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5htp and mdma

2

2lol2

Greenlighter
Joined
Jan 25, 2006
Messages
22
Hey all!

I got a question:
Is it okay to take m after a course of 5htp supplementing, and whats the normal dosage?
Lets say if you take 5htp for about a month, approximately 300mg daily, is it a good idea to stop supplementing for some time
before taking m?

Thanks for any input on this.
 
not sure why you would want to stop taking the 5htp, or why you're taking it. Are you rolling more than 1 every couple of months? If you are just rolling once every few months, the 5htp is probably a waste of money. You might want to try getting more sunlight and doing cardio exercise instead, since it's cheaper, and then after you roll take 5htp and/or piracetam to get unfunked.
 
Above post is right, you're probably wasting your money if you're using 5-htp constantly.

I personally prefer tryptophan.

As far as I know, the only way you can go wrong using 5-htp is to use it right before you take MDMA.
 
^ Ya, 5HTP turns into serotonin in your liver, which goes into your blood, and is bad for your heart valves. Where you need it is your brain, and supplement L-tryptophan is just an amino acid (natural protein building block) that is metabolized into 5HTP by your liver, then sends it to your brain where your eyes take in light and use it to make serotonin, 100% naturally. 5HTP works, but is somewhat unnatural and probably not good for the heart valves.
 
Interesting point about the metabolization of 5HTP in the liver. It would be silly to assume that all the 5HTP will neatly and orderly make its way to the brain. It's going to use the blood stream to get there and probably make a pitstop in the heart to drop some kids off at the pool.
 
^ exactly. The serotonin doesn't hit the brain/blood barrier the same way it's naturally synthesized from tryptophan. Tryptophan is in almost every source of protein to some degree, with milk being of course the highest %. Skim milk is an excellent natural source btw. Just drink a little skim milk for protein daily, you be good :D Maybe throw in some chocolate for flavor !

oh. ahem. Ya the 5HTP pre-load thing - You don't want to take it the day you roll. So from when you wake up that day, don't take any. I think you are supposed to only take 5HTP for 5 days prior though as it's somewhat of a drug that becomes dependent. Tryptophan is nothing more than a protein abundant in milk though, although it has good supplements with B vitamins if your diet is low in B6 and B3(niacin)

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From what I understand, 5HTP has a 90 minute half life, so it would be out of your system in less than a day, even at 300mg.
 
i used l-tryptophan (1 x 500mg) a few times AFTER or while coming down from mdma. i have learned that the best moment to take it is the moment when i was almost totally down and the mood was turning slightly bad, but still too awake to fall asleep. taking l-tryptophan helped me fall asleep very smooth in about 30-45 minutes. waking up the next day after a nice and long sleep, i had no hangover or bad mood at all. this must not be the result of l-tryptophan alone, but compared to other times, when i didn't take it before sleeping, it has a remarkable positive effect, besides helping me fall asleep.

some people were telling me that taking l-tryptophan BEFORE or WHILE using mdma would dramatically intensify the high.. but i seriously would not do that to my serotonin levels or even recommend it to anyone.. can't be too healthy to manually "refill" the levels anyway - although i read some papers a while ago which said that taking l-tryptophan after coming down from mdma before going to sleep would lower the risk of clinic depression (as a result of long-term mdma use), which totally makes sense to me and matches my experience.

ps: this is my first post in this forum, hi everyone!
 
I've heard it's okay to take 5-HTP the day before, or a couple days before, but I stick to my rule for "three days before" is the last time you should take it. I only take it after MDMA for the next three days, once every morning. Sometimes I need it, sometimes I don't.
You shouldn't be taking 5-HTP regularly either, like not daily. It has been mentioned already that it's not all good for you, there are some bad things about it. Taking it like three days a month maximum (presuming you roll once a month or less) should be fine though.
 
The last study I read said you couldn't reach levels of 5-htp high enough to have any "protective" effect by taking it orally. You'd need to inject it directly into your brain to get anywhere near the levels they claim "protected" the mice.
 
Ismene said:
The last study I read said you couldn't reach levels of 5-htp high enough to have any "protective" effect by taking it orally. You'd need to inject it directly into your brain to get anywhere near the levels they claim "protected" the mice.
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exactly, which is why I recommend l-tryptophan vs 5HTP. The best thing you can do really is intake a good amount of milk (skim or 1% is best due to the high fat content, but the proteins in milk contain trytophan, and that can be converted to serotonin. 5HTP is just not naturally eaten, the body isn't made for making serotonin in the liver, where tryptophan is in several foods and normally broken down into 5HTP.

if you don't like milk much, a supplement helps, but it should be taken without any other protein-containing foods as it will bind to other proteins
 
severely etarded said:
exactly, which is why I recommend l-tryptophan vs 5HTP. The best thing you can do really is intake a good amount of milk (skim or 1% is best due to the high fat content, but the proteins in milk contain trytophan, and that can be converted to serotonin. 5HTP is just not naturally eaten, the body isn't made for making serotonin in the liver, where tryptophan is in several foods and normally broken down into 5HTP.

if you don't like milk much, a supplement helps, but it should be taken without any other protein-containing foods as it will bind to other proteins
Click to expand...

I didn't know this, I'm just about out of 5-HTP and was going to get another bottle soon. I will look into this tryptophan ... and perhaps actually start drinking milk :p Thank you!
 
llama112 said:
I didn't know this, I'm just about out of 5-HTP and was going to get another bottle soon. I will look into this tryptophan ... and perhaps actually start drinking milk :p Thank you!
Click to expand...
I think you get the most nutrition out of a very low fat milk, and a good nutritious cereal thats high in vitamins and fiber. The complex carbohydrates from grains and oats etc. will aid in the conversion of tryptophan:)

you can also get tryptophan from just about any protein, but milk is definately the most concentrated source.

lol I'm eating cereal as I write this :D
T
 
I would have thought that if you stop taking it for a few days before the roll, you'd be OK. you don't wanna be taking it on the same day that's for sure.
 
erbaviva_girls said:
I read recently that 5-HTP is more effective
L-tryptophan, and has no side effects, only a little
initial nausea
Click to expand...
5htp metabolizes straight into serotonin, mostly in your gut though. Not an effective way to boost levels in your brain though. Serotonin is not good for the heart valves. It works best in the brain's neurotransmitters.

l-tryptophan is just an amino acid (protein) that is naturally more concentrated in milk than most other sources. It metabolizes into 5HTP in the liver, where it is sent into the blood stream, where makes it to the brain for further synthesis into serotonin in visually bright environments, and melatonin (sleep hormone) if the environment is visually dark.

5HTP is just partially metabolized tryptophan really.

I'd rather just eat the tryptophan, as I don't think 5HTP is really meant to breakdown in the liver.
 
also, l-tryptophan is available as 500mg pills. at least here in europe, u don't need a prescription to get it. easier way to make sure your body gets the tryptophan than drinking a shitload of milk :)
 
It's worth noting that free serotonin can act as an irritant outside of the brain. Many plants and insects use serotonin in their stings and venoms to cause extreme irritation and pain. So trying to raise blood levels might not even be a good idea.
 
Tryptophan can take many days to be eliminated from the intestinal tract.
It is highly recommended to stop taking ANY serotonergic agent at least a week prior to MDMA usage...
But at least a 3 day gap is recommended, as this is normally sufficient for short-term 5-HTP or tryptophan use.

What you DON'T want is tryptophan sitting unabsorbed somewhere along your GI tract, while you are rolling.
The combined metabolism of both substances is a risk factor for Serotonin Syndrome.
Some anti-depressants have SUCH a high risk of interactions that patients can't even eat CHEESE.

Even after rolling, the metabolites of MDMA can stick around for up to a week.
For both myself and other users, onset of Serotonin Syndrome has occurred AFTER rolling - normally within 2-3 days.
This is more common than you think - and I theorize that the resumption of digestion is one of the causes of this delay.

I think Pre-loading is the bigger risk, and needs to be spaced by at least 3 days combined with a healthy diet.
Post-loading still carries some risk esp. in the first 2-3 days.
I recommend taking partial doses, by emptying out the pills of most of their content.
Several SMALL doses are safer than taking two whole pills!
 
First Bad Comedown said:
Tryptophan can take many days to be eliminated from the intestinal tract.
It is highly recommended to stop taking ANY serotonergic agent at least a week prior to MDMA usage...
But at least a 3 day gap is recommended, as this is normally sufficient for short-term 5-HTP or tryptophan use.

What you DON'T want is tryptophan sitting unabsorbed somewhere along your GI tract, while you are rolling.
The combined metabolism of both substances is a risk factor for Serotonin Syndrome.
Some anti-depressants have SUCH a high risk of interactions that patients can't even eat CHEESE.

Even after rolling, the metabolites of MDMA can stick around for up to a week.
For both myself and other users, onset of Serotonin Syndrome has occurred AFTER rolling - normally within 2-3 days.
This is more common than you think - and I theorize that the resumption of digestion is one of the causes of this delay.

I think Pre-loading is the bigger risk, and needs to be spaced by at least 3 days combined with a healthy diet.
Post-loading still carries some risk esp. in the first 2-3 days.
I recommend taking partial doses, by emptying out the pills of most of their content.
Several SMALL doses are safer than taking two whole pills!
Click to expand...
So according to this, it's highly dangerous to eat PROTEIN 3 days before rolling.

I don't buy it. If you could give a source/reference for:

Some anti-depressants have SUCH a high risk of interactions that patients can't even eat CHEESE.
Click to expand...
I might be open to the idea.

But no sources/references, how can anybody believe you? You make outlandish claims, and then say things like "trust me". Please use references. Link us to something.

5HTP is obviously going to make serotonin as it's a direct precursor to serotonin. But tryptophan is a natural amino acid found in all forms of protein.

dietary sources of tryptophan

See? I have a reference

According to that, you cannot eat any fish/eggs/meat/nuts/seeds of any kind, nor drink milk, or it is dangerous 8)

Tryptophan is used by the body for MANY OTHER USES aside from serotonin production. I think you are going too far. 72 hours without protein is a little extreme, don't you think?

5HTP shouldn't even be taken at all by people who don't roll very often, besides after coming down from a roll. There is no point for it. The only other use it has is for preloading which should only be done for 5 days obviously. The conversion of 5HTP to serotonin in the liver is an unnatural one, which leads to unnatural levels of serotonin. There are other uses aside from serotonin, and only a normal amount of serotonin gets absorbed by the SERT.

I'm sorry but you contradict yourself when you recommend a healthy diet and then to stay away from tryptophan-containing foods. I am going to stick with the scientific research that says protein is good for you, and eat my protein :|

Tryptophan is an essential amino acid that cannot be synthesized by the body. It MUST BE INGESTED OR YOU CANNOT SURVIVE!


I personally think the best solution is to abstain from supplements and eat a normal amount of protein. Not too much, not too little. Mix up the kinds. Supplements are unnatural...
 
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