25EF-nBOMe

[bloodshed344]

25T-nBOMe, 2C-EF, 2C-T, and maybe other thio and fluorinated analogs such as 25T21-nBOMe (very unique idea, along with potentially a unique activity), and 25TFM-nBOMe.

Based on nBOMe SAR the potency has to do with, I think the electronegativity in the 4 position, so how would these sulfurated (lol) and fluorinated derivatives compare in the likes of electronegativity and other things like that. For example I know that difluoromethyl could end up being more potent than trifluoromethyl based on this, how would all these different combinations, including 25T21 compare on this kind of analysis? How would fluoro, methylfluoro, difluoromethylthio, trifluoromethyl, trifluoromethylthio etc etc, stack up? There doesn't have to be some kind of massive comprehensive list, but that's what I'm hoping for. The future of nBOMe development is with substitutions like these which will most likely have much different effects than they do in their phenethylamine cousins.

Basically I'd like opinions on how these different substitutions could differ in electronegativity, molecular mass, etc and how this could affect SAR.

Also I'd like to know if any of the compounds I mentioned have already been made and assayed for their Ki (links would be appreciated ]

Thanks to all responders, and just as a final point I am 99% sure 2C-EF and 25EF-nBOMe will be made.
Any guesses by informed individuals on the SAR of these different substitutions on 25x-nBOMe will be highly valuable, and plain data on all the substitutions (such as electronegativity, molecular mass, and whatever else is important) would be MOST helpful.

Thanks!

 

[IamMe90]

Wow, 2c-ef is supposed to be quite wonderful, F&B wrote a glowing trip report about it a long time ago. I'll have to keep my eyes out for it if what you say is true. It's not exactly common.

 

[ebola?]

Wow, 2c-ef is supposed to be quite wonderful, F&B wrote a glowing trip report about it a long time ago. I'll have to keep my eyes out for it if what you say is true. It's not exactly common.

meh...the nBOMe derivatives' effects don't really have much to do with the effects of the parent compounds, and FandB responds quite idiosyncratically to a number of compounds (not to say that 2C-EF wasn't a winner...a couple of other people really liked it).

ebola

 

[Asante]

Given how thioalkyl phenethylamines affect different people quite differently in terms of potency, making a NBOMe is particularly unwise.

 

[Help?!?!]

Given how thioalkyl phenethylamines affect different people quite differently in terms of potency, making a NBOMe is particularly unwise.

No offense but who are you to say? There's no knowing until..........

 

[bloodshed344]

We'll see how the 25EF-NBOME turns out. However, I haven't seen any good talk about what I made the thread for!

I want SAR discussion and stats on different fluorinated and thio substitutions and how they might differ in the way they affect the pharmacology of a 25x-nbome compared to the effect they have on 2C-X pharmacology.

and honestly, just a hunch but I don't think the longer carbon chain will be any good on 25T7, I think it will BLEH. The ones that you should look out for are 25T-nbome and 25T21-nbome.

Input welcomed!

 

[tamarinds]

25T7 may turn out like 25TFM. Not nearly as potent as wished. That big para.
Does 25P follow too? The bulky 4 position not translate well into NBOMe

How is 25E?

 

[bloodshed344]

25T7 may turn out like 25TFM. Not nearly as potent as wished. That big para.
Does 25P follow too? The bulky 4 position not translate well into NBOMe

How is 25E?

EDIT: about the IMPORTANT PART of the post:
25E is not so good, not as good as 25D. Hence my very good feeling that 25T will be better than 25T2.

I want some SAR information on these substituents and how the 25-x-nbome structure affects this.

eg. how would 25T21-nbome and 25EF-nbome differ in effects?

What about 25MeF-NBOME, that should be better than 25EF simply because of the change from ethyl to methyl.
(If the change from 25E to 25D held true, which it very well might not)

 

[Help?!?!]

25T7 may turn out like 25TFM. Not nearly as potent as wished. That big para.
Does 25P follow too? The bulky 4 position not translate well into NBOMe

How is 25E?

I could care less if 25T7 is less potent, I want it for its legality and.....curiosity! I wish in certain cases like 25T7 that it would be like its counter part 2C-T-7. That would be seriously amazing as....who doesn't love T-7?!?

 

[bloodshed344]

We should probably cut out all the vend chatter before the big bad mods slam down on us with servere force! I could care less if 25T7 is less potent, I want it for its legality and.....curiosity! I wish in certain cases like 25T7 that it would be like its counter part 2C-T-7. That would be seriously amazing as....who doesn't love T-7?!?

Me. and sadly my two favorite phens are 2C-T-2 and 2C-P... I'm fairly sure 2C-T-7 would top either of them

and it's not just about potency. Based on pure speculation, 25T-nbome would be more potent with less side effects than 25T7-nbome. I believe the longer carbon chains are not beneficial.

 

[slo mo]

EDIT: about the IMPORTANT PART of the post:
25E is not so good, not as good as 25D. Hence my very good feeling that 25T will be better than 25T2.

I want some SAR information on these substituents and how the 25-x-nbome structure affects this.

eg. how would 25T21-nbome and 25EF-nbome differ in effects?

What about 25MeF-NBOME, that should be better than 25EF simply because of the change from ethyl to methyl.
(If the change from 25E to 25D held true, which it very well might not)

Can 25-DOxNBOMe be possible? As long as the 25T's are safe it will be welcome. Any facts to support them as being more safe nasal ROA than the parent compounds (like T7)?

 

[ebola?]

I want some SAR information on these substituents and how the 25-x-nbome structure affects this.

Honestly, we don't have much of an idea. In generally, it seems like bulky substituents confer reduced activity, at least looking at the 2C-halo-nBOMe compounds. It also seems like 2CH-nBOMe and to a lesser extent 2CD-nBOMe are pretty adrenergic and vasoconstrictive. I would guess, as did you, that 2CT-nBOMe would be a good starting point in the series, but who knows? This speculation isn't at all informed; we won't get anywhere without some in vitro information.

Can 25-DOxNBOMe be possible?

Yeah, a couple of these have been made, and they are a lot weaker in comparison to the 2Cx-nBOMe series (given that they've not been widely tasted, the potency is just vaguely known, somewhere between the DOXs and 2Cs). People say that they're 'weak', but I think that compounds with a 10-30 mg dosage range are a lot easier to work with than the 2Cx-nBOMes...they're just not as profitable for manufacturers and vendors.

ebola

 

[bloodshed344]

Honestly, we don't have much of an idea. In generally, it seems like bulky substituents confer reduced activity, at least looking at the 2C-halo-nBOMe compounds. It also seems like 2CH-nBOMe and to a lesser extent 2CD-nBOMe are pretty adrenergic and vasoconstrictive. I would guess, as did you, that 2CT-nBOMe would be a good starting point in the series, but who knows? This speculation isn't at all informed; we won't get anywhere without some in vitro information.
Yeah I was hoping that the comparison of ki values from nichols and heims work could help as well as the sta


Yeah, a couple of these have been made, and they are a lot weaker in comparison to the 2Cx-nBOMe series (given that they've not been widely tasted, the potency is just vaguely known, somewhere between the DOXs and 2Cs). People say that they're 'weak', but I think that compounds with a 10-30 mg dosage range are a lot easier to work with than the 2Cx-nBOMes...they're just not as profitable for manufacturers and vendors.

ebola

Well how about something we can do... a table of all different substituents that would be used at 4 position and compare that to what nbomes have been made and their ki values, use info from heims and nichols paper. The future of psychedelic creation will lie in the differences these substituents have at this position especially, but all positions, and then work needs to be on the tryptamine side of things.

PS wouldnt say DOB-NBOME yield DOB and probably cause overdose in sufficient amounts for the DOB-NBOME to be felt?

Well this could turn out a legal prodrug version of DOM-NBOME then. You would just eat it. The bad part is that it's obviously an analog.

 

[slo mo]

Honestly, we don't have much of an idea. In generally, it seems like bulky substituents confer reduced activity, at least looking at the 2C-halo-nBOMe compounds. It also seems like 2CH-nBOMe and to a lesser extent 2CD-nBOMe are pretty adrenergic and vasoconstrictive. I would guess, as did you, that 2CT-nBOMe would be a good starting point in the series, but who knows? This speculation isn't at all informed; we won't get anywhere without some in vitro information.



Yeah, a couple of these have been made, and they are a lot weaker in comparison to the 2Cx-nBOMe series (given that they've not been widely tasted, the potency is just vaguely known, somewhere between the DOXs and 2Cs). People say that they're 'weak', but I think that compounds with a 10-30 mg dosage range are a lot easier to work with than the 2Cx-nBOMes...they're just not as profitable for manufacturers and vendors.

ebola

It sounds ideal to me with 10-30mg doses but it might not market well . If these would be available in most of the world , I could see people (eventually) accepting the 10-30mg dose which also appears more forgiving than the sub mg NBOMEs. What would the duration be vs the parent compound?

 

[bloodshed344]

It sounds ideal to me with 10-30mg doses but it might not market well . If these would be available in most of the world , I could see people (eventually) accepting the 10-30mg dose which also appears more forgiving than the sub mg NBOMEs. What would the duration be vs the parent compound?

Like I said in my last post, wouldn't it metabolize into the more potent parent DOx compound?

 

[Incunabula]

Well how about something we can do... a table of all different substituents that would be used at 4 position and compare that to what nbomes have been made and their ki values, use info from heims and nichols paper.

As Ebola? said, we won't really know much more about these until some one tries them. I think this whole thing with putting so much emphasis on ki values is rather misguided, because in no way does it point to the subjective effects of the drugs. In many ways it's just pointless numbers.

Personally I have no interest what so ever in any of the NBOMe's you mention, and I have a strong hunch that they are all going to fall short of their 2C "parent" compounds. I do see the point in 25T7 if you don't have that one available. Then again, it's most likely going to be completely different in it's effects than 2CT7.

I really think it's too bad 25G-NBOMe is available but 2C-G is not. But I guess it's just obvious were the profit is, isn't it.

2CEF/DOEF, 2CTFM/DOTFM, those are the ones I think any vendor should focus on getting.

This all feels so much like a deja vu 8) Well, we'll see how it turns out lol

 

[Transform]

This started off a bit wobbly but never recovered itself from walking the line of specific vendor discussion. I've trimmed it all out as a result. Please be a little more respectful of the rules in future.

 

[bloodshed344]

As Ebola? said, we won't really know much more about these until some one tries them. I think this whole thing with putting so much emphasis on ki values is rather misguided, because in no way does it point to the subjective effects of the drugs. In many ways it's just pointless numbers.

Personally I have no interest what so ever in any of the NBOMe's you mention, and I have a strong hunch that they are all going to fall short of their 2C "parent" compounds. I do see the point in 25T7 if you don't have that one available. Then again, it's most likely going to be completely different in it's effects than 2CT7.

I really think it's too bad 25G-NBOMe is available but 2C-G is not. But I guess it's just obvious were the profit is, isn't it.

2CEF/DOEF, 2CTFM/DOTFM, those are the ones I think any vendor should focus on getting.

This all feels so much like a deja vu 8) Well, we'll see how it turns out lol

This is true but wouldn't ki values tell us which ones would be more adrenergic eg 25D/25E compared to 25C/I/B?

I'm just interested in how the substituent changes the binding affinity for different receptors like the adrenergic receptor.
Are 2C-D/2C-E more adrenergic than 2C-I/C/B?