MrGrunge
Bluelighter
It was the second episode. You should definitely track down the first one of the new season.
Best scene of the last episode:
"Go home, Walter"
I nearly shat myself.
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Film & TV Moderators: ghostfreak
Television Breaking Bad
- Thread starter Damien
- Start date
It was the second episode. You should definitely track down the first one of the new season.
Best scene of the last episode:
"Go home, Walter"
I nearly shat myself.
check it out, bro.
you'd be amazed at what shit people find entertaining.
first season was alright i guess. after that it became an absurd "how bad ass can walt get in the next season" schtique. i guess by season 6 he'll resort to pedophilia and by season 9 he'll become a nazi terrorist with chainsaws for testicles. all the while he'll still be an awkward fool with his family and bluelighers will still consider it on par with shakespeare, homer or orwell.
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PepperSocks
Bluelight Crew
^ Yeesh, cynical much? You're a bluelighter too you know. Don't like the show? Get out of the thread. 
I will say that the first few seasons had some humor mixed in (Emillio's liquid body scene as 2353... pointed out), the "I'm talking with Ted" scene had me laughing so hard. That stuff is gone, the show is now balls to the walls anxiety, depression, and death.
CoffeeDrinker, you definitely missed a huge hole in the plot: season 4 episode 1; Box Cutter. Look it up, last I checked there's a full episode stream on AMC's website.
My Analysis:
1) Jesse's losing it hard. Pete and Badger were so reluctant to dose, but Badger's concession to a "little bump" opened the can. By what Pete said at first you could tell he really didn't want to. After that Jesse more or less forces a constant party which inevitably has to end and he's left in shambles. He's at a point where being alone with his thoughts is extremely difficult and he wants to escape it badly. He's no longer on the same level as his friends; Badger and Pete are reluctant to hang out with him too much now. Jesse's life is now going to be a PTSD filled mess of drugs and violence; something even worse is on the way.
2) Hank is being a complete and utter ass-hole. Marie is being a pedagogue and treating him like a 5 year old (even though it sometimes fits his behaviour). Even though he's been dealt a shit hand he's not taking it like the man he used to be. All he does is lie in bed ordering and examining minerals (I'll get to my hypothesis on symbolism). He could get in a wheelchair and move around when he's not doing PT. The way he's treating Marie is bullshit and the way Marie treats him is bullshit too. She should just not try to give him all that fake childish motivational crap (Hi-five my ass) and be normal.
As to mineral symbolism; Walt's meth is 99.1% right? That's 0.9% unaccounted for. 100% meth has zero colour; the blue is coming from that 0.9% contaminant. I don't recall exactly what Hank called it but he used the word "blue" in the name of the mineral he was examining. My guess would be he's examining minerals (and their origins) that may be ending up in Walt's meth (perhaps via tainted precursor). This may give a trail. That's just my current hypothesis.
3)Walt/Mike/Gus: As was said I think Mike is on Walt's side and beating him up was a message of "not now". When Gus butchered Victor Mike lost respect for Gus; you saw it in his face right in that scene and how he pulled his gun in Gus/Victor's direction. Mike knows as well as Walter that they're dispensable to Gus and Mike doesn't trust or like his boss anymore. Remember that besides for Mike's grim job he is a family man and I think he and Walt have very common values. They're allies.
This new guy throws a wrench in the gears. Who knows what his skills are; maybe he's Gus' new bodyguard/henchman; what Mike used to be but with some Victor thrown in there. Perhaps he's more stealthy and a more effective killer than Mike.
Just wondering; does anyone know who called Walter cell phone when he was walking up to Gus' house? It sounds like either Gus or Mike but I can't tell which.
I will say that the first few seasons had some humor mixed in (Emillio's liquid body scene as 2353... pointed out), the "I'm talking with Ted" scene had me laughing so hard. That stuff is gone, the show is now balls to the walls anxiety, depression, and death.
CoffeeDrinker, you definitely missed a huge hole in the plot: season 4 episode 1; Box Cutter. Look it up, last I checked there's a full episode stream on AMC's website.
My Analysis:
1) Jesse's losing it hard. Pete and Badger were so reluctant to dose, but Badger's concession to a "little bump" opened the can. By what Pete said at first you could tell he really didn't want to. After that Jesse more or less forces a constant party which inevitably has to end and he's left in shambles. He's at a point where being alone with his thoughts is extremely difficult and he wants to escape it badly. He's no longer on the same level as his friends; Badger and Pete are reluctant to hang out with him too much now. Jesse's life is now going to be a PTSD filled mess of drugs and violence; something even worse is on the way.
2) Hank is being a complete and utter ass-hole. Marie is being a pedagogue and treating him like a 5 year old (even though it sometimes fits his behaviour). Even though he's been dealt a shit hand he's not taking it like the man he used to be. All he does is lie in bed ordering and examining minerals (I'll get to my hypothesis on symbolism). He could get in a wheelchair and move around when he's not doing PT. The way he's treating Marie is bullshit and the way Marie treats him is bullshit too. She should just not try to give him all that fake childish motivational crap (Hi-five my ass) and be normal.
As to mineral symbolism; Walt's meth is 99.1% right? That's 0.9% unaccounted for. 100% meth has zero colour; the blue is coming from that 0.9% contaminant. I don't recall exactly what Hank called it but he used the word "blue" in the name of the mineral he was examining. My guess would be he's examining minerals (and their origins) that may be ending up in Walt's meth (perhaps via tainted precursor). This may give a trail. That's just my current hypothesis.
3)Walt/Mike/Gus: As was said I think Mike is on Walt's side and beating him up was a message of "not now". When Gus butchered Victor Mike lost respect for Gus; you saw it in his face right in that scene and how he pulled his gun in Gus/Victor's direction. Mike knows as well as Walter that they're dispensable to Gus and Mike doesn't trust or like his boss anymore. Remember that besides for Mike's grim job he is a family man and I think he and Walt have very common values. They're allies.
This new guy throws a wrench in the gears. Who knows what his skills are; maybe he's Gus' new bodyguard/henchman; what Mike used to be but with some Victor thrown in there. Perhaps he's more stealthy and a more effective killer than Mike.
Just wondering; does anyone know who called Walter cell phone when he was walking up to Gus' house? It sounds like either Gus or Mike but I can't tell which.
MrGrunge
Bluelighter
The blue color comes from Walt's use of methylamine instead of pseudophedrine in his cooking process, and Hank already knew that after he saw the security tapes of Walt and Jesse's burglary of the chemical plant. I'm sure there's some symbolism to the minerals, but I doubt that it has anything to do with the Heisenberg case he was pursuing.
I had to rewatch the episode, but I'm pretty sure it was Gus who made the call.
I have to ask, if you don't find Breaking Bad entertaining, what TV shows would you classify as 'entertaining'? You can namedrop Homer and Orwell, but if you can't recognize the technical skill involved in the filming and writing of the show, then you really have no idea what you're talking about and have clearly missed the point of the show.
PepperSocks
Bluelight Crew
Actually in real chemistry that's not true, and it brought out a fault in my hypothesis. In Breaking Bad's version of chemistry going the P2P+Methylamine route makes blue meth, and pseudoephedrine made meth is clear. Such is not the case. P2P+methylamine 100% meth is clear too. 100% methamphetamine is 100% methamphetamine; how it got there and what materials were used does not matter if it's 100% pure because no precursors are left in the final product. 100% methamphetamine is clear; ipso factso.
One could say that when Walt changed synthesis routes it turned blue because of an impurity in his precursors or a synthetic byproduct made in his synthesis. What I'm saying is perhaps that 0.9% contaminant that's causing blue colour is from a mineral in the precursors (which LE can use to trace their source), if that is Hank's current project it would be a neat plotline.
As far as reality goes, when Walt changed routes; as long as he was making similar purity product as he was with pseudo it shouldn't change colour. As it is all one needs to make more pure product is perform more and more purification steps (added labour, but better product).
Carl Landrover
Bluelighter
Maybe those weren't the best examples, but there have been plenty of humorous parts in the previous seasons. The show was an intense drama then too, so it's not like it had taken something away from it. The show needs humor because it made the characters more likeable and more real (who is completely serious the entire time?). It's also necessary for comic relief because this show would be depressing to watch if it was completely serious and didn't add in some humor to break up the tension.
It'd be easier to judge if the tone of the show has changed once we get further into season 4. I missed parts of episode 2 so I'll have to catch it some time this week.
i made a list of shows a page or two back in response to someone calling this the greatest show ever.
re: "the point of the show", it's just a drama. i don't need superficial symbolism puzzles to compensate for lack of dramatic structure in order to "figure them out" and feel smart or something in order to be entertained. the entire scope of breaking bad is in the subject of the title. you know, kinda like that stupid prison escape show.
34-dihydroxyphen
Bluelighter
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- Feb 14, 2007
- Messages
- 2,362
I think that the whole "blue meth" concept was a miscalculation on the creators part. If you remember, the first season was cut a little short because of the WGA writers strike. I think Vince Gilligan went along with the whole P2P cook thing, where low purity methamphetamine sometimes had a purplish blue color to it, and inaccurately decided that it would be blue while 99+% pure. They had to roll with it, obviously, but I believe it was a miscalculation due to not having the proper team assembled while writing the final episode of season 1. They needed their chemists, who have done a pretty damn good job so far, and I'm willing to bet they didn't have them for that episode. Vince Gilligan probably thought it worked in there pretty well for his symbolism (Walt cooks for his family, especially Skyler, who's color is blue, therefore the meth is blue), but he didn't realize that so many viewers would be chem nuts.
MrGrunge
Bluelighter
See, this is why I feel you don't actually understand the show. It's not such that it lives and dies by its symbolism, since it is actually quite a clear-cut idea: What a regular person will do in extreme circumstances. That's it, really. Sure, there is a quite a lot of symbolic undertones, but understanding them is not required for full enjoyment of what is being presented. It is just a simple drama. But it's a drama with fantastic acting, top-notch cinematography, a clever story, and the humanizing of people that we mostly hear about on the news. The people portrayed are not just scumbag drug dealers or faceless law enforcement officers: they're actual people placed in trying circumstances. What makes it even better is that it is seemingly immune to the hackneyed and trite television cliches which infect almost every other show out there. If you can't relate to or sympathize with what's happening on-screen, I think that says more about you personally than the show itself. Granted, some of the symbolism can be a bit heavy-handed, especially in the Fly episode, but I really don't see what's wrong with a show that makes you think. It's much better than your average CSI/Law and Order/etc where everything is wrapped up in a nice and neat package so that the viewers won't have to use an ounce of brain power to make it through an episode.
EDIT: I saw the other shows you felt were better than Breaking Bad, and while I can't fault any one in particular, I think that Breaking Bad has maintained a level of excellence throughout its lifespan much better than Oz, Mad Men, and to a lesser degree The Wire. Especially Oz, though, where towards the end it became more about the episode-to-episode conflict than any sort of overarching story (not to mention the breakdown of acting quality).
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reacting to adversity is a central tenant to all drama. this is not unique to bb. our views differ in two findamental points. i don't see the characatures in bb as humanised at all. i have no problem with drug culture on film, the wire does it so much more substantially. i've previously mentioned explicitly on how poorly bb portrays women. secondly, as a result i don't think the writing is clever at all. it was tedious and boring to me, which is why i stopped watching. i commend the actors, but i just can't suffer the material.
i respectfully disagree with your point on quality and the comparison to other shows. yes, oz got silly by the sixth season. bb got silly in the second and completely jumped the shark in the third (where the entire drama was as a result of walt's inexplicable insistence on getting jessie back as an assistant). haven't seen the last season of mad men yet, but i've sensed no decline in quality. the wire was perfect from start to finish.
i respectfully disagree with your point on quality and the comparison to other shows. yes, oz got silly by the sixth season. bb got silly in the second and completely jumped the shark in the third (where the entire drama was as a result of walt's inexplicable insistence on getting jessie back as an assistant). haven't seen the last season of mad men yet, but i've sensed no decline in quality. the wire was perfect from start to finish.
34-dihydroxyphen
Bluelighter
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MrGrunge
Bluelighter
Inexplicable? After Jesse's confrontation with Hank, Walt needed Jesse's silence so that he wouldn't talk to the police (as he had threatened to do) about 'Heisenberg', so he convinced Jesse to become his assistant (or partner, rather) in order to avoid that. So unless there's something else you're referring to, I don't see what's so 'inexplicable' about it.
Also I don't think women are necessarily portrayed that badly at all. Skylar is a smart, strong, independent woman in addition to being a housewife. Sure, she cheated on Walt and managed to be kind of a bitch at times, but I don't see how her character is portrayed any worse than any other character...she's flawed, just like everyone else. Marie is pretty bad, I'll give you that, but aside from her who else is there, really? Jesse's girlfriend was kind of a manipulative bitch, but her character is an emotionally broken, recovering drug addict, so I'm not sure what else you would expect.
Yeah, the Wire does portray drug culture much more in-depth, but this really isn't so much about the culture the characters exist in as it is about the characters themselves. The Wire, while a truly remarkable achievement in television, suffers from some characters being a bit too two-dimensional due to the huge size of the cast. Breaking Bad is much more focused on creating fully-fleshed and believable characters rather than inner-city Cop/Drug Dealer archetypes. If you've never seen an episode of The Wire, after watching one, you could describe each character fairly easily. In Breaking Bad, the characters are developed and explored in a much more personal and dynamic manner, which is something that most shows on TV completely neglect (save for Mad Men), and as a result I find myself able to relate to them more fully than I would, say, McNulty or Bunk or Freamon.
Also I don't think women are necessarily portrayed that badly at all. Skylar is a smart, strong, independent woman in addition to being a housewife. Sure, she cheated on Walt and managed to be kind of a bitch at times, but I don't see how her character is portrayed any worse than any other character...she's flawed, just like everyone else. Marie is pretty bad, I'll give you that, but aside from her who else is there, really? Jesse's girlfriend was kind of a manipulative bitch, but her character is an emotionally broken, recovering drug addict, so I'm not sure what else you would expect.
Yeah, the Wire does portray drug culture much more in-depth, but this really isn't so much about the culture the characters exist in as it is about the characters themselves. The Wire, while a truly remarkable achievement in television, suffers from some characters being a bit too two-dimensional due to the huge size of the cast. Breaking Bad is much more focused on creating fully-fleshed and believable characters rather than inner-city Cop/Drug Dealer archetypes. If you've never seen an episode of The Wire, after watching one, you could describe each character fairly easily. In Breaking Bad, the characters are developed and explored in a much more personal and dynamic manner, which is something that most shows on TV completely neglect (save for Mad Men), and as a result I find myself able to relate to them more fully than I would, say, McNulty or Bunk or Freamon.
MrGrunge
Bluelighter
Case-in-point: Walt's birthday handjob in the first episode. Hi-larious.
MrGrunge, i don't see anything fleshed out, complex or realistic about the bb characters. there's a difference between having flawed characters and having obnoxious idiots filling the screen.
As for that inexplicable note, jessie was no real threat. Walt caused more trouble by making that decision than had he not. So, imo, he made a ridiculous decision for no serious reason (other than to provoke the subsequent drama). That's just cheap writing, I really didn't care what happens since it was all balanced on that stupidity. Same goes for the money fire/pool sequence at the start of the second season.
i have no desire to watch any more. my first post was making fun with max. since then i've been replying to MG.
As for that inexplicable note, jessie was no real threat. Walt caused more trouble by making that decision than had he not. So, imo, he made a ridiculous decision for no serious reason (other than to provoke the subsequent drama). That's just cheap writing, I really didn't care what happens since it was all balanced on that stupidity. Same goes for the money fire/pool sequence at the start of the second season.
i have no desire to watch any more. my first post was making fun with max. since then i've been replying to MG.
CoffeeDrinker
Bluelighter
Whoever it was that told me about the AMC website having the full episodes THANK YOU SO MUCH!! I just got done watching the first episode of season 4 and it was perfect. Much better than what I thought the first episode of the season was. Well the two episodes are different, but for a season opener this one is so much better.
I thought the mopping up of the blood turning into the random dude swirling his french fry in ketchup was pretty funny. That, and the clothes Walt had to change into, were the two funniest parts.
Also I thought it was mindblowing how Gail could get EVERY single line of those ridiculously complex and speedy Spanish songs. Those brief scenes alone must've taken tons of training on the part of that actor, completely unnecessary and yet the show is so much better because of details like that.
L2R doesn't really have a leg to stand on. I think he was just hungry and cranky the time he made his first lame post criticizing the show, and then felt the need to subsequently defend his posts just out of boredom and a sense of superiority. Talk about cheap writing....
"you'd be amazed at the shit people find entertaining."
Really...? Give me a break.
So the use of symbolism is superficial? umm I think you have a different definition of superficial than most people agreed upon...
How is adding an extra layer of interest to a show superficial? That's just a bad word choice man.
idk there's just so much wrong with your point of view on the matter it's not even worth getting into, the main thing is the fact that you even feel the need to be putting down one of the best shows currently running on a normal cable channel, I think purely because lots of people on this site like it, so you need to be contrary. Watch what you wanna watch, and enjoy yourself. You're being ridiculous dude..
I thought the mopping up of the blood turning into the random dude swirling his french fry in ketchup was pretty funny. That, and the clothes Walt had to change into, were the two funniest parts.
Also I thought it was mindblowing how Gail could get EVERY single line of those ridiculously complex and speedy Spanish songs. Those brief scenes alone must've taken tons of training on the part of that actor, completely unnecessary and yet the show is so much better because of details like that.
L2R doesn't really have a leg to stand on. I think he was just hungry and cranky the time he made his first lame post criticizing the show, and then felt the need to subsequently defend his posts just out of boredom and a sense of superiority. Talk about cheap writing....
"you'd be amazed at the shit people find entertaining."
Really...? Give me a break.
So the use of symbolism is superficial? umm I think you have a different definition of superficial than most people agreed upon...
How is adding an extra layer of interest to a show superficial? That's just a bad word choice man.
idk there's just so much wrong with your point of view on the matter it's not even worth getting into, the main thing is the fact that you even feel the need to be putting down one of the best shows currently running on a normal cable channel, I think purely because lots of people on this site like it, so you need to be contrary. Watch what you wanna watch, and enjoy yourself. You're being ridiculous dude..
AmorRoark
Bluelight Crew
L2R - I really do not understand why you continue to post in this thread since you hate it so much. That'd be like me constantly visiting a thread about Two and a Half Men. 
It's near trolling IMO.
This is a nice discussion guys. All I have to add is I agree and am 99% sure the phone call to Walt was from Gus.
It's near trolling IMO. This is a nice discussion guys. All I have to add is I agree and am 99% sure the phone call to Walt was from Gus.
34-dihydroxyphen
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Feb 14, 2007
- Messages
- 2,362
L2R - I really do not understand why you continue to post in this thread since you hate it so much. That'd be like me constantly visiting a thread about Two and a Half Men.
This is a nice discussion guys. All I have to add is I agree and am 99% sure the phone call to Walt was from Gus.
Yeah, I hardly respond to L2R anymore (in this thread), once I figured out he was just being a hater. I don't like Weeds, I still watch it but I don't like it, and you won't see me going to the thread on here or IMDB just to hate on it. It seems like a waste of time. If I don't like roses, I don't go to a thread or forum about roses and say I hate them and they way they smell, and tell everybody violets or tulips are so much better. Let the rose lovers appreciate their roses. I have no need to defend what I like and why I like it, nor to defend what I dislike and why I dislike it. I feel no need to defend why I like this show. I just do, and I don't give a fuck what anybody else thinks. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and if somebody comes into a place where people generally like something and bashes it, I usually try not to give them the time of day. This is probably the last I speak about the whole thing in this thread, unless I'm directly addressed. It's a waste of my time, even though I have plenty of it.
And I think it was either Gus or "the new guy." One of the two. I'm leaning towards new guy, I don't know if Gus every does his own phonecalls. I'm sure Walt is being tailed everywhere he goes. Dumb move by Walt, he knows he may be replaceable but he should have taken Jesse's advice at the diner and tried to win Gus over again. He has time to do so, and by plotting like this he is only making it more difficult on himself. The only guy who was a witness to the way things went down and would have lost respect for Gus for not taking action was Victor, and we all know what happened with him
Walt needs to chill, figure out the situation, and bide his time. Plotting against Gus is only going to make him more paranoid and more likely to kill him if the time ever comes.
Treatderek
Bluelighter
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- Feb 12, 2010
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- 59
I'm just thankful I'm not that cynical so I can actually enjoy things
34-dihydroxyphen
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Feb 14, 2007
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I'm just thankful I'm not that cynical so I can actually enjoy things
Healthy attitude. I'm the same way
This is our own private domicile and we will not be harassed... bitch!
Treatderek
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2010
- Messages
- 59
Healthy attitude. I'm the same way
This is our own private domicile and we will not be harassed... bitch!
Haha, I don't understand how someone could say it has lost it's sense of humour, I laughed numerous times in the last episode alone. Every time Jesse adds bitch to the end of a sentence it brings a smile to my face