3 weeks of depression after doing MDMA

[Delfin]

Hi everyone

I write this post in hope for some clarity and advice regarding my current situation.

I will start from the very beginning. I am not experienced with drugs at all (I do occasionally smoke some weed, and I have tried coke twice), however this New years eve, me and some of my friends agreed to try some MDMA. We had been drinking quit a lot that night and just after midnight we shared the MDMA. Due to the fact that I was quit drunk, I chose to go pretty easy with the dose (I did only half of my friends actually).. I had a nice but short trip, and a couple of hours later I wanted to try some more. As we couldn't get hold on more MDMA, we bought us some coke - and again, I went really easy with that aswell. Overall, I had a nice and fun evening, and was never near anything close to a bad trip.

The next day I woke up just fine, and the second day aswell. But as I was about to go to sleep on the second day, I was hit by a sudden panic attack.
I felt horrible - and I felt like i suffered an irrationel depression leading to lots of panic attacks every day.
By irrational I mean that there isn't anything specific which made me sad - I actually have a pretty nice and comfortable life - but now it was like everything and nothing made me sad, and every time i reflected on my situation I was hit by anxiety and panic.
Anyways, I knew that its common that you may suffer a depression after doing MDMA lasting for a week or so. And I actually felt like I was doing better everyday for the first week at least, but then all of the symptoms returned.

Now its 3 weeks since it started, and I'm actually doing worse. I have a lot of things in my surrounding that would normally make me very excited, but I really can't enjoy them at all (this includes a girl I've been seeing, who I now don't know what to do about). It feels like everything have lost its magic, and I'm reducing everything in life into meaning nothing. I honestly wouldn't be able to be excited even though I won a million dollars in the lottery.. and it kinda frightens me.
I do occasionally feel symptom-free (Or I have had one evening, where I out of a sudden, felt completely myself again, but the next morning I had the worst panic attack so far).. so it is like my mood swings all the time.

I have been reading several thread about this subject, and I have tried to do everything that people recommend - Eating healthy, exercise daily, socialize with your friends and so on, but I haven't experienced any improvement so far.

I'm not sure whether this is normal and for how long it would be going on? but I would really like some opinions on it. Im also not sure whether its the MDMA alone which are causing these problems, or if its the combination (it problaby is, but I did only do very little of both coke and MDMA)..

Have a nice day

 

[ScaredFirstTimer]

Hi man, I actually can't believe how similar your situation is to mine.

First off, the symptoms you are describing sounds very typical for a MDMA induced long term comedown. Not necassarily typical for a MDMA comedown in itself wich usually lasts much shorter, but you seem to have been unlucky/sensitive/fucked it up with the coke and/or drinking.

Wether it's the MDMA in itself, or the combo I don't know, but what you are describing is totally similar to me, and I only did MDMA + alcohol.

By irrational I mean that there isn't anything specific which made me sad - I actually have a pretty nice and comfortable life - but now it was like everything and nothing made me sad, and every time i reflected on my situation I was hit by anxiety and panic.

100% what I felt during the first weeks. The fact that it's so irrational made it harder for me to accept it. Once I "accepted" that this is how life feels now, simultanously focusing on getting better ofcourse, it dissapated.

(this includes a girl I've been seeing, who I now don't know what to do about).

Same here.. I met a girl a month or two before the comedown started for me (8 weeks), and I've been seeing her a few times during these weeks. Luckily it has been during good days, and I know that social contact in general keeps most of the anxiety away. For some reason the mild anxiety/awkwardness with a new girl feels totally seperated from the anxiety I'm feeling on the day to day. The only really negative thing I've noticed when it comes to this particular situation is that it can induce mild to moderate anxiety when I suddenly think about the girl, "how can I take it further now that I'm fucked", "what will happen with her if I don't get well in a few weeks" etc etc.
In general I just think fuck it, getting back to 100% is the main focus now, not some girl.

All I can say is that you are in the same boat as lots of peeps on this forum right now. How long it will take is highly individual. It could be a few weeks, or months. The comedown threads on here is testament to the fact that you will get better. It's amazing how much drug-abuse some guys went through, and got back to 100%.

 

[xammy]

Why is it that even more and more people seem to report these MDMA related symptoms nowadays? If you came and read this board it would look like MDMA just fucks you up like 90% of the time if you didn't know any better. Lucky me I've never had a bad comedown from MDMA.

Delfin, I'm sure time will help as you can see when you read other topics related to these symptoms on this board. I would recommend 5-HTP as that might boost your serotonin, atleast for me it works since I always post-load with it after MDMA.

 

[Delfin]

Hi man, I actually can't believe how similar your situation is to mine.

First off, the symptoms you are describing sounds very typical for a MDMA induced long term comedown. Not necassarily typical for a MDMA comedown in itself wich usually lasts much shorter, but you seem to have been unlucky/sensitive/fucked it up with the coke and/or drinking.

Wether it's the MDMA in itself, or the combo I don't know, but what you are describing is totally similar to me, and I only did MDMA + alcohol.



100% what I felt during the first weeks. The fact that it's so irrational made it harder for me to accept it. Once I "accepted" that this is how life feels now, simultanously focusing on getting better ofcourse, it dissapated.



Same here.. I met a girl a month or two before the comedown started for me (8 weeks), and I've been seeing her a few times during these weeks. Luckily it has been during good days, and I know that social contact in general keeps most of the anxiety away. For some reason the mild anxiety/awkwardness with a new girl feels totally seperated from the anxiety I'm feeling on the day to day. The only really negative thing I've noticed when it comes to this particular situation is that it can induce mild to moderate anxiety when I suddenly think about the girl, "how can I take it further now that I'm fucked", "what will happen with her if I don't get well in a few weeks" etc etc.
In general I just think fuck it, getting back to 100% is the main focus now, not some girl.

All I can say is that you are in the same boat as lots of peeps on this forum right now. How long it will take is highly individual. It could be a few weeks, or months. The comedown threads on here is testament to the fact that you will get better. It's amazing how much drug-abuse some guys went through, and got back to 100%.

It's nice to hear that my symptoms aren't that unique
Am I reading it right, when I understand that you are all right again ? And if so, what seemed to work for you in order to get better?


The reason why I'm so worried, is because of the process of this comedown, - I seem to get better all the time, but as soon as I feel 'myself' again, I'll get knocked over by a serious comedown the next day, and it's like I'm starting over.. it has happened 3 times now

 

[ScaredFirstTimer]

Nah, not really all right unfortunately. When I said dissipated I meant that the exact feelings from the first weeks let go. I've felt close to recovered for almost 2 weeks during this, then it hit me again about a week ago. I've had some pretty bad anxiety/fear during that week, but it's manageable. I've only missed one day from work during all this. I kinda feel like the lack of sleep I get because of work is slowing my recovery down a bit, but on the other hand going to work is what keeps me sane

To be perfectly honest with you I think many months are needed to get through this 100%. The symptoms will get lesser and lesser throughout though, at least it has for me.

Another tip is to not get freaked out if you're good for a few days, and then out of the blue you're "fucked" again. It might happen many times before you're back to yourself as you say. On the other and, you might suddenly snap out of it after 4 weeks.

 

[MindOverMatter1]

Hey Delfin,

I'm going through a similar experience currently so I can understand the position you're in right now. I took 333mg MDMA as someone with no tolerance (including a redose) and am almost on week 4 of my comedown. I understand it sucks right now but just know in time things will sort itself out. When I first was going through my comedown I thought I did some brain damage (a lot of cognitive problems) and caused some emotional problems. I have noticed from week to week my symptoms have improved and yours will too. You're not me and it sounds like it will take longer for your recovery but do know that your situation is not uncommon at all and I am feeling a lot better after feeling like crap just a few weeks ago. Know that chances are ALL of your symptoms are directly MDMA related meaning in time your problems will be naturally sorted out as your brain chemistry gets back to normal. I do think drinking that night and doing coke exacerbated your MDMA comedown to some degree.

I had a friend that didn't take an unreasonable amount of MDMA and had panic attacks for 3 months before his symptoms basically vanished. I'm not saying it will take 3 months because everyone is different but there is almost a 100% chance that you will be fine as long you treat your body right and allow time to heal your wounds. Eat healthy, obviously avoid any kind of drugs (especially MDMA), exercise, meditate, take supplements (B-complex, 5-htp, Omega-3, Multivitamin), socialize, and sleep well.

Now its 3 weeks since it started, and I'm actually doing worse.

At the 2 week mark for me my symptoms (mainly depression and anxiety) were at their worst. I woke up and had an overwhelming feeling of hopelessness and anxiety. Since that day I have been having 'emotional hiccups' where all of a sudden my mood will change. In my case the emotional changes have become less severe as time has gone on. I honestly think the 'emotional hiccups' is just my brain rebooting. It's only a theory but I think the bad days are just my brain feeling off from readjustments in my brain chemistry during the recovery process resulting in increased depression/anxiety.

(Or I have had one evening, where I out of a sudden, felt completely myself again, but the next morning I had the worst panic attack so far).. so it is like my mood swings all the time.

The fact that you have felt completely like yourself again is a really good sign. You will probably notice these days will become more common, then you will have more good days then bad days, then hardly any bad days, then full recovery. Like I've said before, it takes time bro.

I have been reading several thread about this subject, and I have tried to do everything that people recommend - Eating healthy, exercise daily, socialize with your friends and so on, but I haven't experienced any improvement so far.

Sounds like your anxiety is getting the best of you and you may be paranoid. After a hard workout everyone notices immediate improvements in mood due to the endorphin boost it provides. Anxiety can make you feel like you're getting worse or not improving so it's best to keep your mind off of how you are feeling every moment due to the comedown. I'm not saying your problems aren't real because they are but thinking about them offers no gateway to improvement. Stop asking yourself how am I feeling now? How about now? Do the things you enjoy doing before this experience. Get your mind off of your current emotions. I know it's a lot easier said than done but dwelling on every emotion you have will not improve your symptoms and will only create an infinite thought loop of worry.

this includes a girl I've been seeing, who I now don't know what to do about

Don't fret. Keep doing your thing. The important thing to get better is to keep doing what you have been doing before your roll, don't isolate yourself because it will only make you feel worse about your situation. I'm in the same position as you right now as far as dealing with a girl during a shitty comedown. Let her know what you did. Open communication is key in any relationship. Tell her how you've been feeling just make sure she knows that you know you made a dumb mistake and you know how to handle something like this in the future (as in possibly not taking MDMA again if you had an adverse reaction to it). That way you won't feel anxiety about being weird around her without her not knowing what's going on. Furthermore, she won't judge you harshly if you are mature enough about it to say you made a mistake, you regret it, you've learned your lesson, and will make smarter decisions in the future. Also, make sure she knows you are still in full control of yourself it's just going to take some time to get back to where you were at. If you act cool about it and don't act like it's impacting you in a hugely negative way then she will be cool about it too (even if it is impacting you greatly just be cool about it, know it will get better). If you think she is the type of girl that will take this badly then maybe keep it to yourself but she may suspect something is up if you are as depressed/anxious as you make it sound like.

Finally, realize this - MDMA depleted your serotonin levels (serotonin controls mood, appetite, sleep, and more) meaning that of course you are going to be feeling anxious and depressed if you have low levels. In time, they will get back to where they were at especially because you have no history of abuse with MDMA. Some people experience long-term comedowns because of their genetics, brain chemistry, abuse of MDMA, and daily habits so it just seems like you are one of those people like me who takes longer to recuperate after a roll.


You'll be fine. What comes up must come down.

 

[Delfin]

Thank you for so much for your reply Mind, it really seems as we're in the same boat.

the last couple of days I have actually experienced improvements. I went out with my friends last night - something I thought I wasn't able to enjoy at the time, but I did - and I only has 2 beers. Also I told my family and friends about my condition, and they were all very understanding and supportive.. those things combined already made a huge impact.

I still get hit with anxiety as soon as I overthink my situation, but i'm trying not to fight it that much anymore - as soon as I really come to accept it, I guess it'll be easier

about the supplements, I have tried 5-htp, but I had the most crazy dreams at night, so I'm not gonna try that again.
I will be getting some B-complex and Omega 3 though. anything else you can recommend?

 

[MindOverMatter1]

I also take Magnesium and Vitamin D supplements daily. I notice an improvement in my my mood when I take Vitamin D (total 6000 IU daily) mainly because I don't get natural sources of it from sunlight due to it being freezing where I'm at right now. Magnesium isn't really necessary.

A common side effect of 5-htp is definitely crazy dreams but I actually enjoyed that side effect. It was like going on a new adventure every night I went to bed...VERY vivid dreams, each dream had a plot and a main set of characters it was actually cool. I saw definite benefits in mood when I took it which was only for about 2-3 weeks post-roll while my serotonin levels get up to the levels they were at. There hasn't been an extensive amount of research on 5-htp, it's unregulated, and there is actually some concerns with it containing a contaminant that could cause a serious adverse reaction (usually only in high doses) so that's why I only take it for 2-4 weeks post-roll.

Just keep living your life and the symptoms will subside and like I said before try not to dwell on what you are feeling each moment. Try to have a 'blank' mind so you're thoughts on your recovery don't drive you crazy. That's why I recommended meditation. Also, drink plenty of water. Furthermore, I wouldn't recommend drinking alcohol. It won't set your recovery process back that much (unless you're drinking often) but it won't make your recovery as fast as possible. Depression + Using a Depressant = Not helping symptoms. Finally, take every recovery post with a grain of salt. You are different from everyone else meaning what could take someone a week to recover from could take you 1-3 months. During my recovery I would google MDMA recovery stories non-stop and all it did was scare me more and focus my thoughts on my symptoms. The fact that you have not abused MDMA in any way means you will recover; you just have to let time go by and live healthy.

 

[ScaredFirstTimer]

There is research that indicates that you shouldn't really be taking 5-HTP longer than a week, as it can cause dopamin depletion over time. I never took it becaue it fucked with my sleep and I felt that it caused more anxiety. If you take it should definitely be for a short period. Google "high tryptophan diet" for something sustainable.

I can look up sources to this as there is a scientific report on the subject that is easily read by a layman with basic neurochemical knowledge.

 

[Delfin]

Thank your for the replies.

I have gone through a strange development lately. I feel like my anxiety has grown on me. The last couple of days I have been in the company of my friends, but i feel extremely disconnected from everything, and I'm not even close to enjoy anything that I've been doing..

HOWEVER.. in the evening/night from about 7 or 8 pm, I snap out of it all (more or less) - The anxiety is gone, I can watch a movie and actually enjoy it, I can watch a concert with my friends and completely forget everything, I can think about girls, and I can even sit by myself and actually feel quit calm. But as soon as I wake up in the morning, I'm living hell again..

So on one hand it has become worse, but for the late hours I'm almost 'cured' again.. Even though it may sound as a positive thing, i'm not really thinking it as being on.
It is hard to deal with the anxiety when it's coming in these waves.

Have any of you guys experienced the same thing? or do you have an idea on what is going on?

Thanks

 

[ScaredFirstTimer]

Hi again.

You will have to accept one thing, and that is that you might be in this for a long time. 4-5 weeks is really not much compared to others who suffer from the same thing. You might feel good for 5 days, then get the intense feeling of hopelessness and anxiety again out of the blue. The fact that you have periods without much anxiety is a very good sign.

The kind of cyclical anxiety you are describing is very similar to what I've experienced during my 9 weeks. I would have parts of the day where I had no anxiety/depression at all. Suddenly it would hit me, and it would be as if the good mind state/thoughts I had just minutes earlier wasn't real. That the anxious/depressed state was all that mattered. I found this extremely hard in the beginning, getting hit from left field with that kind of mental pain.

At the moment, I'm 9 weeks in, and for the last week I've felt as good as I ever have. I've had 30 minutes of anxiety in the last 7 days, and personality wise I feel 98% like my good old self again. But at the "time stage" you are at right now, I think I felt more or less the way you are describing.

What I know is working for me (no idea about whether supps works) is socializing, exercise and WALKING OUTSIDE. I do strength training, and the odd threadmill session, and I take 30-60min walks around town, or in nature. I try to get out during the day (sunlight), but I also walk around inner-city at night time getting to know the city better. I always feel kind of replenished after these walks.
Edit: One other thing that has helped me tremendously is work. Focusing on the tasks at hand is a great way to forget about anxiety. It might still be there, but you will learn to live normally despite it.

 

[Delfin]

Hi Scared

It's really great to hear that you have made such a big progress already!
Hopefully I will get there in a month or so too

How much MDMA did you do?

 

[badrobot114]

There is research that indicates that you shouldn't really be taking 5-HTP longer than a week, as it can cause dopamin depletion over time. I never took it becaue it fucked with my sleep and I felt that it caused more anxiety. If you take it should definitely be for a short period. Google "high tryptophan diet" for something sustainable.

I can look up sources to this as there is a scientific report on the subject that is easily read by a layman with basic neurochemical knowledge.

That's not entirely accurate, as it isn't the 5-HTP itself that lowers Dopamine. The problem is that the enzyme which metabolizes catecholaminergic precursors is rate limiting, so by forcing excess 5-HTP you're essentially leaving less of it for the other types of neurotransmitters which unbalances their ratios over time. The research you mentioned states that when one is treated with 5-HTP one should also take precursors for dopamine(and noradrenaline if I remember correctly, but don't quote me on that) and the doses of each supplement adjusted to maintain balance within the brain.

Of course this should only be done with a physician, so don't go chugging on neurotransmitter precursors by yourself. A diet with too much tryptophan can also cause this, so one shouldn't start such a diet on their own accord either.

The reason 5-HTP is good to take after MDMA is because Serotonin levels in the brain are obviously lower and aren't balanced with other neurotransmitters in which case it makes sense to increase Serotonin production at the expense of the rest(all within reason of course, I agree 5-HTP shouldn't be supplemented for longer than a week after rolling). Additionally, as we know, MDMA shuts down TPH(the enzyme that metabolizes tryptophan) so there really is no point eating more tryptophan for obvious reasons. 5-HTP skips this step which is why it works whereas supplementing straight up tryptophan or living on Bananas doesn't .

OP, have you tried supplementing Inositol? AFAIK it upregulates your Serotonergic receptors and helps the brain use Serotonin more efficiently, kind of like a mini SSRI but without side effects. It is used by conventional medicine to treat depression, anxiety OCD and even BPD if i'm not mistaken.

 

[Delfin]

Badrobot114:

Inositol? no, I haven't even heard about it. Just googled it and it seems quit harmless from what i can read..

I can't find anything about it in relation to a MDMA comedown though? Is this something that have worked for anyone?

 

[badrobot114]

I haven't heard anything related to using it on a bad comedown, but many claim it reduces MDMA tolerance(which makes sense considering how it affects Serotonin). It's considered very, very safe and it's cheap. I'm using it myself on-off(take it 3-4 times a week before i go to bed) and feel it works wonders with my mood while having zero side effects.

 

[ScaredFirstTimer]

That's not entirely accurate, as it isn't the 5-HTP itself that lowers Dopamine. The problem is that the enzyme which metabolizes catecholaminergic precursors is rate limiting, so by forcing excess 5-HTP you're essentially leaving less of it for the other types of neurotransmitters which unbalances their ratios over time. The research you mentioned states that when one is treated with 5-HTP one should also take precursors for dopamine(and noradrenaline if I remember correctly, but don't quote me on that) and the doses of each supplement adjusted to maintain balance within the brain.

Of course this should only be done with a physician, so don't go chugging on neurotransmitter precursors by yourself. A diet with too much tryptophan can also cause this, so one shouldn't start such a diet on their own accord either.

The reason 5-HTP is good to take after MDMA is because Serotonin levels in the brain are obviously lower and aren't balanced with other neurotransmitters in which case it makes sense to increase Serotonin production at the expense of the rest(all within reason of course, I agree 5-HTP shouldn't be supplemented for longer than a week after rolling). Additionally, as we know, MDMA shuts down TPH(the enzyme that metabolizes tryptophan) so there really is no point eating more tryptophan for obvious reasons. 5-HTP skips this step which is why it works whereas supplementing straight up tryptophan or living on Bananas doesn't .

Interesting, thanks for clearing that up!!

Delfin: I don't really know exactly how much I took, but I think it was around 250 mg of pure MDMA. It was basically my first time, and I did a stupid big redose like 6 hours into the roll. It made me roll HARD for another 4-5 hours, so it pretty much used my brains whole stack of serotonin it seems . I also drank heavily that weekend.

 

[badrobot114]

^

My pleasure the explanation is quite simplified of course, but I just wanted to get the general idea across.

It's important to note that with respect to Inositol and other supplements, maintaining a healthy diet, socializing(VERY important), exercising and time are the most important things. Supplements seem to work for some and not for others, and they aren't panacea.

If you try Inositol and it helps, that's great, you'll feel better and recover faster. However, that doesn't mean you should stop following the more basic advice. Similarly, if you try it and it doesn't help don't panic or think you'll never recover because you will. Think positive(I know it can be hard), give it time and I guarantee you'll be 100% faster than you think.

 

[Delfin]

Hi everybody.. I have another quick question regarding my recovery.

The thing is that I love green tea, and I know it's commonly recognized as very helpful against anxiety. Meanwhile I do recall reading somewhere that it can harm your recovery as well, but I'm not sure about this. Can someone please enlighten me? I drink around 2 cups a day, but would like to increase that

Btw. I just ordered some Inositol, and looking forward to try it

 

[ScaredFirstTimer]

Green tea contain caffeine, and most people would advice you to abstain from caffeine during a MDMA induced comedown. I don't know if caffeine is detrimental to recovery itself, but it is anxiogenic. I know personally that it would worsen my anxiety significantly, so I haven't touched coffee or caffeine containing tea in 2 months
Didn't know that green tea is considered to be helpful against anxiety.

If it doesn't increase your anxiety it might be nothing wrong with it. Especially if you feel that it is helping. It might not really contain that much caffeine in the first place.

 

[hazmatz]

Hi everyone

First thing I want to say is that you will not be stuck like this forever. I promise. I went through this same feeling (not depression but intense anxiety) after binge mdma usage and it took me a whole 6 months to recover. I had exactly what you describe, random waves of anxiety for no reason. I also had one panic attack during this time. My first suggestion is to find a cognitive behavioral therapist near you and call him / her (i prefer male) up as soon as possible. I know therapy is expensive and its demoralizing but it is so SO worth it. Another thing that helped me was making a conscious effort to see the positive aspect of every situation. Life is a beautiful thing and no matter what happens you must be thankful for everything you have. When you feel waves of anxiety washing over you, just stop, close your eyes, inhale deeply through your nose (breathe in until your chest fully expands) and then slowly breathe out through your mouth. Focus only on your breathing. focus on expanding your chest and taking deep slow breaths. This technique works because when you slow down your breathing and take bigger & fuller breaths, it slows down your heart rate which then tells your brain that since the heart is calm, there is no danger present and your mind can then relax. Anxiety is simply your flight-or-fight response kicking in because it thinks there is danger near by when there actually is not. So just remind yourself of that. Everything is fine. Really.




This video really helped me with managing my anxiety. it is worth watching. he explains things in such a good way.

Also, the book "The Road Less Traveled" by Scott Peck helped me manage my anxiety a lot as well. It is a self-help psychotherapy book that puts everything in a way that you can understand much better.

My final advice is to just live the moment. Focus on whats happening around you and stop thinking so much. I know it feels like you wont recover but you will. Good luck