenna

webbykevin

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Joined
Oct 29, 2010
Messages
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I dont know if anyone has posted a link to this before but I did a quick search and couldn't find anything.

It's an essay/study of Mckennas DMT rap that will have any die hard Terrence fans in an air clawing rage (as he would say).

I'm only halfway through reading it so will reserve my opinions until I've finished, but what do you guys think of this.

here's the link.......

http://www.realitysandwich.com/terence_dmt
 
Martin Ball is a deluded egomaniac. By far the best thing about that ^ article is the comments section, not the article itself
 
The most perfect way to encrypt and transfer information -- communications on the nature and prevailing conditions of the invisible landscape (to pull it on-topic most-elegantly!) -- would be the presentation of information in plain view for the consumption of those who viewed it in non-plain view!
But is the information being decoded correctly - or is only 1/3 being picked-up???

It makes me wonder!
But:
"A stitch in time saves nine!"
Signal
Noise
Noise
Noise
Noise
Noise
Noise
Noise
Noise
Noise

Over......................
 
Honestly, I love Terence but I don't idolize him so I knew I wouldn't get mad. However, this guy is making assumptions about Terence based on his voice. Some people have nasally voices because they have sinus problems. It's really that simple. You could argue that it's all connected, and it is, but you'd just be going around in circles forever. So I'm not gonna finish reading this, although it is quite interesting.
 
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If Terence McKenna had not made a name for himself before the internet started

and he came on a 'discussion board' such as this


no one would take any notice of him

and 16 year old kids who've tried acid once

would tell him that he is wrong

and that it's ALL subjective


and other people would agree

as they do now

since that is the current level of conversation

so

i'm not trying to make any friends here

obviously

or condemn anyone in this thread
but that is the truth


hopefully someone will disagree


so that those who don't see

can see

what i mean
 
I completely disagree with the notion that McKenna's experiences with the tryptamines (particularly DMT) are simply reflections of his own ego being projected and mapped onto the experience itself... I don't think it's quite that simple. I mean, did this guy ever thoroughly listen/read McKenna other than on a few 5 minute YouTube clips? If he did, he would know quite often (at least in his somewhat younger years), Terence would blast off on DMT hits while peaking on tabs of the infamous orange sunshine LSD... he said it allowed him greater accessibility to the breakthrough, intensifying it while at the same time keeping him suspended in that breakthrough state for a longer period of time, allowing him to more efficiently navigate the space without the abruptness and time constraints encountered with just DMT alone.

Which brings one to the question; how does one NOT experience ego death while peaking on 250mics of LSD and 50mg or better of DMT? In this state, you are not going to have any concept of self.. I feel at a certain point once you hit a certain dosage range with tryptamines, ego throws its hands up in surrender and gives you over completely to the flow... It goes without saying this effect is greatly magnified when using multiple tryptamines in the same session. I would like to see the author of that article dose 250mics or better of LSD and at the peak of its intensity take three or four huge hits of DMT, and THEN try to come back from that saying you still held on to concepts of self..... Sorry Mr. Bell, but the dosage ranges for tryptamines that Terence typically advocated (and dosed himself) are most certainly far beyond even the strongest clutches of ego..

Another part of the article that struck me as odd (and seems to suggested that Martin Bell is at least relatively unfamiliar with all of McKenna's work) is this part;

Terence raises all sorts of speculations, questions, and possibilities, without ever making any definitive statements.

Ummm.. that was part of McKenna's whole ideology... don't cling too tightly to anything. Work with the best models you have at the time being, constantly question them and test them, when your models become obsolete, move forward with newer and better models and question those until you come across a better model, etc etc. His whole rap was about questioning everything... he was often the first to say it, always urging his listeners to come to their own conclusions and insisting they not simply believe what he says, but instead constantly inviting them to criticize his theories and develop their own. Ultimately he was just trying to give us a more effective dialogue to discuss this topic of psychedelics and tryptamine induced states of consciousness, he was not saying "Believe everything I say and take it as undisputed fact"... He enjoyed a good criticism probably more than compliments, simply because if the criticism was legitimate, it would cause him to rethink some things and grow as person/psychedelic explorer... to move onward to a newer and better model of thought.

He has stated it multiple times, that he simply wants to show people that things CAN indeed be looked at differently, and these subjective views of reality are at times just as valid as the currently accepted objective reality we have come to know...

I feel the author is essentially unfamiliar with a large body of McKenna's work... Makes me kind of doubt that he has ever read any of McKenna's four published works (more if you count the transcription of trialogues with Sheldrake and Abraham) and given them a fair chance, or that he had ever listened to/attended any of McKenna's lectures/workshops..

I'm sorry Martin Bell, but you're not quite qualified to write a thorough dissection of a mans entire career and lifes work based on the few random YouTube clips and couple interviews with Terence you have seen... I don't even want to mention the thing about the nasally voice.

And get this;

As with my writings, my views, as expressed on this podcast, are often challenging for listeners, but can also be profoundly transformative and liberating.

This is how Martin Bell describes himself on his website 8( ... Whole thing hes pushing looks/feels a little on the fake side.. The more I look into the author who wrote this article, the more I am skeptical of what he has to say to be honest.


I'm not one of the followers who believe Terence could do/say no wrong, and I certainly don't subscribe to all of his theories myself, but I do feel this criticisms in this article aren't very legitimate... Just my 2cents :)
 
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I get a huge feeling many people misunderstand Terrence all together.
Not only that, but Terrence missed out on some of this newer shit like MXE...
so I believe he has only part of the full story.

There have been advancements since Terrence, you could put it.

But, Terrence is awesome. But h is also missing pieces I think.
Yet, many don't even try to understand what he is putting out, and it's very obvious who those people are when they come about.

You will also run into those trying to diss-inform you.

Basically, you can't follow anyone too closely because at some point everyone is misleading or sniffing their own trail. None of us really have all the answers. Very Very few... and it's none of us talking about it here. The one(s) with all the answers runs the whole joint, whoever that could be.
The most perfect way to encrypt and transfer information -- communications on the nature and prevailing conditions of the invisible landscape (to pull it on-topic most-elegantly!) -- would be the presentation of information in plain view for the consumption of those who viewed it in non-plain view!
But is the information being decoded correctly - or is only 1/3 being picked-up???
this, too. ^^^

And this... VVV
f Terence McKenna had not made a name for himself before the internet started

and he came on a 'discussion board' such as this


no one would take any notice of him

and 16 year old kids who've tried acid once

would tell him that he is wrong

and that it's ALL subjective
These statements could not be any more true.

Walk a few miles in Terrence's shoes and then try to tell me all the stuff he is saying is wrong and incorrect and made up drug induced BS.

Respect those who put in effort to bring you their experiences, and use the info how you will, but do not discriminate. It only makes you look immature. If you can't handle what somebody says, walk away and find somebody else to listen to, or better yet, make your own speak.

Anyone who has never hit the jackpot can say what it feels like holding the bucket of coins.
Unless they are trying to make a name for themselves holding somebody elses coins.

Perhaps if you walk around saying you think you know this or that about Terrence, it brings you instant notoriety. Weather positive or negative, some will view any publicity as "good".
 
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When he isn't referencing visuals from trips,
He has some extremely valid points.

He's trying to bring you info from beyond that you cannot put into words. Of course it sounds like rambling insanity.
You have to learn how to listen and understand what he is saying. Not the shit about his trips. The shitabout what he's learned from it and what he's trying to relay.

It's obvious he has more to say that he can't fit into words, since he can't stop talking.
I have listened to hours of his speeches by now. A good portion of it makes sense to me and then a good portion of it doesn't, compared to what I've experienced. But I still respect Terrence for trying to get the word out there that you need to free your mind and some of this is being kept from you.

He's doing it the best way he can for who he is.
Doesn't matter if some of his theories are nuts. Some of mine are too, and I bet everyone has a few nutty theories. That's what makes us unique and special. We are allowed to come up with our own stuff.

"Think for yourself. Don't rely on someone else."
D.R.I.
 
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the article is a pile of shite.

When ever a successful person dies there is always somebody who wants to be the first to say that thier success wasnt deserved.

To me Terrance's core message will always be valid.

IMO he never presented himself as some guru, he never claimed to have all the answers, he just threw out some leftfield ideas for us to chew over and play with.
But the basic core of it all seemed to be that reality is probably stranger that our stupid monkey brains can comprehend, and stranger than our stupid monkey brain religion science can explain at this current time.

The author of the article seems very keen to boast about his drug use, maybe he DID smoke more 5meoDMT than Terrance, maybe he's smoked more 5meo than any other human being in history. That doesn't make his opions more valid than anyone else's.

There was a tiny hint of Terrance backlash on here recently, after someone posted a link to youtube video about dennis' new book. I'm glad that the slight anti - terrance vibe never really gain momentum.

Even if he did stop doing mushrooms in the 80s so what ?
That doesn't make him detract from his skills as a writer, philosopher and engaging public speaker.

I'm very much looking forward to the release of The Brotherhood of the Screaming Abyss. I hope it tells us more about the man behind the myth.


PS - I didnt even finish the article. I got bored halfway thru. When has that ever been said about anything Terrance wrote ?
So Fuck you Mr 5meoDMT!


reads thread then realises that fractal throw has made the same point, but more eloquently than me
allllways the way
 
The author is just mad at the wave of neophytes who take McKenna entirely too seriously and not as allegorical thought stimulation. Like a bunch of us are, I'm sure. McKenna was an eloquent man who happened to reach a large audience is all. He didn't have the Answer, just perspectives, like all the other psychedelic figures throughout history. Problem is, just like Leary, there weren't enough THOROUGHLY EDUCATED people listening to him. The impressionable youth just take what he says at face value, and really only listen to the pop ideas anyway.
 
I think he's one of the most sane people I have ever heard. Maybe people who haven't taken the drugs think he's a bit far out; but his grasp of philosophy is tip-top-on-the-top! Many philosophers have been called insane-- usually by people who don't understand why people would even consider such questions (or so that is the phenomenon as it appears to me! -- covering my philosophical ass).
 
http://cognitionfactor.net/cinema/screen-8.aspx

I love when he says, 'to be the discoverer of the time wave--if it's true, is a very strange position to be in.'

I'm also very glad that he has all of these ideas and most of the discussion comes from, 'regardless of whether or not this idea is true, if it is what implications does it have.' and that's what stops him from being 'insane' in my book. On top of that he's been pretty eloquent in explaining all of his crazy ideas so that helps.
 
Terrence was far from insane, or spun out on his own ego or psychedelic drug use.

Personally, i think he entertained some pretty heavy critical thinking about the world around him that people in general tend to stray away from, since they don't consider their "beliefs" just that, beliefs.

Some of the things/theory's he said seem improbable, and crazy, but its not like he gets experience confused with observation and science.

To me, hes a highly intelligent renaissance thinker, who entertains theory's/thought that come off as crazy when people don't realize its just playful to him, and he didn't go around representing them as facts. Often he laughed and joked about how crazy some of the stuff he says is. I see him as one of the most creative thinkers of our time, when he's taken literally talking about tripping and his experiences doing do, of course he sounds crazy. But he himself would admit he doesn't take them seriously, and is fairly scientific when it comes to making claims.

One of his lectures that to me shows how far from crazy he really is is the hawaii interview done by John Hazard in 1998 right around the time he was diagnosed with brain cancer. If you can watch that and say afterwards what he's saying is irrelevant babble of a madman, you may need to reevaluate your definition of crazy.
 
I'm gonna be meeting Dennis in a few weeks time when he comes to Byron Bay, I have plenty to ask him and will also be shaking him warmly by the hand and thanking him for everything he and Terrence have done for the cause over the last 40 years.
 
I'm gonna be meeting Dennis in a few weeks time when he comes to Byron Bay, I have plenty to ask him and will also be shaking him warmly by the hand and thanking him for everything he and Terrence have done for the cause over the last 40 years.

Why's he coming to Byron Bay? I could look it up-- but since you're online(!)..........
 
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