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CYP2D6 Enzyme Deficiency - How dangerous?

Tyd

Tyd

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 14, 2011
Messages
111
Location
England, UK
CYP2D6 deficiency occurs in roughly 8% of people and I've read that it's believed to be the cause of MDMA related deaths and overdoses. Could people knowledgeable on the subject explain or point me in the direction of relevant studies?

There is someone very close to me that I would like to convince to try MDMA but I want to be absolutely certain it goes well or I would forever lose their trust and I would feel horrifically guilty. If this person is deficient in this enzyme, is there a safe way for me to find this out in a home environment? Studies I've read all involve complex testing in labs. For example, any allergies they have or foods that they can't eat that would indicate this?

If there is no way of testing, what would be a safe dose? 150mg too much? What would be the expected side effects if they were and what are some ways to combat it? In laymans terms would be best as I'm a scientist but not a chemist and all the jargon confuses me as I've never really studied it.

Maybe a small dose of MDMA to gauge any side-effects? But what kind of dose would this need to be to be able to tell. 50mg? 25mg?

Cheers if you can help!
 
Oh, also, does having this deficiency mean you don't get any pleasurable effects or just that the resulting toxicity is much higher?
 
Tyd said:
CYP2D6 deficiency occurs in roughly 8% of people and I've read that it's believed to be the cause of MDMA related deaths and overdoses.
Click to expand...

That was a theory at one time, but it has not proven to be the case. and I don't believe it will make you roll harder because there are multiple enzymes that metablolize mdma that will compensate.

http://www.erowid.org/references/refs_view.php?ID=6069
There appear to be other metabolic mechanisms which compensate for the poor metabolism of these drugs by CYP2D6

http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(05)75654-3/fulltext
Thus, inherited CYP2D6 deficiency seems to be unrelated to MDMA-induced hepatotoxicity.
 
I don't think you have any reason to worry.

MDMA treats everyone differently, but at the proper dosage, it treats everyone right :)

That's just what I'm going to say because I know nothing about CYP2D6 Enzyme Deficiency. But there's definitely nothing to be worried about, especially for an mdma related death?

Just take it slow and ease into it, best rule with anyone.
 
After doing a search, I only found one article on a study done in Ireland with this theory.

Common sense would tell you, that if 8% of the population were CYP2D6 deficient and therefore at high risk for death or complications when taking MDMA, the death toll would be much higher. In reality, actual deaths from MDMA, and MDMA alone (not dehydration, water intoxication, drug combos etc.) are quite rare.

If you are truly concerned for your friends safety, then you wont enjoy sharing this experience. Do you know that your friend is CYP2D6 deficient?
 
^

Erowid Effects on MDMA:
NEGATIVE(negative side effects increase with higher doses and frequent use)

........
small risk of death; approximately 2 per 100,000 users have extreme negative reactions resulting in death (rare)
Click to expand...
Source: http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/mdma/mdma_effects.shtml

0.00002% is nowhere near 8%. If 8% have this deficiency I think there would be many many more people dying...
 
avcpl said:
That was a theory at one time, but it has not proven to be the case. and I don't believe it will make you roll harder because there are multiple enzymes that metablolize mdma that will compensate.

http://www.erowid.org/references/refs_view.php?ID=6069
There appear to be other metabolic mechanisms which compensate for the poor metabolism of these drugs by CYP2D6

http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(05)75654-3/fulltext
Thus, inherited CYP2D6 deficiency seems to be unrelated to MDMA-induced hepatotoxicity.
Click to expand...

Cheers for the info! I found the erowid one a few hours after posting but the second article is really good, makes me feel a lot less worried. It seems clear that this particular deficiency isn't going to for certain create severe side effects. Bsiren has a good point that I didn't think of that if it was truly 8% of people that have this and it lead to death and other bad reactions thats a large portion of people. That's initially why I was worried but seems much less of an issue. Oh and no I have no idea whether they are CYP2D6 deficient, but now I'm not going to worry about it.

It's funny I never thought to check so much into ALL the side effects and dangers etc when I was going to take it, however when it's someone you love I'm more careful!

Thanks dudes of bluelight
 
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