abletons over rated
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Music Moderators: Shinji Ikari
The Official Beginners DJing Thread
- Thread starter review.master
- Start date
abletons over rated
DJ 303
Bluelighter
can we just ditch the digital/analogue rows over what makes a "real" DJ?
Real DJs use any resource that enables them to throw their tracks down for the audience.
This argument will never cease.
if the music is bumping and the DJ is fucking givin' it their all, then it don't matter about the medium. whatever works.
damn when "direct drive" turntables came out, all my DJ mates said it wasn't really DJing.
Of course, if you're as comfortable 3 deck mixing as you are virtual Djing, then all the more satisfaction is achieved (believe me!), and all the more resources you have at your fingertips to kick out the jams.
especially related to this "beginner" thread, is the fact that technology has advanced immensely since i started mixing 20 odd years back, and there are numerous ways to get your kicks through software and hardware alike.
Just have fun and make sure you fucking rock it.
your sounds and your crowd interaction are 90% of the game anyway.
I don't care about your methods as long as your efforts aren't half-arsed.
anyone who hates on you unnecessarily is probably just pissed that they still aint mastered the deck, and you're mixing sounds better.
so if you prefer ableton, the roland tb-303 (yes sir), belt-drive gemini's, vinyl control, or the magic "sync" button, then go for it, hone your sound, hand pick each and every tune, and give it your best shot.
let's make this a supportive thread for the noobs who need it.
everyone starts somewhere.
try your hand at everything.
If your lovin' it i'm lovin' it.
DJ
Real DJs use any resource that enables them to throw their tracks down for the audience.
This argument will never cease.
if the music is bumping and the DJ is fucking givin' it their all, then it don't matter about the medium. whatever works.
damn when "direct drive" turntables came out, all my DJ mates said it wasn't really DJing.
Of course, if you're as comfortable 3 deck mixing as you are virtual Djing, then all the more satisfaction is achieved (believe me!), and all the more resources you have at your fingertips to kick out the jams.
especially related to this "beginner" thread, is the fact that technology has advanced immensely since i started mixing 20 odd years back, and there are numerous ways to get your kicks through software and hardware alike.
Just have fun and make sure you fucking rock it.
your sounds and your crowd interaction are 90% of the game anyway.
I don't care about your methods as long as your efforts aren't half-arsed.
anyone who hates on you unnecessarily is probably just pissed that they still aint mastered the deck, and you're mixing sounds better.
so if you prefer ableton, the roland tb-303 (yes sir), belt-drive gemini's, vinyl control, or the magic "sync" button, then go for it, hone your sound, hand pick each and every tune, and give it your best shot.
let's make this a supportive thread for the noobs who need it.
everyone starts somewhere.
try your hand at everything.
If your lovin' it i'm lovin' it.
DJ
you have to get to know your sequencer . it doesn't really matter if you use logic, cubase, ableton or even fruity loops. another thing is to read up on sound sythesis. i started just by trying out what the buttons and knobs do while making some music, but it became much much clearer when i really started to read a lot about synthesis.
i suggest getting some softsynths. for goa and psytrance i recommend:
-audiorealism bassline 2 or phoscyon for tb-303 like sounds
-vanguard
-rob papen albino/predator/blue
-an sh-101 emulator for typical oldschool goa basslines
-a tr-909 emulator or 909 samples (i use audiorealism drum machine for hihats and other cymbals a lot)
that should get you started
of course you can create most sounds on pretty much any better synth, so these are just suggestions and synths i have found to work well. most of them should be comparatively easy to use.
also a good place to read about psy production would be the isratrance forums.
good luck and have fun making music!
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toa$t
Bluelighter
ya wel if u dont kno how to beatmach u rnt evena dj
StarOceanHouse
Bluelight Crew
I love that track. That was pretty cool. I remember some guy told me that back in the day he used to mix with cassette tapes.
DJ 303
Bluelighter
^if you don't know how to post constructively then you aren't even worth listening to.
keep your unhelpful comments to yourself would you?
If the strength of your mixing is proportional to the strength of your posting, then I seriously doubt if your opinion carries much weight.
Seriously Toa$t dude. I don't know how old you are, but if you carry that kind of attitude with you through your life then the only beats you will be matching are the one's that are landed on your chin.
I don't mean to sound hostile.
Just trying to help out a beginner.
Sorry Bluelighters.
I don't mean to be mean.
I wouldn't have a career in the music business if it wasn't for a few humble and helpful artists who have taken the time to offer their knowledge, encouragement and support in my early days of spinning/producing/organising.
Let's help those who are starting out eh?
hey SeeingBlue - can you PM me?
I'd be happy to send you some software/ synths/ examples and samples that will help you on your way.
it would be easier for me to knock up a basic tutorial if i could find out exactly what stage your at technically and musically.
FL studio9 is a great place to begin.
I can send you a basic example of a Goa-ish/psy-style tune in FL zip file format so you can fire it up on your pc. If you're interested.
i don't mind taking some time out to jot down a step-by-step explanation of what I'm doing either.
hit me up.
|>R()|)!G/-\|_
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2007
- Messages
- 1,134
-VST's-(Virtual Studio Technology)-A relatively universal interface for virtual/software synths and effects plug-ins. There are a heap of free ones that are decent to start with. My favorite right now is Superwave8. It's available along with many others here: http://www.kvraudio.com/get/708.html
-DXi-(DirectX Instrument)-Interface similar to VST and also freely available. These and VST's are normally pretty compatible with most host programs like Ableton, Cubase, Reason, FL, and even Cakewalk.
-MIDI-(Musical Instrument Digital Interface)-A universally accepted interface for instrument sounds defined by data, not audio. Normally used for sounds and sequencing. MIDI sounds can be controlled a variety of ways from keyboards, to pointing and clicking with a mouse, to playing a guitar or activating a drum trigger.
-Piano Roll-A view made of a grid with parts fo the measure along teh x-axis and notes by octave along the y-axis. Parts are composed by choosing a note value (whole, half, quarter, eighth, sixteenth, etc...) and placing it on the grid. I think it's probably the best way to compose until you get your keyboard hooked up through an audio interface.
-Audio Interface/Sound Card-Handles the computer's audio input/output. A new sound card is not required to make music but is a good first piece of gear to buy if even remotely serious. It bridges the gap between the computer and
instruments/mics/effects/hardware/speakers/mixers...anything outboard or hardware based.
-Firewire-A way to connect the audio interface to the computer/host. The advantage is faster data transfer than USB and increased portability for laptops/external audio interfaces over PCI/internal bus interfaces.
-PCI/PCMI/PCIE-Ways to connect the audio interface to a computer internally. Really good for stationary desktop/studio workstations b/c of fast data transfer but not recommended for laptops because of work involved in installation directly to mother board + many laptops are without expansion slots.
Sound Synthesis-Sounds are waves. Wavelengths are measured in frequency and dictate pitch to the human ear. High frequency = high pitch/low frequency = low pitch. Sound can be shaped and manipulated by modifying a wave and its elements.
-Sine-lush,warm sound; looks and sounds round to my ear
-Saw-buzzy, abrasive sound to my ear; at low levels causes rushes and pleasure during builds. At sudden, high-levels, when stripped of low-end, causes me physical pain.
-Square-A good middleground between sine and saw waves.
-LFO-(Low Frequency Oscillation)-Oscillates (creates strobing sound) specific low frequency range based on depth and rate(frequency) parameters
Attack, decay, sustain, release are all discussed here:http://homerecording.beaglesound.com/yep2.htm in greater clarity than I could muster.
-Envelope-Used to control automation/effects/volume/etc...across a track.
-Automation-Recorded changes to a track or track's parameters. An envelope is an example of automation.
-Gain-A signal's input level. It differs from volume b/c volume is the level of output. Sometimes people are confused because volume increases as gain increases but they are separate.
General Advice
There is a ton of advice and tutorials all over the web. I'm certainly no pro. Look up terms you don't understand. Get hands-on with some free software. After getting a free download of some type of music production software and playing with it a bit, check out some of Tom Cosm's tutorials here: http://www.cosm.co.nz/index.php/videos.html?catid=3&lang=en Although you could watch them first, it will help to have a feel for what he is doing with the software in each video. Although he uses Ableton, many of
the techniques can be recreated using less expensive/free software. The tutorials span all ability levels from novice to pro. He makes a variety of EDM also so the tips and teks suit all tastes. My best advice is to remember that
fancy/expensive hardware/software is not required to make music. It simply makes it more convenient. You can make tracks using a bucket and some sticks, your mouth, or a free version of FL w/ some free VST plug-ins run through your current soundcard and sequenced/composed using the
piano roll's keyboard as the MIDI controller.
-DXi-(DirectX Instrument)-Interface similar to VST and also freely available. These and VST's are normally pretty compatible with most host programs like Ableton, Cubase, Reason, FL, and even Cakewalk.
-MIDI-(Musical Instrument Digital Interface)-A universally accepted interface for instrument sounds defined by data, not audio. Normally used for sounds and sequencing. MIDI sounds can be controlled a variety of ways from keyboards, to pointing and clicking with a mouse, to playing a guitar or activating a drum trigger.
-Piano Roll-A view made of a grid with parts fo the measure along teh x-axis and notes by octave along the y-axis. Parts are composed by choosing a note value (whole, half, quarter, eighth, sixteenth, etc...) and placing it on the grid. I think it's probably the best way to compose until you get your keyboard hooked up through an audio interface.
-Audio Interface/Sound Card-Handles the computer's audio input/output. A new sound card is not required to make music but is a good first piece of gear to buy if even remotely serious. It bridges the gap between the computer and
instruments/mics/effects/hardware/speakers/mixers...anything outboard or hardware based.
-Firewire-A way to connect the audio interface to the computer/host. The advantage is faster data transfer than USB and increased portability for laptops/external audio interfaces over PCI/internal bus interfaces.
-PCI/PCMI/PCIE-Ways to connect the audio interface to a computer internally. Really good for stationary desktop/studio workstations b/c of fast data transfer but not recommended for laptops because of work involved in installation directly to mother board + many laptops are without expansion slots.
Sound Synthesis-Sounds are waves. Wavelengths are measured in frequency and dictate pitch to the human ear. High frequency = high pitch/low frequency = low pitch. Sound can be shaped and manipulated by modifying a wave and its elements.
-Sine-lush,warm sound; looks and sounds round to my ear
-Saw-buzzy, abrasive sound to my ear; at low levels causes rushes and pleasure during builds. At sudden, high-levels, when stripped of low-end, causes me physical pain.
-Square-A good middleground between sine and saw waves.
-LFO-(Low Frequency Oscillation)-Oscillates (creates strobing sound) specific low frequency range based on depth and rate(frequency) parameters
Attack, decay, sustain, release are all discussed here:http://homerecording.beaglesound.com/yep2.htm in greater clarity than I could muster.
-Envelope-Used to control automation/effects/volume/etc...across a track.
-Automation-Recorded changes to a track or track's parameters. An envelope is an example of automation.
-Gain-A signal's input level. It differs from volume b/c volume is the level of output. Sometimes people are confused because volume increases as gain increases but they are separate.
General Advice
There is a ton of advice and tutorials all over the web. I'm certainly no pro. Look up terms you don't understand. Get hands-on with some free software. After getting a free download of some type of music production software and playing with it a bit, check out some of Tom Cosm's tutorials here: http://www.cosm.co.nz/index.php/videos.html?catid=3&lang=en Although you could watch them first, it will help to have a feel for what he is doing with the software in each video. Although he uses Ableton, many of
the techniques can be recreated using less expensive/free software. The tutorials span all ability levels from novice to pro. He makes a variety of EDM also so the tips and teks suit all tastes. My best advice is to remember that
fancy/expensive hardware/software is not required to make music. It simply makes it more convenient. You can make tracks using a bucket and some sticks, your mouth, or a free version of FL w/ some free VST plug-ins run through your current soundcard and sequenced/composed using the
piano roll's keyboard as the MIDI controller.
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SeeingBlue
Greenlighter
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2009
- Messages
- 6
Thanks everyone. You've been helpful. |>R()|)!G/-\|_ I'm going to take a little more time and go through your post thoroughly so that it's fully comprehended and understood 
To much going on right now.
DJ 303 it wouldn't let me send you a message so if you want to PM me with some way to get a hold of you I would be grateful for your time.
Thanks for the help |>R()|)!G/-\|_. I was able to understand most of it. The rest will come in time.
A question about sequencers though. I will be using a lot of online tutorials to start learning so with that in mind. Which would you suggest? Which sequencer do you think has the largest(easiest to understand) online tutorials for beginners? That would need to be the one I start with.
|>R()|)!G/-\|_ i got your PM, sadly I still couldn't reply(I think that should be changed, though they probably don't even have that functionality.) I've actually already used FL9 a little and even played around with the panio roll so I'm familiar with it but not the notes. I even used a couple of youtube video to help a bit, looks like I was on the right track
But the question that eventually came to mind: "Now what do I need to know to do what I want?" What features, techniques, plugins, should I be getting familiar with and which should I ignore. Ya know, because I don't want to be wasting my time with irrelevant knowledge.
These questions help me to grasp the nature of this beast, if you will.
To much going on right now. DJ 303 it wouldn't let me send you a message so if you want to PM me with some way to get a hold of you I would be grateful for your time.
Thanks for the help |>R()|)!G/-\|_. I was able to understand most of it. The rest will come in time.
A question about sequencers though. I will be using a lot of online tutorials to start learning so with that in mind. Which would you suggest? Which sequencer do you think has the largest(easiest to understand) online tutorials for beginners? That would need to be the one I start with.
|>R()|)!G/-\|_ i got your PM, sadly I still couldn't reply(I think that should be changed, though they probably don't even have that functionality.) I've actually already used FL9 a little and even played around with the panio roll so I'm familiar with it but not the notes. I even used a couple of youtube video to help a bit, looks like I was on the right track
But the question that eventually came to mind: "Now what do I need to know to do what I want?" What features, techniques, plugins, should I be getting familiar with and which should I ignore. Ya know, because I don't want to be wasting my time with irrelevant knowledge.
These questions help me to grasp the nature of this beast, if you will.
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Sega420
Bluelighter
TRAKTOR PRO.
nuff said.
nuff said.
Production (Not Sure if it goes here)
I've been DJing for about 7 months now and lately one of my cdj's has been broken so i haven't mixed in like 2 weeks. So i've been getting these cravings to do something with music rather than just listening to it.
I've Been lookin into production lately but i have no clue where to start! I'm a big hardstyle lover so if anyone can help me out on how kick drums or reverse bass is made, that would be helpful.
I've been DJing for about 7 months now and lately one of my cdj's has been broken so i haven't mixed in like 2 weeks. So i've been getting these cravings to do something with music rather than just listening to it.
I've Been lookin into production lately but i have no clue where to start! I'm a big hardstyle lover so if anyone can help me out on how kick drums or reverse bass is made, that would be helpful.
PinkStrawberries
Bluelighter
This is a simple question with no easy answer. There are several ways you can produce a kick drum or bass
Try downloading a program that uses loops and play around with those for a little while. Then try creating you're own loops by "drawing" your own music.
If you really want to "create" a kick drum sound then you're in a whole diffent ball park of studio recording involving sophisticated microphones and recording software.
I use Sony Acid Pro 7. Try downloading the free trial from the site and playing around with some of the sounds and/or loops that come with it. Also the sony acid website has weekly downloads of loops and sounds you can download and use for free.
Let us know how it goes.
Try downloading a program that uses loops and play around with those for a little while. Then try creating you're own loops by "drawing" your own music.
If you really want to "create" a kick drum sound then you're in a whole diffent ball park of studio recording involving sophisticated microphones and recording software.
I use Sony Acid Pro 7. Try downloading the free trial from the site and playing around with some of the sounds and/or loops that come with it. Also the sony acid website has weekly downloads of loops and sounds you can download and use for free.
Let us know how it goes.
huh? i don't think that's used often in electronic music.
i make my kickdrums with a sine wave, pitch enverlope, maybe some distortion and eq.
for general kick drum synthesis zebra 2 is good (for starters, there's a tutorial from billy cosmosis on how to synthesize a 909 kick with zebra floating around the net), for the typical psytrance kick i'd use bazzizm.
ChemicalSmiles
Ex-Bluelighter
well do you use sync in traktor?
is that considered cheating among djs? im too new to the whole thing
toa$t
Bluelighter
it is only considered cheating by people who don't actually dj. sync away buddy.
ChemicalSmiles
Ex-Bluelighter
Agreed ^^ And since we've been talking midis and this is the beginners thread whats the consensus on the Vestac VCI-100?
toa$t
Bluelighter
honestly, midi controllers really come down to personal preference. if it is mappable and has a layout that is compatible with the functions you use most, it is going to be a good controller. Personally, I think the jog wheels on the VCI 100 are useless, and would rather have something with more buttons/knobs or a smaller footprint.
lazygit
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Mar 27, 2007
- Messages
- 625
Whats a decent microphone for your mixer? Mainly for shout outs and the odd hip hop chattery.
Had my decks for years..loved them at first then lost interest, off the top of my head they're Vestax PDX2000 mk2's with those tight blue DJ needles, and a Behringer, 3 channel mixer, along with a basic amp and 150 watt or so speakers for my bedroom.
Does anyone know if there should be screws on the platter? It seems they've been removed (ebay) and think it makes the platter wobble slightly.
I need to do more with music than listen, so im gonna try pick it up again
Vinyls expensive but I could get live scratch? etc and hook my laptop up.
Had my decks for years..loved them at first then lost interest, off the top of my head they're Vestax PDX2000 mk2's with those tight blue DJ needles, and a Behringer, 3 channel mixer, along with a basic amp and 150 watt or so speakers for my bedroom.
Does anyone know if there should be screws on the platter? It seems they've been removed (ebay) and think it makes the platter wobble slightly.
I need to do more with music than listen, so im gonna try pick it up again
Vinyls expensive but I could get live scratch? etc and hook my laptop up.
ChemicalSmiles
Ex-Bluelighter
I think serato is like 300
toa$t
Bluelighter
don't waste your money. get traktor. traktor is better than serato in every way, unless you need to scratch videos 8)
RavinRaphael
Bluelighter
Yes it means youa re a cheater among other DJ, well not a cheater, just that you dont know HOW to DJ which in turn means u are a microwave dj, and auto sync will not prevent trainwrecks either just FYI. better to learn by ear. my .02
(if you are doing it to have fun tho, auto sync it all you want. just remember, you will be missing out on essential parts of the learning process. Also you may be setting yourself up to learn and ingrain bad habits.)