You're tripping. New source. How do you tell if it's legit or fake LSD?

[phew]

Best way is to have had numerous experiences with real LSD beforehand. Then you'd know right off the bat. But what if you don't have that experience and someone hands you damn good substitute?

Are there any 100% LSD characteristics? Either independently or in combination with a stimulus? For instance, what would LSD usually give you if you were in the dark watching stars on your wall? Would it distort them or would you see different things entirely (or does this change depending on dose)?

It would be great if we had a kind of psychedelic rorshach test with audio and video that produced distinctive results depending on what you were tripping on. Not the same results every single time, of course, but results that had a similar underlying feel. Maybe that idea isn't so helpful, but it would be cool to try out anyway. It would be a fun group experiment even if it got us nowhere. :D

We could probably try seeing if we achieve reproducible effects anytime you do another drug with LSD (nitrous, for instance, might always do this on LSD but it will do something else if it's not LSD).

Erowid gives a list of the effects, but it doesn't distinguish them. They don't go out of their way to note what to look out for.

Would the rest of you like to add some commentary? Maybe we can start by saying what LSD shouldn't ever be like? You shouldn't be able to sleep easily on LSD, that's for sure (look below). Or types of hallucinations that would be more commonplace with a bait-and-switch substance than with LSD (I don't have any good examples here).

Unfortunately, there is no simple list of effects for DOI and DOC like with LSD and DOB on erowid. But there's still enough information.

LSD is rapidly absorbed after an oral dose and initial symptoms usually appear within a few minutes; visual illusions and perceptual distortions occur within the second or third hour (3). First perception of drug action occurred as late as 2-4 hours after oral doses of DOB in 4 of 13 subjects (2). A pharmacokinetic study (4) showed that DOB (or a metabolite) began to concentrate in the brain only 3 hours after an oral dose. DOB is said (1) to have a longer duration, 12-24 hours, than LSD, 8-12 hours. Both of these characteristics of DOB match those of the drug ingested in Dr. Lake and associates' case --slow onset (3 hours) and a long recovery time (18-24 hours)- as well as or better than do those of LSD.

http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/dob/dob_journal1.shtml

More on differences between LSD and DOB:

As the effects of DOB first come on, the user feels a rush of energy which can be exhilerating or uncomfortable, depending on the person and the dose. A small majority of people report slightly less stomach discomfort than with 2C-B, although, as with all substances, each person reacts differently and there are also reports of higher discomfort than with 2C-B. Some people also report a greater ability to both eat and sleep with DOB than with LSD.

http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/dob/dob_effects.shtml

But here comes the worrying part, it looks like light doses of DOB could fool a few people because they are closer to an LSD experience than heavier doses:

As DOB settles in, it has a long plateau (3-10 hours, depending on person and dose). Higher doses extend the length in addition to increasing the effects. .Some people boost their DOB experience with a small supplement between T+3 and T+6 hours. The booster usually kicks in a bit faster than the original dose (45 minutes).

light doses of DOB last from 6-12 hours
medium doses of DOB last from 8-16 hours
heavy doses of DOB can last more than 24 hours
See DOB Dosages for information about dosage.

As with many other entheogens, its often best to avoid eating for at least 2 hours (4 is better) beforehand and don't eat until after the peak.

Light Effects: (plateau between 3 and 6 hours)
An increase in energy, feeling of mental clarity, opening of mental space, less confusing than low doses of LSD, very light visual activity, visual patterns superimposed on vision, enhanced texture perception, shift in colors. Some people find it possible to sleep on low doses of DOB, though probably not at the peak.

Body load usually manageable. Nervousness, edginess, some body discomfort, stomach tension, yawning.

Medium Effects: (plateau between 4 and 8 hours)
Increased duration, energizing, pronounced visual effects, marked clarity and reduction of emotions. Some people suggest this might be a good therapeutic tool in cases where excessive emotion might be a problem.

Fairly high body load. Muscle and jaw tension, tension headache, eye discomfort, achy back spasms, nausea, general body discomfort.

Strong Effects: (plateau between 6 and 12 hours)
Long duration, visual brightening, able to connect with ideas, heart-opening happiness.

Overdose: (3.5 + mg)
Reports of moderate overdoses appear to often be the result of individuals deciding an hour after their original dose that because they aren't feeling anything they didnt take enough. Be Careful! DOB can take up to 3 hours to onset for some individuals.

The overdose experience seems to be one of memory loss, irrational and sometimes violent behavior, and the possibility of causing harm to oneself (not noticing pain?).

DOI and DOC seem to be alternatives to DOB, but there's even less information on those. Hmmm. What are some other chemicals that could be put on blotters OR sold as LSD? DOx for sure, but what else?

Well, here is LSD's effect profile on erowid, for convenience:

POSITIVE
increase in energy (stimulation)
increase in associative & creative thinking
mood lift
increased awareness & appreciation of music
increased awareness of senses (eating, drinking, smell)
closed and open eye visuals
life-changing spiritual experiences
therapeutic psychological reflection
feeling of oceanic connectedness to the universe; blurring of boundaries between self and other

NEUTRAL
general change in consciousness
pupil dilation
difficulty focusing
increased salivation and mucus production (causes coughing in some people)
unusual body sensations (facial flushing, chills, goosebumps, body energy)
unusual thoughts and speech
change in perception of time
quickly changing emotions (happiness, fear, gidiness, anxiety, anger, joy, irritation)
slight increase in body temperature
slight increase in heart rate
increase in yawning (without being tired)

NEGATIVE
anxiety
tension, jaw tension
increased perspiration
difficulty regulating body temperature
nausea
dizziness, confusion
insomnia
megalomania
over-awareness & over-sensitization to music and noise
paranoia, fear, and panic
unwanted and overwhelming feelings
unwanted life-changing spiritual experiences
flashbacks

The major difference I can see is in the timing. When you come up and when you peak should be the most telling, as well as when and how long you plateau. What else?

 

[phew]

Wow, I just saw this unrelated thread on the first page. Interesting! I asked another forum if there was a way to test things beforehand and they told me "just eat it" but I didn't know we had these kinds of tests!

Differentiation of 2C-I from 2C-B/C is trivial. Differnentiation of 2C-B vs 2C-C is possible as well, though it demands at least a small amount of attention.

I did these tests and posted the results in PR Q&A some time ago. I have a few pages that i've been meaning to upload, and i'm going to repost the whole lot of them here once I finally do that.


2-3 mins:

Note 2C-E will give more of an "expected" reaction if you dump tons of it in.

30 mins later:

Trypts:

-
All 4-sub-T's react similarly, but other T's do not.

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?p=8729738#post8729738


Re-agent test for LSD:
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=33862

More of same:
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=82207

But erowid discourages me once again, so this thread is still of value:

Is there any method (other than ingestion) to tell whether a substance is LSD?

A: The only way to definitively identify LSD is to do laboratory GC/MS testing of the material. But one field test is based on the fact that LSD glows under UV light (blacklight). Obviously other things glow under blacklight as well, so just the fact that it glows doesn't mean it's LSD, but if it doesn't glow, LSD can generally be ruled out. The glow is apparent in crystal form, liquid form, or liquid dropped onto other material such as blotter or sugar cubes.

http://www.erowid.org/ask/ask.php?ID=3013

 

[shulsd33]

We could probably try seeing if we achieve reproducible effects anytime you do another drug with LSD (nitrous, for instance, might always do this on LSD but it will do something else if it's not LSD).

I find this to be very true, at least for me. Each drug, in combination with nitrous, has it's own unique effects. The one time I got acid that, with some whippets had a very different feel to it than acid does. In the same way shrooms, 4-aco-dmt, dmt, mescaline, ect all each have consistent unique characteristics when mixed with nitrous.

Whether these characteristics are the same across everyone, I don't know. However, most of my friends seem to agree about many of the sensations, so it's possible.

 

[wtblife]

Something I've been wondering... If you still see some stuff, but nothing animated or trippy after 20 hours, is it still acid? Cause I had these letters that filled everything in my vision for a good 20 hours, but after like 8 hours they were dulled down to the point of just looking flat and somewhat faded and they didn't change colors anymore or do anything besides being imprinted in my vision. During the peak they formed into stuff like flowers growing out of the carpet and bugs breaking out from the dirt near the flowers and they were changing colors and all sorts of stuff.

 

[phew]

Something I've been wondering... If you still see some stuff, but nothing animated or trippy after 20 hours, is it still acid? Cause I had these letters that filled everything in my vision the whole trip, but after like 8 hours they were dulled down to the point of just looking flat and somewhat faded and they didn't change colors anymore or do anything besides being imprinted in my vision.

I can't answer for acid, but this does happen with other hallucinogens. Days afterwards I will get faint CEVs. They aren't trippy as before, but I still see them and I know that they're because of the trip because I don't see any CEVs when completely sober.

But I'm interested in knowing if this is commonplace, it could be useful.

 

[pharmakos]

first, always brush and use mouthwash before consuming blotters to aid in oral absorption. always suck on your blotters.

LSD is tasteless and should produce noticeable full effects within an hour.

most other chemicals that get put onto blotters will taste bitter, and don't produce effects for well over an hour sometimes. DOx chemicals often take nearly 3 hours to produce effects. some people say "if it's bitter, it's a spitter," meaning spit it out.

another way to tell is duration of effects. with a low to average dose of LSD, your trip should be over within 8 hours. many other chemicals that get put onto blotters have durations far longer, some lasting more than a day.

as far as i know, other than these tips the only way to tell the difference between different psychedelics is to be very familiar with each substance. even then it can be very difficult to tell. i'm pretty sure there were studies done "back in the day" to see if people could tell the difference between psilocybin and LSD, and the only way that most could tell the difference was because psilocybin's duration of effect is so much shorter than LSD's.

 

[latentdelusion]

I had some blotter that didn't glow under a blacklight once, but the effects were the same as essentially 'known' acid trips. Strange. No way that the 50+ hits I've eaten have all been fake.

Edit: It was white unperf, for those that may be interested. And it was OKAY: > 50ug but < 100ug per hit.

Something I've been wondering... If you still see some stuff, but nothing animated or trippy after 20 hours, is it still acid? Cause I had these letters that filled everything in my vision for a good 20 hours, but after like 8 hours they were dulled down to the point of just looking flat and somewhat faded and they didn't change colors anymore or do anything besides being imprinted in my vision. During the peak they formed into stuff like flowers growing out of the carpet and bugs breaking out from the dirt near the flowers and they were changing colors and all sorts of stuff.

That happens to me on high(er) dose acid trips.

 

[Big)Sky]

For me personally when i induce in LSD first off is the taste. LSD is tasteless (unless in liquid form which i have gotten some that tastes like sweet's breath.)

Any DOx compound has a taste. DOC is the most bitter paper substance ive eaten. Tastes like copper. And you get more of a speedy high then the melty comfortable feeling of LSD.

Third. You get the unmistakeable "Rainbow Vision". When there's sparkely rainbows exploding off of everything you look at you know its propper. LSD gives you eye candy like no other Psychedelic ive taken. Its unmistakeable to the trained eye.

Also in my personal experience you can almost feel the fluctuations of your serotonin from receptor to receptor. Some people think there brain is bleeding when this sensation is happening but its simply the serotonin being bounced around your brain like a vortex.

ALD-52 is slightly different in the feeling. It does not have such a spike on the up come. Its a lot smoother of a trip. Slightly sedating in my experience. Its more of a visual party then the body high the LSD-25 crystal gives you. Personally i would eat ALD-52 all day compared to LSD-25. But that is too good to be true.

Basically speaking. LSD has its characteristics that others just dont meet the standard that LSD puts out there.

EAT YOUR FACE OFF!

 

[Fornax55]

anyone have any heads up on mad hatter acid? (i searched this thread and found nothing so i hope nobody already made a post)

its rumoured to be a derivative of LSD, slightly re-synthesized so that the trip is more controllable and generally more euphoric... whenever i've done it it definitely seems somehow better than normal acid.

 

[CJ96]

first, always brush and use mouthwash before consuming blotters to aid in oral absorption. always suck on your blotters.

LSD is tasteless and should produce noticeable full effects within an hour.

most other chemicals that get put onto blotters will taste bitter, and don't produce effects for well over an hour sometimes. DOx chemicals often take nearly 3 hours to produce effects. some people say "if it's bitter, it's a spitter," meaning spit it out.

another way to tell is duration of effects. with a low to average dose of LSD, your trip should be over within 8 hours. many other chemicals that get put onto blotters have durations far longer, some lasting more than a day.

Sorry, but so much of this is wrong. I've had many fine hits of LSD that tasted slightly bitter at first. There's a big difference from the slight bitter taste that I'll sometimes get from a hit of printed blotter and the very serious and lingering bitterness I'd get from even a very lightly laid DOC blotter though.

How long acid takes to hit depends a fair bit on how much is dosed. I've had a serious come up start up in as little as 20 minutes when taking very large doses (started to feel a mouthful of vial wash come on that quick this past year, very similar time line to a megadose I was given some twenty years ago, but not lingering nearly as long afterwords). Then again, on my very first trip I didn't realize I was tripping until about two hours after dropping. Typically full effects aren't noted until about two hours in, it's not at all unusual to start feeling the come up anywhere from 30-60 minutes in.

Duration of LSD is also dose dependent. I've often tripped 10-12 hours off 2-4 hits and most of those experiences were about a decade before DOx compounds and all these other highly potent RCs came on the general market. Taking much higher doses, e.g. 10+ strong hits without serious tolerance, can leave you tripping for 24 hrs. and experiencing lingering visual effects for many days or even weeks afterwords at times. In this day and age you'd be a fool to drop a ten strip of something you weren't already familiar with at low levels though.

There's no need for brushing and mouthwash either, just keep it on your tongue, under your tongue, between your lip and gums or cheek and gums and it will absorb just fine if it's LSD.

Also, LSD doesn't give you "rainbow vision." Different people will get different visual effects from LSD, some will consistently have some somewhat similar features in their hallucinations, some won't. I hardly get any OEV other than mild visual distortions (breathing,melting of patterns and forms), brightening of colors, and maybe a sparkle to things until I have a few doses and it's been that way since I started dropping acid in the 80s. Your experience will most likely vary and you may very well have "rainbow vision" every time you drop a hit, but that's not likely to be true for everyone or even most people.

It's rather simple to test gell tabs or liquid for a DOx or 2C-x compound, just take a few shavings or clippings of your gell tab or a drop of your liquid and mix with some marquis reagent. I did this with some gell tabs from Chicago this summer and found they were most certainly a DOx or 2C-x rather than LSD. However, marquis doesn't seem reliable at all for indicating DOx in blotter paper in my limited experience, at least with lightly laid DOC (1mg/hit).

 

[psilocybonaut]

One thing that ONLY happens with LSD for me is increased mucus production. That's how you could tell... Feels like I should take a sudafed.

From Erowid:

increased salivation and mucus production (causes coughing in some people)

 

[The Hebrew Hammer]

Third. You get the unmistakeable "Rainbow Vision". When there's sparkely rainbows exploding off of everything you look at you know its propper. LSD gives you eye candy like no other Psychedelic ive taken. Its unmistakeable to the trained eye.

.........
Basically speaking. LSD has its characteristics that others just dont meet the standard that LSD puts out there.

EAT YOUR FACE OFF!

Im sorry, but LSD visuals are NOTHING anywhere near the beauty of caapi+DMT visuals.

There are also lots of RCs that can provide some very impressive eyecandy that can to me sometimes be even more intricate and fascinating than LSD visuals.

I would have to say for me that If I am not drooling all over myself cramping my face up from laughing durring the comeup, then its not acid. NO other drug has ever been able to induce the consistent gigglefest upon the come up like acid does. Everytime I have gotten a DOx or some other funky blotter the main differences I noticed were 1) no gigglefest durring the comeup, 2) much longer time till feeling the effects. and 3) lack of a metalic feeling in my mouth that acid frequently causes.

 

[psilocybonaut]

lack of a metalic feeling in my mouth that acid frequently causes.

Could this possibly have to do with the increased mucus/saliva production? I don't think I've ever noticed a metal taste in my mouth.

 

[killo]

You guys must be kidding me!

What kinda LSD are you getting? The visuals are so intricate, beautiful and trippy. No other psychedelic compares.

DMT doesn't count, because it's nothing like a long LSD or mushroom trip. It's a very different character.

LSD's visuals are really special because the person experiencing them can use his mind to create what he wants to see. No other psychedelic can you really do this on, you are completely aware of how you create the reality and dramas you experience every second of your life.

Visuals are just a nice "other" thing LSD does, but it's far less important than how you feel/perceive reality as a whole.

Next time you take LSD, just remember this thought:

"Anything is possible, my boundaries have been removed".

Bring on the acid visuals = )

 

[The Hebrew Hammer]

DMT actually becomes remarkably acid like If you smoke a few bowls of caapi and then smoke about 30mg of dmt ever 10 or 15 minutes 3 hours after the 6th or 7th time smoking it becomes almost exactly like a typical acid trip, Its still very different of course.

I do agree that with acid you can definitely manipulate your visuals, I just find the visuals of DMT far more beautiful even if the longest I can sustain the high is 3 hours, its a good atrrtibute as far as im concerned. Because those 3 hours are much better than the peak of an acid trip as I could never even imagine the type of shit im show, it blows my mind everytime with its intricate jeweled magnificence.

I dont do that on a regular basis though. I usually just smoke once or twice every month or 2 weeks. I just wanted to experiment to see what would happen.

All in all, I ended up having to smoke MASSIVE amounts to get an "acid trip" like effect for like 10 minutes, After the 12th hit the effects got less and less rewarding, I smoked a total of 15 times in 3 hours and got bored due to tollerance, I think I smoked over a half gram at least (I was eyeballing it, no scales ) through out the night.

It was fun for a while, but I only went to hyperspace for like the first 5, the first 4 kept getting more and more intense and I was in some shit I can not vocalize at the moment. Ill just put it this way:

There was this thing like a playdough spaghetti maker thingy but it used just like some kind of self sustaining supply of "playdough" (which was aparently important information that they were trying to show me, like they expect me to be able to read that crazy form of communication? WTF!!! )

anyways the visuals were amazingm the playdough supply was infinite because it was like a never ending loop with a split off at the end.... and it was just so fucking beautiful as fuck.

Then after abot 7 or so smokings (about 10 to 15 minutes apart from eachother or whatever) it started to just get to where it was more enjoyable with my eyes open then with them closed, which is weird with DMT, usually its like " SIT YOUR ASS DOWN AND CLOSE YOUR EYES, ENJOY! "

No but seriously It becomes very much like an acid trip peak for like 10 minutes after you have been smoking it and caapi all night for 3 hours. Rather than being like DMT typically is, IE no entry to hyperspace even if I smoked a large amount.

I think it compares with Acid for sure in some situations.

SORRY FOR THE RANT

I guess I should have put that at the front.

If you have read all this, then, cool, even better is if you agree with me? responses anyone? Disagree anyone who has had similar experience or different involving same situation?

 

[pharmakos]

Sorry, but so much of this is wrong. I've had many fine hits of LSD that tasted slightly bitter at first. There's a big difference from the slight bitter taste that I'll sometimes get from a hit of printed blotter and the very serious and lingering bitterness I'd get from even a very lightly laid DOC blotter though.

Right, but I assumed everyone knows the difference between the slight bitter taste of bleached/printed paper and the bitter taste of a drug...

Then again, on my very first trip I didn't realize I was tripping until about two hours after dropping.

how are you sure that was acid?

Typically full effects aren't noted until about two hours in, it's not at all unusual to start feeling the come up anywhere from 30-60 minutes in.

Personally, if it's real LSD I've always been pretty much peaking shortly after an hour.

Duration of LSD is also dose dependent.

Well obviously... this guy is talking about testing new batches so I was just talking as if he was doing the right thing and taking a hit or two to start out. This is a valid response to many of the comments of mine you said are wrong...

most of those experiences were about a decade before DOx compounds and all these other highly potent RCs came on the general market.

there's been DOx chemicals (typically DOM or DOB I believe) sold on blotter for a very long time. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2,5-Dimethoxy-4-methylamphetamine is a good place to start. DOM was sold as Acid starting in the late 60's.

In this day and age you'd be a fool to drop a ten strip of something you weren't already familiar with at low levels though.

exactly.

There's no need for brushing and mouthwash either, just keep it on your tongue, under your tongue, between your lip and gums or cheek and gums and it will absorb just fine if it's LSD.

you don't NEED to, you're right. but it helps a lot. look it up.

It's rather simple to test gell tabs or liquid for a DOx or 2C-x compound, just take a few shavings or clippings of your gell tab or a drop of your liquid and mix with some marquis reagent. I did this with some gell tabs from Chicago this summer and found they were most certainly a DOx or 2C-x rather than LSD. However, marquis doesn't seem reliable at all for indicating DOx in blotter paper in my limited experience, at least with lightly laid DOC (1mg/hit).

Solid advice.

 

[wtblife]

LSD is tasteless and should produce noticeable full effects within an hour.

I chewed up my blotter and let it dissolve in my mouth for the most part and definitely started to hit me within an hour. I remember also thinking how weird it was cause it was just like eating paper, no difference in taste at all. Good to know it was pretty much for sure acid :D

Im sorry, but LSD visuals are NOTHING anywhere near the beauty of caapi+DMT visuals.

After my spaceship landed I actually had the exact same hallucinations that I had on acid, the same "acid letters" with flowers growing out of them although they were more dull like late in the acid trip. Another time after landing imagined everything being made out of psychedelic circuit boards which was much more interesting to me than the letters. I can't stand those letters, they were fun for the first 4 hours on acid, but then I just got absolutely sick of them.

 

[killo]

"LSD letters"?

Sounds like you took DOX.


I saw "cliche 70's" letters on DOX, but LSD is more deeper than something cliche.

Just my thoughts, for some reason I know exactly what you mean. If you took real LSD you would not have been bored, I'll tell you that right now.

Sounds like you're gettting bunk shit.

 

[atara]

Well, the obvious answer is to know what the mimics are like.

DO-halogens tend to take two to three hours to come on, and the experience can last up to twenty hours. LSD is well above baseline in an hour, and the trip is over in fourteen.

5-MeO-AMT causes serious gastric disturbances. You get awful diarrhea.

It should be noted that DOx can produce an awesome and insightful trip; they're not bad drugs, they're just not acid.

No other psychedelic compares.

Have you tried a lot of other psychedelics? I've heard mescaline, DET MMDA, 2C-T-2 and AMT are pretty visual.

 

[hashdout]

lack of a metallic feeling in my mouth that acid frequently causes.

This is what always tells me I have had cid it always feels like I have been chewing on a metal spoon with the metallic taste I get. Nothing else ever gives me that sensation.