intensecycle
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2011
- Messages
- 110
TR 4-ACO-DMT #1
Title: Confusion and awkwardness, euphoria and depression
Substance: 4-ACO-DMT
Dosage: 30mg fumarate dissolved in water
Personal data: Male, 85kg, 178 cm, 26 years old
Set & Setting: After not very difficult bicycle trip, on the countryside with few friends, indoors
Rating: 7/10
Previous experiences:
* Weed (many times)
* Shrooms (x3)
* Kratom (x4)
* Salvia (x1)
* Alprazolam (x2)
* Amphetamine (x1)
* DOI (x1)
* 4-HO-MET (x1)
* Dichloropane (x2)
* Methylone (x2)
* 2C-C (x2)
Substance appearance: slightly tan powder
Physical condition: athletic, exercise daily, but some back pains and undiagnosed ADHD and cyclothymic (slightly bipolar)
Medications and addictions: none except vitamins.
Closest previous trip: Methylone month before
Tolerance: None
Sensitivity: Low?
Addiction potential: Low
Main effects: confusion, slight patterns, deeper emotions,
Side effects: None
After effects: Nice fantasy afteglow and better mood
Shulgin scale: **
T 00:00
After cycling some offroad in the cold weather, we got to the house in the woods. We had around 100mg of 4-ACO-DMT dissolved in water, on empty stomachs. Gecko (a girl) took around 13mg and Panda, Me and Coyote took what left over divided by three, that is, around 30mg each. All of them used small amount of water, while I used a lot of and drank it more slowly.
Few words about my friends: Gecko is very young and inexperienced girl, but she understands common life well. Panda is my age, but he is totally clueless about life and people, and has enormous self-esteem and self-control issues. Coyote is older, very wise and calm man with wife and children.
T +00:40-01:00
It hard to tell exact times, but soon we started to feel effects. Come-up was quick and intense. Coyote, usually very calm and quiet man started to laugh uncontrollably, running around and doing stupid shit, like taking water cup and spilling water around without reason . Panda was a little frightened and screamed "Never again I will take so much of subtance at once at first time", but overall he was ok. I, myself, felt only confused, not CEV, no OEV, no interesting thoughts, just a little confusion and that's all.
Also, Gecko started to think worrysome thoughts: that we are laughing at her. She herself was not experiencing much, and without much experience with psychedelics, did not understand, why we are all behaving so strangely. So, she went to another room and sat there, starring in he window. After some time, I started worrying. She asked if taking some benzos will help, I said yes and gave her Alprazolam. It did calm her, but she became extremely unresponsive and quiet, answering "everyting ok" and "I don't want or need anything" to all my questions and concerns.
T +01:00-04:00
From this point, trip was interesting only for Panda and Coyote. They seen a lot of OEV, and they did not know Gecko was having bad trip (Luckily, I managed not to tell them). Meanwhile, Gecko was in very bad state: for a 4 hours, she just sat near the window and stared into nothing, feeling that what she was done was wrong and wanting to commit suicide, even. Beware people, set and setting is EVERYTHING with psychedelics!
As strange as it is, but I did not feel very bad for her. I worried a little, but nothing that I couldn't handle. Sure, my enjoyment from trip was gone, so I mostly just waited for everything to end. Panda chatted to no end about some articles and events that impressed him to us, but I was just listening, not able to answer much. Things he spoke about was interesting (mythology etc), but I had no mental capacity to answer at this point. Also, I worried about Gecko and went to her room periodically. Later she told that this was even worse, and better way of action was to stay away. Also, she was cold and was not able to move AT ALL and to get blanket even. This continued for 4 hours, kind of bad experience. She felt dizzy and confused, too, and only good things she remembers is how she looked out of the window it was interesting, and also she seen colored human figurines with eyes closed. Now I think it is probably good she started low, because who knows what kind of horrors could she seen with high dosage. But you will not know if this is true, anyway. Make sure you have blankets and comfortable chairs/couches to lie and sit, this was a problem for me too.
Coyote later told that he understood during this trip, how his wife feels, always feeling something, a lot of emotions, thoughts etc. He himself in the common life usually does not feel much, and just looks how life passes with some slight slow amazement. But under 4-ACO-DMT he felt how strong people emotions can be (I can appreciate it, because my emotional state is very unreliable, I'm probably cyclothymic or even slightly bipolar). But anyway, this trip, as well as any RC trip he had was not impressive to him and he did not learn much from it, in contrast to LSD he used many times a few years back.
Coyote and Me ate a lot during later stages of the trip. Food was pretty good, but we ate mostly because we was hungry at first, and then just to spend time. We also read one lyrical and simple-life praising poet, but I was not able to concentrate on reading. But every word I read impressed me much and caused emotional spikes. I was wondering, how poets can feel surrounding life and world in such strong way without any substances (for this particular man, maybe except booze). I also feel strong emotions a lot, but often I'm not able to concentrate on my surrounding and praise people, nature, take into account small nice details. I usually just think about something and not looking around, and not noticing a lot of what things consist of.
In the later stage, Panda started to argue with Coyoute, asking "Why do you take psychedelics? You think it is all entertainment?" and things like that. Coyote, being very cautious and not direct person, asked him in return "Do you get joy from life, Panda?". This cooled Panda's head a little, but even so he replied with emotion: "I have great joy in life, more strong and intense then any of you". Note, this is obviously not true at large, because Panda is often depressed and complains to me, has almost no friends and buddies (except few), it is hard for him to talk with people, and in general he is having too many problems with his life (not real ones, mostly mental stuff). So, he just was not able to comprehend at this moment, that currently 5HT2a receptor is overblown, and that's why emotions feel so deep and life seems precious, intense and joyful.
Coyote is not person that will argue directly about such questions, and he will not try to explain anything to anyone, so discussion stopped. Later, Panda felt sorry for what he did, but was not even able to say so to Coyote, being shy and fearful, his usual self.
T +04:00-07:00
Waves of experience became less pronounced, and we took our bikes and went home. It was very nice, slowly riding a bicycle over countryside on the gravel road in the darkness. Also, it become much warmer in the evening, or maybe our body temp regulation was working again. During this time, we seen some trees, stars, and some metallic gates with lights over the railroad. It was very beautiful - these gates looked like giant guardian robot for me, friendly, assuring and reliable.
Summary
Overall, this trip was not impressive to me. Maybe, because I'm larger person, but Panda and Coyote are slim, so they got stronger experience. Maybe, because I was worried a little for Gecko. Maybe, because I took substance dissolved in large amount of water. Anyway, for Panda trip was something to remember, less so for Coyote, and a bit scary for Gecko. Unfortunately, next day she still was extremely upset and tired, not able even to speak. Luckily, I spend a day with her, comforting and caring, so she could feel everything is ok, and she has nothing to worry about. In the following weeks, she was able to integrate experience and allow it pass. After that, she no longer has fear of what happened, and took psychedelics again without any trouble.
My advice: do not take 4-ACO-DMT lightly, thinking it will be always euphoric and fun. As we see, it can be strong and even fearful. Do not start from 30mg, unless you are very experienced, and be ready that come-up will be overwhelming.
Tagged by Xorkoth
substancecode_4acodmt
substancecode_tryptamines
explevel_firsttime
exptype_neutral
exptype_difficult
roacode_oral
Title: Confusion and awkwardness, euphoria and depression
Substance: 4-ACO-DMT
Dosage: 30mg fumarate dissolved in water
Personal data: Male, 85kg, 178 cm, 26 years old
Set & Setting: After not very difficult bicycle trip, on the countryside with few friends, indoors
Rating: 7/10
Previous experiences:
* Weed (many times)
* Shrooms (x3)
* Kratom (x4)
* Salvia (x1)
* Alprazolam (x2)
* Amphetamine (x1)
* DOI (x1)
* 4-HO-MET (x1)
* Dichloropane (x2)
* Methylone (x2)
* 2C-C (x2)
Substance appearance: slightly tan powder
Physical condition: athletic, exercise daily, but some back pains and undiagnosed ADHD and cyclothymic (slightly bipolar)
Medications and addictions: none except vitamins.
Closest previous trip: Methylone month before
Tolerance: None
Sensitivity: Low?
Addiction potential: Low
Main effects: confusion, slight patterns, deeper emotions,
Side effects: None
After effects: Nice fantasy afteglow and better mood
Shulgin scale: **
T 00:00
After cycling some offroad in the cold weather, we got to the house in the woods. We had around 100mg of 4-ACO-DMT dissolved in water, on empty stomachs. Gecko (a girl) took around 13mg and Panda, Me and Coyote took what left over divided by three, that is, around 30mg each. All of them used small amount of water, while I used a lot of and drank it more slowly.
Few words about my friends: Gecko is very young and inexperienced girl, but she understands common life well. Panda is my age, but he is totally clueless about life and people, and has enormous self-esteem and self-control issues. Coyote is older, very wise and calm man with wife and children.
T +00:40-01:00
It hard to tell exact times, but soon we started to feel effects. Come-up was quick and intense. Coyote, usually very calm and quiet man started to laugh uncontrollably, running around and doing stupid shit, like taking water cup and spilling water around without reason . Panda was a little frightened and screamed "Never again I will take so much of subtance at once at first time", but overall he was ok. I, myself, felt only confused, not CEV, no OEV, no interesting thoughts, just a little confusion and that's all.
Also, Gecko started to think worrysome thoughts: that we are laughing at her. She herself was not experiencing much, and without much experience with psychedelics, did not understand, why we are all behaving so strangely. So, she went to another room and sat there, starring in he window. After some time, I started worrying. She asked if taking some benzos will help, I said yes and gave her Alprazolam. It did calm her, but she became extremely unresponsive and quiet, answering "everyting ok" and "I don't want or need anything" to all my questions and concerns.
T +01:00-04:00
From this point, trip was interesting only for Panda and Coyote. They seen a lot of OEV, and they did not know Gecko was having bad trip (Luckily, I managed not to tell them). Meanwhile, Gecko was in very bad state: for a 4 hours, she just sat near the window and stared into nothing, feeling that what she was done was wrong and wanting to commit suicide, even. Beware people, set and setting is EVERYTHING with psychedelics!
As strange as it is, but I did not feel very bad for her. I worried a little, but nothing that I couldn't handle. Sure, my enjoyment from trip was gone, so I mostly just waited for everything to end. Panda chatted to no end about some articles and events that impressed him to us, but I was just listening, not able to answer much. Things he spoke about was interesting (mythology etc), but I had no mental capacity to answer at this point. Also, I worried about Gecko and went to her room periodically. Later she told that this was even worse, and better way of action was to stay away. Also, she was cold and was not able to move AT ALL and to get blanket even. This continued for 4 hours, kind of bad experience. She felt dizzy and confused, too, and only good things she remembers is how she looked out of the window it was interesting, and also she seen colored human figurines with eyes closed. Now I think it is probably good she started low, because who knows what kind of horrors could she seen with high dosage. But you will not know if this is true, anyway. Make sure you have blankets and comfortable chairs/couches to lie and sit, this was a problem for me too.
Coyote later told that he understood during this trip, how his wife feels, always feeling something, a lot of emotions, thoughts etc. He himself in the common life usually does not feel much, and just looks how life passes with some slight slow amazement. But under 4-ACO-DMT he felt how strong people emotions can be (I can appreciate it, because my emotional state is very unreliable, I'm probably cyclothymic or even slightly bipolar). But anyway, this trip, as well as any RC trip he had was not impressive to him and he did not learn much from it, in contrast to LSD he used many times a few years back.
Coyote and Me ate a lot during later stages of the trip. Food was pretty good, but we ate mostly because we was hungry at first, and then just to spend time. We also read one lyrical and simple-life praising poet, but I was not able to concentrate on reading. But every word I read impressed me much and caused emotional spikes. I was wondering, how poets can feel surrounding life and world in such strong way without any substances (for this particular man, maybe except booze). I also feel strong emotions a lot, but often I'm not able to concentrate on my surrounding and praise people, nature, take into account small nice details. I usually just think about something and not looking around, and not noticing a lot of what things consist of.
In the later stage, Panda started to argue with Coyoute, asking "Why do you take psychedelics? You think it is all entertainment?" and things like that. Coyote, being very cautious and not direct person, asked him in return "Do you get joy from life, Panda?". This cooled Panda's head a little, but even so he replied with emotion: "I have great joy in life, more strong and intense then any of you". Note, this is obviously not true at large, because Panda is often depressed and complains to me, has almost no friends and buddies (except few), it is hard for him to talk with people, and in general he is having too many problems with his life (not real ones, mostly mental stuff). So, he just was not able to comprehend at this moment, that currently 5HT2a receptor is overblown, and that's why emotions feel so deep and life seems precious, intense and joyful.
Coyote is not person that will argue directly about such questions, and he will not try to explain anything to anyone, so discussion stopped. Later, Panda felt sorry for what he did, but was not even able to say so to Coyote, being shy and fearful, his usual self.
T +04:00-07:00
Waves of experience became less pronounced, and we took our bikes and went home. It was very nice, slowly riding a bicycle over countryside on the gravel road in the darkness. Also, it become much warmer in the evening, or maybe our body temp regulation was working again. During this time, we seen some trees, stars, and some metallic gates with lights over the railroad. It was very beautiful - these gates looked like giant guardian robot for me, friendly, assuring and reliable.
Summary
Overall, this trip was not impressive to me. Maybe, because I'm larger person, but Panda and Coyote are slim, so they got stronger experience. Maybe, because I was worried a little for Gecko. Maybe, because I took substance dissolved in large amount of water. Anyway, for Panda trip was something to remember, less so for Coyote, and a bit scary for Gecko. Unfortunately, next day she still was extremely upset and tired, not able even to speak. Luckily, I spend a day with her, comforting and caring, so she could feel everything is ok, and she has nothing to worry about. In the following weeks, she was able to integrate experience and allow it pass. After that, she no longer has fear of what happened, and took psychedelics again without any trouble.
My advice: do not take 4-ACO-DMT lightly, thinking it will be always euphoric and fun. As we see, it can be strong and even fearful. Do not start from 30mg, unless you are very experienced, and be ready that come-up will be overwhelming.
Tagged by Xorkoth
substancecode_4acodmt
substancecode_tryptamines
explevel_firsttime
exptype_neutral
exptype_difficult
roacode_oral
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