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  • Current Events & Politics Moderators: deficiT | tryptakid | Foreigner

2017 Trump Presidency Thread

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Foreign Policy said it better dammit, it's why I still don't get paid anything:

The president of the United States had as his campaign chairman a man who had allegedly served for years as an unregistered foreign agent for a puppet government of Vladimir Putin, who was allegedly laundering remarkable sums of money even while running the now-president’s campaign, and who allegedly lied about all of this to the FBI and the Justice Department.

The second big takeaway is even starker: A member of President Donald Trump’s campaign team now admits that he was working with people he knew to be tied to the Russian government to “arrange a meeting between the campaign and the Russian government officials” and to obtain “dirt” on Hillary Clinton in the form of thousands of hacked emails — and that he lied about these activities to the FBI. He briefed President Trump on at least some them. link​

The second would be Mr. Pop and Cop a Plea, I think.
 
The Incredible Huck has proven that Sean Spicer isn't even the worst Press Secretary in this administration. It bottles the mind.
 
Not to be a Debbie downer, but Trumps base will never abandon him. And they vote. That means that in much of the country it is still politically advantageous to be allied with him. Until this changes, he will never be impeached. I’m not convinced anything less than audio and/or video of Trump actively conspiring with Putin would suffice. That means Trump himself would have to be directly charged with a crime. I’m not convinced that will happen either because there’s already more than enough evidence that he obstructed justice with the firing of Comey. Mueller can build a case around Trump all he wants...a strong case that would be enough to make any previous President resign. But 45 has no shame, and neither does his base.

Dems would have to make historic gains in the house and senate next year to force him out. Right now there no reason to believe that will happen.
 
You're not wrong.
This situation is deeply, deeply fucked - but it's nice to at least see these things coming to light.

For months we've had trump loyalists scoffing at the idea that trump stole the election.
Where are they now?
 
mal3volent said:
Not to be a Debbie downer, but Trumps base will never abandon him. And they vote. That means that in much of the country it is still politically advantageous to be allied with him. Until this changes, he will never be impeached. I’m not convinced anything less than audio and/or video of Trump actively conspiring with Putin would suffice. That means Trump himself would have to be directly charged with a crime. I’m not convinced that will happen either because there’s already more than enough evidence that he obstructed justice with the firing of Comey. Mueller can build a case around Trump all he wants...a strong case that would be enough to make any previous President resign. But 45 has no shame, and neither does his base.

Dems would have to make historic gains in the house and senate next year to force him out. Right now there no reason to believe that will happen.
Click to expand...

Ugh, you're probably right, and it fucking SUCKS.

The thing is, the kinda people who tend to support trump, also tend to be the kinda people who otherwise consider themselves to be patriotic Americans.

More and more I feel like being a patriotic trump supporter is a contradiction in terms.
 
i agree that there is a core of trump's base for whom nothing will change their opinion.

but i also think a lot of voters gave trump a chance because he promised change and to "drain the swamp" and those people can't fail to see how he's thrown those campaign promises in their faces.

his current approval is lower than it has ever been and his dismal record on getting any major legislation passed along with his childish daily tantrums will, i believe, affect voting in future.

alasdair
 
Indeed. This is the problem. The president is NOT supposed to be a lawmaker. That isn't their role and that's not how the system was designed. But that's kinda what it's turned into. But it only works like that through the president making deals and getting people to agree. And that's not one of trumps strengths. He expects to be able to just order people to do what he wants, and when he can't do that, it all falls apart and he's totally inept.

I wonder how much of this is also because of his limited political background. Previous presidents had much political experience. They knew both how the presidency is expected to work by the public, and how it works in reality today, while also knowing how the system was designed and how to get what they wanted as president within the realities of the system.

Maybe trumps inexperience means he only has the public idea of the presidency, he's trying to be a president how the public imagines it works rather than how it actually works. Because if it did work that way, it would play to how he operates. As a dictator giving orders, as a boss of a company.

But the reality isn't like that. The presidents power is technically limited. To access that part of the power and be a modern day president you gotta know how to work around the limited power to get what you want. And to do that you need to work well with others, and trump doesn't. He's terrible at it.

The result being he is totally inept in any area beyond the legal powers of the presidency. And making laws is outside those legal powers. Every president does it but most know you can't do it through your presidential powers. You do it through political savvy. And trumps strengths aren't in playing politics. It's easy to forget that given how well he did getting into the presidency. But that wasn't because he's a political genius. He's not, he's a novice, and this is where it shows.
 
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There are plenty of possibilities still.

I'm hoping that felony charges and direct links to Russia mean a lot of rats start fleeing this garbage barge, and Trump doesn't even know where the wheelhouse is to steer it.

Being paranoid and vindictive, and not at all bright or capable, he's got plenty of time to go nuts and maybe shave a few points off his approval with the base. Before midterms, and Congress might act. Or not and lose a few seats, enough to allow a vote.

Or invoke my favorite number 25.
 
alasdairm said:
no comments on the mueller developments today.

manafort and gates plead not guilty to several counts including conspiracy against the united states". but, perhaps more ominously for the administration, papadopoulos pleaded guilty to lying to the f.b.i.

sarah sanders clearly trying to distance the administration from today's news about all three of these guys.

i think this is only just the beginning...

alasdair
Click to expand...

*cough*

Some of us need to sleep after breaking epic news and insomnia and stuff.

Like Paul Revere on his trusty steed, scarcely able to cast a backward glance at the seemingly equine wisps of apocalyptic doom in fleet pursuit of the determined rider...

Okay, I have slept, yes, and caught up on a lot of legal, political, and historical articles and analysis and juicy story insider tidbits.

Now, I am going to Unleash the Kraken.
 
cduggles said:
*cough*

Some of us need to sleep after breaking epic news and insomnia and stuff.

Like Paul Revere on his trusty steed, scarcely able to cast a backward glance at the seemingly equine wisps of apocalyptic doom in fleet pursuit of the determined rider...

Okay, I have slept, yes, and caught up on a lot of legal, political, and historical articles and analysis and juicy story insider tidbits.

Now, I am going to Unleash the Kraken.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it was about 1am where i am when i first read about manafort being charged, and i should have already been in bed.
Suffice to say, i didn't get a lot of sleep last night, because it was hard to stop reading, with all this stuff breaking.
 
Except for the guy who just took a deal and admitted they met with the Russians to get dirt on Hillary.

You know, signed under oath, big time court.

The Trump campaign worked with the Russians. Public record.
 
You know, say you're right, and I'm not actually saying one way or the other cause I don't know. But say it's true, that the trump campaign conspired with foreign powers. Who wants to bet there's lots of other campaigns who've done similar deals before now but didn't get caught? Makes you wonder just how many politicians and campaigns have already gotten away with it. Maybe all that's unusual here is getting caught.

What's the difference between a politician and a criminal? Getting caught.

Bunch of traitors. Far as I'm concerned conspiring with foreign governments to help win an election is essentially treason. I don't think it fits the constitutional definition but it fits my definition.
 
^^ Fresco Quit posting drunk. Or post a bear video.
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Soooo much to post, but considering hard-core MAGA folks for a sec:

• they actually think a border wall will be built. It won't.

• they will have to connect two dots, but they might lose health insurance coverage (in their area, so their white friends as well) or face higher premiums. They will have to connect this directly to Trump, but they will notice they don't have heath insurance or that premiums are higher.

• if the government shuts down for border wall funding or some other brilliant Trump demand. Some of the Trump folks probably depend on the government for something and might be inconvenienced by its absence.

• Trump starts a large-scale war and his enlisted constituents are sent somewhere. From POWs, his draft-dodging, transgenders, grieving Gold Star families, to remembering which country he just bombed, Trump is incapable of showing real respect for veterans and those who serve. Let's just say disaster, quagmire, and horrible things will ensue.

• He's losing support just being himself, albeit slowly. He isn't gaining in any demographic.
 
That's really cynical jess; i honestly don't think anything like this has been attempted before.

The whole thing makes Watergate look fairly innocent and amateurish. This is some serious shit.
I wouldn't downplay it by saying it's just politics as normal; that's kinda absolving trump and the shady people that helped make it happen.
 
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