2C-E Overdose, Toxicity, and Come up.

[MusicGuy]

2C-E has recently become my favorite compound, but I have just a few questions about it.

1.) The come up is rather rough (you feel as if you've gone to far), is there anyway to over come this? Possibly with Benzo's or certain vitamins?

2.) What do we know about the toxicity of 2C-E, long-term damage and short term-damage.

3.) How much must you take to experience an overdose on 2C-E? Does the change with you snort it or take it orally?

I really believe that this is a beautiful and amazing compound and even if it is made illegal people will still find a way to make it or get it.

Thanks for all your help guys

 

[RobotRipping]

If you do some research you shall find all those answers.

1. Smoke some cannabis before you hit that nausea/anxiety stage of the come up, but only if you smoke cannabis regularly as it does intensify effects while reducing nausea. My personal recommendation, use diphenhydryamine (50mg; it's benadryl) this makes the come up much easier, sometimes I just sleep through the come up and wake up when it's kicked in, which is weird but works. Also ginger tea, ginger gravol, ginger anything will help GREATLY with nausea. 2c-e just has a powerful come up, a benzo would do the trick but may alter your trip a bit.

2. short term, if you do not abuse it you will likely have no issues other than difficulty integrating your experience, as 2c-e is rather intense. There is no evidence one way or the other but from reading these boards/friends experiences, I gather that 2c-e short term, when not abused is not toxic. No one knows for sure what long-term effects may be.

3. Depends on what you mean by overdose; if you just mean you get the feeling you took too much/overwhelmed then it can happen as low as 30-40mg. But an overdose that causes death? no one really knows for sure and if you search through some threads on 2c-e you can see there is plenty of debate regarding this. Snorting 2c-e makes it quite a bit more potent, some say by 3x, so yes it does make a difference. I don't recommend snorting a 2c-x as many of them burn terribly.

Not sure what would happen if it were made illegal, but I don't want to find out either. Have fun with it and be safe while you still can.

 

[LogicSoDeveloped]

People have experimented with very, very high doses of 2c-e (300mg+) but this doesn't mean they are safe. I would say no more than 30, and you're pretty likely to be okay. Erowid has a dosage chart but as far as snorting, you come up faster, harder, and the trip is more intense. I'm not sure about the length of the trip but its probably shorter if insufflated. I took 25mg two days in a row and both days tripped relatively hard, though not too intense. Any more, however, and I might've had to try to enjoy whereas I felt like that was the perfect dose. Not too much of a body load and I acted very normal, as far as I'm concerned.

 

[MusicGuy]

If you do some research you shall find all those answers.

1. Smoke some cannabis before you hit that nausea/anxiety stage of the come up, but only if you smoke cannabis regularly as it does intensify effects while reducing nausea. My personal recommendation, use diphenhydryamine (50mg; it's benadryl) this makes the come up much easier, sometimes I just sleep through the come up and wake up when it's kicked in, which is weird but works. Also ginger tea, ginger gravol, ginger anything will help GREATLY with nausea. 2c-e just has a powerful come up, a benzo would do the trick but may alter your trip a bit.

2. short term, if you do not abuse it you will likely have no issues other than difficulty integrating your experience, as 2c-e is rather intense. There is no evidence one way or the other but from reading these boards/friends experiences, I gather that 2c-e short term, when not abused is not toxic. No one knows for sure what long-term effects may be.

3. Depends on what you mean by overdose; if you just mean you get the feeling you took too much/overwhelmed then it can happen as low as 30-40mg. But an overdose that causes death? no one really knows for sure and if you search through some threads on 2c-e you can see there is plenty of debate regarding this. Snorting 2c-e makes it quite a bit more potent, some say by 3x, so yes it does make a difference. I don't recommend snorting a 2c-x as many of them burn terribly.

Not sure what would happen if it were made illegal, but I don't want to find out either. Have fun with it and be safe while you still can.

1.) I don't smoke cannabis regularly, I choose not to as I gain no personal benefit from it. But I'll keep the benedryl idea in mind. I always snort it, the burn is worth the fact that it comes up much quicker.

2.) I don't think abusing any drug is a good idea, or anything for that matter. If you decided to eat a Big Mac everyday you'd get fat pretty quick wouldn't you? But just one a week and you're fine. Same thing with all other drugs, practice self control. As far as it being intense... "No bird soars to high if he soars with his own wings." Could we possibly find some medical papers on the toxicity of 2C-E?

3.) When I speak of overdose I mean causing yourself serious harm or death. Could we possibly combat an overdose if one were to overdose? I know a man who personally took 250mg of 2C-E, then again he does many other drugs in high doses as well. I've always heard and I personally believe that the burn is completely worth it. As a quick tip to anyone that plans on snorting it, I tend to dab a little on my finger and wipe the inside of my nose with it. I typically do this at least twice and then I spread the dose into each nostril, putting a little in your nose at first seems to numb you up to a degree.

Again... could we possibly find medical papers for the toxicity and overdose?

 

[MusicGuy]

People have experimented with very, very high doses of 2c-e (300mg+) but this doesn't mean they are safe. I would say no more than 30, and you're pretty likely to be okay. Erowid has a dosage chart but as far as snorting, you come up faster, harder, and the trip is more intense. I'm not sure about the length of the trip but its probably shorter if insufflated. I took 25mg two days in a row and both days tripped relatively hard, though not too intense. Any more, however, and I might've had to try to enjoy whereas I felt like that was the perfect dose. Not too much of a body load and I acted very normal, as far as I'm concerned.

Could you possibly write up a full trip report on your doses over 30mg? Especially the one were you took 300mg+? Explain how you felt mentally and pyschically afterwards as well, any "toxic" or "negative" effects you've noticed, any long-term effects you've noticed since you've because your (ab?)use of 2C-E?

 

[LogicSoDeveloped]

I didn't personally take nearly that much, I've only taken 2c-e 3 times, one 10 mg experience and the two 25 mg experiences. The guy who had the 300mg+ experience I met at a festival. I wish I could help. I can say that he said he didn't eat it all at once, rather over a period of 6-8 hours. I had just met him though and didn't get into details really except that he said he uses lots of research chems and thought he was prepared, he was still alive so I'd say it wasn't fatal for him but that dose could easily be fatal for others. In fact, there have been 2c-e OD's. I would say just stick to a regular dose and you should be relatively fine.

 

[RobotRipping]

@ Musicguy: can you find us some papers on the subject? lol I'll look around tonight but from what I've searched before, there are no definite answers and only animal studies. What makes you think this compound is so well studied? And you must hate your nose to prefer that route, I'd be worried about nasal damage, but again, no research on that has been done either (afaik).

 

[sekio]

Here's some 2c-E overdose reports for those interested.
http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=83446
http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=69307
http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=82159
http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=62410
http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=33380

Toxicity and overdose, from what I've seen, is mainly related to the standard psychedelic self-harm problems. Vasoconstriction is also a problem in huge, massive overdoses. Usually the only lastign after-effects are mild to moderate HPPD lasting for a while until the person re-integrates.

2c-E is a very potent 5-HT2B agonist and as such you should probably avoid using it every day, you'll risk cardiac valve problems. See also: fenfluramine.

 

[adamski10]

3. How much must you take to experience an overdose on 2C-E? Does the change with you snort it or take it orally?

I have had an experience of an overdose of 2c-e. we've come to the conclusion that we all consumed somewhere within the range of 40-60mg's- i knew within seconds that we'd fucked up because within half a second of (maybe even before) completing the line the walls had melted. i'm quite good with trippers but a few members of that group shouldn't have taken that drug- let alone at that dosage.

Although there was a significant rush, almost paralizing at times the mind fuck was unreal- one of our friends began to bad trip- becoming more and more confused, more and more derranged and more distressed... he was literally just walking around shouting, falling into things... it then became clear that this trip was very deep- all the person could say was his own name, my name, my friends name j, 360 backflip my spine, keep going keep going, shoot me in the face, shoot me in the fucking face, keep going.

My other friend J became distressed by this and stared to cling onto me for protection, i am homosexual and he breifly thought he was homosexual- we got stuck in a loop with the really fucked up M. he ended up trying to stab himself in the neck and at one point had two knives in each hand and was spinning around chanting his own name, J tried to jump out of a window. I have never been able to look at M in the same way since. my relationship with J (who is my best freind) became a complete head fuck- one of our other friends attempted suicide after because of the trip, but has regained stability.

in short, probs best not to push dosages that much- bad trips can get messy- if some of our sober friends hadn't of been there i genuinely think that someone would of died- either killed themselves or others. Respect your own mind enough to take good advice on scale and dosage. x

 

[DwayneHoover]

Why do people want to kill themselves on phychedelics? Whats not to like about a bright sparkly cartoonish reality? Its FUN!!! Not some unspeaklable horror... I just dont get it.

The above report of multiple people all wanting to do this sounds like some fabricated anti-drug propaganda designed to scare people away. Not accusing poster of doing that, just that the result SOUNDS LIKE that sort of thing. Yea, I think when people trip and get suicidal its really alot more rare than some would want us to believe... mainly when people who have no experience with psychedelics start to feel long-suppressed hidden thoughts and fears and memories that are allowed to bubble to the surface by doing way too mych psyedelic way too soon I guess... its just so strange compared to normal experiences that they are desparate to make it end any way any how. But why dont they just think "I will just wait and it will stop just like getting better from being sick." I mean that should be the obvious conclusion, right???

 

[huolesoh]

If you decided to eat a Big Mac everyday you'd get fat pretty quick wouldn't you?

don gorske!

knives and jumping out windows and suicide jesus fuck. reading your post made me pull a shocked face, adamski, glad things are better now.
i read an anecdote earlier aswell of broken friendships after taking too large number of mushrooms. i guess you really have to be careful with doses, the line between heaven and hell

 

[adamski10]

@dwayne

I can't express through words how fucked up 'the loop' was, you should also take into account the dosage there as well- have you ever experienced extreme high doses of trippers? Don't get me wrong, after all that madness when we began to come down i had the trip of my life BUT i can fully understand how the mind would want to escape itself in the grips of a horrible trip- it's never strait forward and always goes in circles- round and round and round- thinking its gone and BAM your back in the loop. In that particular trip aswell time stopped, i thought we'd been there for hours and it was about 3 mins.


i'd like to think of myself as quite an experienced and well grounded tripper- (within the last 9 or so months i've been through about 200 drops of liquid lucy and a gram of 4-ho and i'm still repin the green tea, going to the gym, student of the year at college, a bit wierd but oh well) and yes there is so so much beauty in these substances but one thing, and it might not even be apparent eg... a slight glance mis interpreted or even the physical proximity between people can be read into far far to deeply, and once one goes.... fuck.

All in all, keep the dose sensible.

 

[DwayneHoover]

Yep definitely. Gotta be careful not to get TOO into it. I am gay too btw, and have alot of experience with substances as well is other stuff. I understand how it could get weird ODing with a friend who suddenly thought he might be gay because of all the overwhelming feelings. Who knows perhaps he is or is Bi. I have a theory that most people are naturally OK with same-sex relations becuase they are familiar with their own sex's body and responses so it comes naturally... like the Bonobo Chimps (who we share the MOST dna with of all the apes by the way)...Anyway feel free to PM me if you wish to let me know of other posts you make and would be interested in feedback on, or things you might want advice about.

 

[Flickering]

The above report of multiple people all wanting to do this sounds like some fabricated anti-drug propaganda designed to scare people away. Not accusing poster of doing that, just that the result SOUNDS LIKE that sort of thing. Yea, I think when people trip and get suicidal its really alot more rare than some would want us to believe... mainly when people who have no experience with psychedelics start to feel long-suppressed hidden thoughts and fears and memories that are allowed to bubble to the surface by doing way too mych psyedelic way too soon I guess... its just so strange compared to normal experiences that they are desparate to make it end any way any how. But why dont they just think "I will just wait and it will stop just like getting better from being sick." I mean that should be the obvious conclusion, right???

It sounds like you've never had a bad trip before.

 

[DwayneHoover]

Oh indeed I have. I've had some where I was convinced I had ALREADY died and was filled with remorse for accidentally doing poisoned shrooms instead of psychedelic ones (not true of course) and was looking down in disgust and sadness at my pathetic life and sad end. And acid trips where I was convinced everyone and everything was part of some conspiracy against me. But those I was just relieved when they were over. None where I became suicidal. That's a flavor of "bad trip" I have mercifully not had, thank God.

 

[RobotRipping]

^ every time I shatter my ego I think I died and am eventually reborn lol. DXM always gives me that feeling in high doses, even the guilt of accidentally overdosing even though I know I didn't, I just keep going through the maths and making sure i didn't actually take too much, a few hours later; I'm all better and 'reborn'.

while i was at uni, a kid jumped out of his window and killed himself while on mushrooms. The kid must have had problems (was considered a suicide) but unfortunately this stuff happens to some people (yes, rarely). I don't know why this happens but a small percentage of people have really wild uncontrollable trips where they are less inhibited or something (that's just a guess).

Well my university has finally cut me off from peer reviewed journals but searching on google scholar didn't lead to anything related to toxicity/long or short term effects in humans; perhaps someone who has access to such info can help us out here, if there is any info. There's plenty of info on mescaline however, it's not 2c-e, but they aren't completely unrelated. Mescaline is perfectly safe and has a long history of use. It's too bad you can't just buy mescaline like you can 2c-e, I find they share a lot in common, subjectively at least.

 

[adamski10]

^ every time I shatter my ego I think I died and am eventually reborn lol. DXM always gives me that feeling in high doses, even the guilt of accidentally overdosing even though I know I didn't, I just keep going through the maths and making sure i didn't actually take too much, a few hours later; I'm all better and 'reborn'.

see i think thats why group trips are more susceptible for bad ones, people are trying to grab onto the ego- put on there game faces etc...

 

[adamski10]

Yep definitely. Gotta be careful not to get TOO into it. I am gay too btw, and have alot of experience with substances as well is other stuff. I understand how it could get weird ODing with a friend who suddenly thought he might be gay because of all the overwhelming feelings. Who knows perhaps he is or is Bi. I have a theory that most people are naturally OK with same-sex relations becuase they are familiar with their own sex's body and responses so it comes naturally... like the Bonobo Chimps (who we share the MOST dna with of all the apes by the way)...Anyway feel free to PM me if you wish to let me know of other posts you make and would be interested in feedback on, or things you might want advice about.

J's deffo hetrosexual, tho he likes to flirt the bas'ard. However i think that the 'own name, my name, my friends name j, 360 backflip my spine, keep going keep going, shoot me in the face, shoot me in the fucking face, keep going. ' was relating to the other persons hidden sexuality...

 

[greenmeanies]

dwayne, i think you gotta realize that everyone makes their own demons inside themselves for whatever reasons. perhaps there's a repressed childhood trauma that the ego wants to keep hidden (so hidden that the conscious mind actually forgot it was there) and its sudden resurgence during an emotional trip is really difficult to put back down, especially if it was SUPPOSED to be a fun colorful trip through candyland with some best mates. often times the only solution to escape the looping trauma is to resolve to kill the source--- oneself. obviously that is why tripsitters are a wonderful tool.

how would your bad mushroom trip have gone if you had thought that you were not only responsible for poisoning yourself, but poisoning your best friends too? what if you realized you were a sociopath who had tricked your friends into overdosing on cyanide with you? or any number of horrifying scenes that can be difficult to wrangle back down into sanity.

 

[TheKiller08]

Benzos dull out a lot of the sensations I get throughout my body when I am on a 2c-e trip. Smoke some good weed with it to get rid of the anxiety. Save any benzos you may have for the come down, it is a bitch to sleep after a trip and a strong benzo will put you right out.