[MEGA]Synthetic Cannabinoid Discussion- 2nd Toke

[d-Lysergic]

I got 2g of JWH-122 from a vendor a week ago. I tested it with a Dance Safe test kit, and got the following results:

Marquis: Slowly turned orange and yellow/green like the Marquis, but after about 20 seconds, the orange was REALLY red, and the green stayed the same.
Mecke: Turned a dark orange fast. About 20 seconds later the orange was ringed with a slightly olive/forest green. 45 seconds later the green was really faint/brownish, and the orange was almost blood red.
Simons: Clear / turned a tad foamy

Is this consistent with anyone else's research? I want to be sure what I have is 122 (I don't doubt it is, but I would like my tests to be as accurate as possible).

Here are the images in case my descriptions suck lol. Pictures taken about 10-15 seconds after drops added to the powder. Once I mixed the powder in with the drops the colors all got darker.

 

[allieFOUR20]

Smoking again after a health scare...

Hey fellow smokers. I have something to share that I'd like an opinion on...

Back in early February, I ended up going to the hospital 2 different times in the same weekend for chest pains and heart palpitations. After a bunch of tests done on my heart itself, it was determined that the problem was anxiety. Before this point, I had stopped taking an herbal supplement called 5-HTP (which helps regulate your mood and appetite). I was also drinking Red Bull at least 6 days a week to stay alert at my job. My physical problems started when I stopped taking the supplement and started weaning myself off the Red Bull.

Now, at that time I was smoking every day as I normally did but I was finding myself getting really, REALLY high just smoking one hit off a bowl. Sure, it made whatever I bought last a long time but I was kind of worried about how it was affecting me. I was almost to the point of having a borderline panic attack if I allowed myself to get too high (a feeling that I rarely get, and only when I smoke more than usual in one session).

Well, after my stint in the hospital I decided to stop smoking indefinitely. It was actually easy to decide on doing this and I didn't find myself craving it or missing my routine of smoking throughout the day. I haven't smoked since February 12th, well over a month by now. But I do kind of miss it...and I would like to smoke again.

I'm on Lopressor, Prozac & Xanax at the moment. I was wondering what you all thought about me smoking again. Do you think it would make me feel panicky again like it was before? Thankfully I know that I'd have something to help calm me down if that were to happen, but damnit I miss feeling blissfully zoned out. I'm slightly worried about smoking again but I don't want to be, I always said that weed was my cure-all. When it stopped being just that, it was highly disappointing to me.

What do you think? Thank you for reading...

 

[Jibult]

Does your doctor know that you have a weed habit? What does he say?

Personally, I have a friend with so many heart problems that it's ridiculous. Her doctor strongly advised that she stop smoking completely, cut out caffeine/nicotine/alcohol intake and to run it before him before she took over-the-counter medicine like sleep aids, cough medicine and antihistamines.


But that's her, and, like I said, she's got a ton of medical issues. You might be perfectly fine indulging in a bit of ganj' every now and then, but it really would be best to get the advice of your primary care physician before you decide to play a game of russian roulette with your heart.

 

[allieFOUR20]

I told the cardiologist in the hospital that I smoked every day. And of course, his advice was to stop smoking. I wouldn't expect him to say anything less. But thankfully throughout the course of the testing, as I said, the problem wasn't with my heart. It operates normally according to the battery of tests they put me through. I know that Lopressor suppresses your adrenaline, which helps with panic attacks. But other than that, I'm not sure what else to think. I've also cut out caffeine ever since this started happening as well. I used to never be able to have an energy drink and then smoke weed, it would make me really panicky. So hopefully now that I don't drink that stuff anymore, maybe I wouldn't get those bad effects from smoking?

 

[Jibult]

It's good that the main issue was anxiety and stress! I misread that, I thought the heart palpitations were still troubling you.


If anxiety is your main worry, then I don't see how a quick toke will hurt. Just take it slow, one hit at a time. If you start to feel anxious, cut the session short. Just be conscious of how your mind is being effected and I'm sure you'll be just fine. (Besides, Xanax is a surefire way to experience a stress-free, zero-anxiety weed high. Just don't go relying on your alprazolam to enjoy marijuana. It's a pretty addictive drug, Xanax, and I've got a whole lot of personal history with that too.)




Happy smoking.

 

[allieFOUR20]

Yeah, my doctor is quite worried about me getting addicted to Xanax, but thus far I've only been using it to help me sleep. Then again I've had sleeping problems for well over 10 years and ANYTHING that helps with that could never be a bad thing to me, haha. Thanks for your input, I appreciate it

 

[Chainer]

i agree, if you have no issue with smoke and your heart, you will be fine. There are safer and better ways to ingest cannabis though without the smoke and other hazards it poses such as orally preparing a batch of brownies or something, with a low dose and that xanax on hand just to keep your anxiety level low. Just use sparingly, or make weak doses if you are worried about the smoke or anxiety.

 

[deficiT]

I first hit a bowl when I was in 5th grade sadly. It was fucking great I loved it from then on. Didn't really smoke on the regular until I was in about 8th or 9th grade. I don't really remember having too many anxious experiences (possibly because I just can't remember) early on. When I was 16, I started tripping mushrooms and acid, and I was smoking daily at this point. Pot still gave me a fun buzz and I still enjoyed it.

But more recently (I'm 18 now), pot has been giving me weird hardcore anxious feelings. It's like all sit and just brood on some shitty stuff I'm thinking about. If I'm in a social situation, I'll almost not really give a fuck about what anyone's saying, and just be in my own world. And I had one experience a month ago where I was on acid, and mistakenly smoked plenty of pretty potent weed, and I just had the worst trip of my life.

It's gotten better at this point, I'm not a daily smoker anymore, but I still prefer it to alcohol. It's all been about just trying to control my thought's and not letting myself go to any dark places. I feel like the daily smoking factor since I was much younger has made weed not so great for me anymore. Plenty of pretty powerful trips (but no abuse I would say) I think has made weed fuck me up in weird ways. There's a little bit of stimulant abuse in my past, and I doubt that helps at all.

I think people forget that weed is a minor psychedelic. Sure you're not tripping balls or whatever, but when you smoke it's kind of like going on a little baby trip ya know? And as anyone who has done stronger psychs knows, shit is unpredictable. It's not like alcohol, dexedrine, benzos, or any other shit like where it's kinda the same every time.

 

[Tuneman]

well theres few things thatd set off my paranoia... last time I got blitzed we went out in the car to get food/drink... The place was closed along with all others because of a report for a suicide attack... shit

found open kabeb place in the city, waiting around, bunches of junkies come up and start asking for change... dizzy and clearly fucked up... a couple were kids, one was really old... in my head I couldn't help but think those kids were gonna end up like that old guy who just wouldn't leave us alone in his daze...
BOOM BOOM - what sounded like kalashinkovs firing 2 blocks away... more firing and im then in just a terrible state of mind...
Normally this would not effect me but while high it made it scary n surprising...

I thought the creepy guy outside dennys was bad but damn do I feel like a pussy now lol

 

[Haddaway]

Benzos to solve weed anxiety is a terrible terrible idea, because you can't take benzos anywhere near as often as one would want to smoke weed without ending up addicted to benzos.

I've heard _alot_ of people report similar effects after very heavy cannabinoid use, followed by a break. Happens more with JWH's just because it's easier to reach the level of use* that leads to this. Can also be triggered in some by a few OD's on JWH's**. Some people report that they've been able to get back into weed eventually, while others say it ruined weed for them forever. There are also people who reported being in this situation due to smoking real weed only, but were able to smoke JWH blends without anxiety, and people for whom (obviously) jwh's are far worse.

The level of complexity in the cannabinoid system is greater than that of most classes of drug, there are at least two receptors beyond CB1 and 2 that are hit by cannabinoids. Natural cannabinoids are partial agonists/antagonists at all the CB receptors (including the ones that aren't named as such), with varying affinities and efficacies***. Synthetics are also partial agonists, but with a higher efficacy (often much higher), and with a different binding profile than natural cannabinoids. And the cannabinoid system is involved in a whole bunch of other brain systems.

Also, jeez, did half the people responding not read the original post before reply?
There are like 4 posts telling him to lay off the smoking or take a break, when he clearly said that he had taken a 2.5 month break, and had a panic attack after one hit.

* 50-100mg doses are, surprisingly, not unheardof. I'm aware of at least 4 different forum members who were using at that level (which i reckon is a gram a day of JWH-018. Real quick and dirty calculations would equate that to an ounce a day of good (though not amazing) weed.
** 90% of JWH overdoses are from "hotspots" in blends, and probably another 5% is due to misguided attempts to take them orally.
*** this is likely why you can "smoke yourself sober" with some strains of weed at some levels of tolerance, and also likely contributes to why the first high of the day is the best - longer-lived partial agonists blocking the action of THC...

Extremely good post, except that a lot of synthetics ARE full agonists to the CB1 receptor, such as JWH-018, which is the one I mainly abused. This is why they are so much more dangerous than regular old MJ. It can cause extreme problems with density of your CB1 receptor.

Also, on a side-note, I am doing much better, and MJ is causing much less anxiety when first posted. I needed to meditate and learn how to relax again on MJ because it was giving me bad panic attacks..

 

[Peco..]

can't smoke weed anymore

There is at least one person at every party or in every group of friends, who refuses the blunt every time. Often times this person knows how good getting high is or.. used to be.. I'll tell you why I refuse the blunt..

I f'ing love getting high.. But for some reason, I no longer can. These days if I were to take 1 decent hit, I would be jabbed in the gut with anxiety, malaise, depression, dysphoria, ennui.. a whole world of shitty feelings. Pretty much it makes me want to kill myself..

Until I was 18 I could get high and euphoric as a motherf'er. I smoked weed for 4 years but then when I was 18, (22 now) I was prescribed mood-altering pharmaceuticals. I was tried on many anti-depressants, tried on Lithium (mood-stabilizer) and other mood altering things like that. Also, later that year I started using heroin and percocet. From then until now, weed has gradually become less effective at getting me high, and more effective at doing the opposite.

I've been thinking for the past 4 years that it could be a permanent affect of my 6 months heroin use. Another possibility would be the 4 or 5 years of prescription anti-depressants, mood-stabilizers and mind altering pills. I'm on subutex right now, but that isn't the cause either.

What I would like to accomplish here is hearing from people with this same problem (I know a few myself) and any kind of insight from anyone as to what the hell went wrong. My life is miserable and depressing. I cry on the inside every time I think about getting high and realizing that I can't.. and that I must resort to opiates.. There are many people who get anxiety and paranoia from weed but I am WAY more sensitive to all adverse affects. One time I ate 1 and 1/2 pot brownies. 2 Hours later I was found rocking back and forth in the woods crying and forcing myself to throw up because the pain of throwing up distracted me from the wretched black hole in my gut. It felt like my soul was being sucked out my asshole. I wanted to kill myself right there.

What the hell,

-tim

 

[Curiosity_]

glad so see someone else from Mass. that being said, does this really warrant a thread? Fascinating story, but probably better off as a blog post.

 

[Peco..]

Im sorry i've never blogged and I probably don't know what warrants a thread. What is the problem?

 

[Captain.Heroin]

It sounds like you are describing a few different symptoms from this, have you tried medicating one symptom at a time?

For stomach upset/nausea you could try taking a Tums, for instance.

I am sorry to hear about your negative effects from this and I hope it gets better.

 

[Pegasus]

I get this same thing if I smoke too much... I recommend taking a little break.

I remember reading a study in which a huge percentage of once daily smokers had to quit due to onset of extreme anxiety. It is common especially among daily users and seems to respond to taking breaks. Good luck!

 

[Peco..]

I get this same thing if I smoke too much... I recommend taking a little break.

I remember reading a study in which a huge percentage of once daily smokers had to quit due to onset of extreme anxiety. It is common especially among daily users and seems to respond to taking breaks. Good luck!

Thanks,
The question is, did these people in this study use other drugs? were they prescribed any medications? Why does this happen? I want to link it to something because 99 out of 100 people can and will get high every day for the rest of their lives.. What is different about me?

I didn't smoke too much, and I've been on a break from it for a couple years.. It's not curing itself, and it's become a serious concern of mine. (and many other poor ppl with this issue)

 

[MrGrunge]

It sounds more like a psychological issue rather than a physical one. Are you currently depressed or experience any anxiety disorders? Weed has a tendency to exacerbate those conditions in some people, it's not the be-all-end-all medication for psychological disorders that many seem to think it is. From personal experience, I can tell you the only way to start enjoying weed again is to treat the condition, whatever it is.

If you get panic attacks when you smoke, then don't smoke. If you insist on getting high, and the only other alternative for you is opiates, then might I suggest trying Kratom? I don't have any experience with it myself, but it seems like a relatively safe alternative for opiate lovers as opposed to being addicted to heroin.

 

[crankkt]

i am not a doctor but I would say that mixing weed with your medication is not a good idea and may be the cause to your problems. You mentioned lithium, which is a very strong psychotropic med. Studies have shown that weed can , in persons with a predisposition to schizophrenia and many other anxiety disorders, aid in earlier on set. I would suggest taking a break and trying again down the road.

CHeers

 

[crankkt]

i am not a doctor but I would say that mixing weed with your medication is not a good idea and may be the cause to your problems. You mentioned lithium, which is a very strong psychotropic med. Studies have shown that weed can , in persons with a predisposition to schizophrenia and many other anxiety disorders, aid in earlier on set. I would suggest taking a break and trying again down the road.

CHeers

 

[hobhead]

why worry about that sort of thing . there is no fucking rule to life that insists that this, that or the other substance MUST be taken.
the less of any intoxicants that i take - the better off i am.
that applies to all manner of shit that i am prescribed. pharmaceticals are really strong chems that have a plethora of side effects.

i only enjoy smoking now and again . it's a pleasure only when i am around friends. solo it's a bore.

i have had more than one heroin addiction run and now it's years later and there's no residual effect.

give yourself a break and if you have the means find a psyc doc that comes with recommendations from people you trust. when i read your post i saw depression speaking.

the pits of depression is not easily climbed out of and a bright doc once saved my bacon simply by reviewing my meds and asserting that i drop one of them . i did and it was like night and day for me from then on. an incompetent Pdoc had loaded me with meds some of which were clearly not intended to be taken together. again strong meds have so many side effects and need to be reviewed .