Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ and Megathread v.1; 2007 - 2010

[Ufotofu9]

Question:
I was on Suboxone for 9 months, got off last month and relapsed right away...Not highly recommended!

I've been taking about 160 mg of Oxy a day for the last three weeks. I stopped last week for about three days and had no real withdrawals.

I started using again last thursday (Thanksgiving). My last dose of Oxy was this morning at 10 am (Tuesday, Dec. 1st) which was only a tiny part of an 80...so I probably took 10mgs this morning. Since then I haven't had any real withdrawal; only some mild discomfort and some loose stools.

I decided to stop the bullshit and go back on Suboxone. I have an appointment tomorrow morning at 10 am with a Suboxone doctor. By then I may or may not have withdrawal.

I get the feeling that if I don't have withdrawals tomorrow morning then I probably won't have any withdrawals at all. I still want to go on Suboxone for the relief from cravings it gives me and because it blocks opiates.

The question is whether I need to worry about precipitated withdrawal tomorrow morning, which will be 24 hours after my last dose, even if I don't go into w/ds.


If at 10 am tomorrow I'm still not feeling any with

 

[Squigz]

^^ Just wondering, did they make you do any outpatient type stuff where you were getting suboxone? Or was it just grab your pills and do your thing?

 

[fistful_of_needles]

"The question is whether I need to worry about precipitated withdrawal tomorrow morning, which will be 24 hours after my last dose, even if I don't go into w/ds."

24hs is more than enough time for you to safely take the Suboxone after your last dose ...we've actually been loosely discussing this in here lately and seemingly the pattern which leads to all these "precipitated withdrawals" reports is invariably associated with high doses of Bupre being used on the 1st detox day ...I never experienced such thing myself (precipitated withdls) and I suspect neither will you if you take,say,4mg sublingually (24hs or over from your last dose) and if needed be use another 2 or 4mg some hours later never exceeding 8mg in 24hs ...small doses of benzos combined with Sub seem to prove helpful to pretty much everyone in here as well

 

[Ufotofu9]

Squigz,
For my 1st go around on Subs I just grabbed my script from my doctor and left. But this doctor told me that she will monitor me for the 1st 3 days, have me come back once a week for a month, and then see me every month. It sounds like a pain in the ass but for me it's a great thing. I need all the monitoring that they want to do.

I know that 2 to 3mgs is perfectly effective as a blocker, and I've always thought that 8 mg was too much. I have no idea what the doctor will give me tomorrow but if it's 16mgs I would have a problem with this. But I'll have to see.

 

[Oxymorphone]

I'm currently prescribed 16mg of suboxone per day. I usually take 8mg and 16mg on some days if I get cravings. anyway it's been nearly 2 months now that I've been off heroin and on suboxone. It has been amazing for getting off heroin.

I do have quite a bit of extra suboxone and I'm wondering if a user like me who takes on average 12mg a day can feel some euphoria at a higher dose. I hear bupeprenorphine has a ceiling at around 40mg. I'm wondering if I took that dosage would I feel any euphoria? Or can you only get a recreational effect if you are a non regular medicinal user of the drug.

I also have a friend who is on suboxone and about a year ago I saw him IV a pill (this was long before I touched heroin). Anyway that got me curious and he claims that the amount of naloxone in the pills is not enough to deter IV use at lower doses and he was still able to get high off it. I'm wondering if other people have experience with this and can shed some light on it.

 

[Brose]

your best bet for catching a buzz is to get your daily intake to a low dose (~4mgs tops). then each time you dose youll feel it more. and if you double up one day youll feel it even more. but at 12mgs/day its probably impossible to catch a buzz other than what you feel every day when you dose.

im at 8mgs/day and im slowly tapering. i want to get to around 2mgs/day that way ill get more out of it when i do dose (or double dose for that matter).

bupe is truly much more noticeable at daily doses under 4mgs. i speak from experience, and it corroborates what everyone else in this thread says.

 

[Oxymorphone]

your best bet for catching a buzz is to get your daily intake to a low dose (~4mgs tops). then each time you dose youll feel it more. and if you double up one day youll feel it even more. but at 12mgs/day its probably impossible to catch a buzz other than what you feel every day when you dose.

im at 8mgs/day and im slowly tapering. i want to get to around 2mgs/day that way ill get more out of it when i do dose (or double dose for that matter).

bupe is truly much more noticeable at daily doses under 4mgs. i speak from experience, and it corroborates what everyone else in this thread says.

Yeah I just went back and read that. This friend who IVed it said he got highest when he dropped to 2mg a day. So if I took a full 32 or 40mg dose I would feel less right?

I've been at 8 for a while now, honestly they are just hard to cut so I stopped trying to split them until I just picked up a pill cutter. I actually use it to cut them in half just so they will disolve faster in two halfs because they taste like crap and sometimes I get a strange painful sensation with a whole tablet under my tongue.

I'm going to go cut all my 8's in half so I can get used to just taking one half and dropping to 4.

 

[Oxymorphone]

Another thing: I am really serious about never touching heroin again or getting hooked on another opiate (yes I know I am dependant on bupe and it counts), but you know what I mean.

When I got serious about getting clean and started my suboxone treatment I threw all my needles and gear away. I was just cleaning my house the other day and I found a needle I had stashed away. For some reason I didn't throw it out and hid it, I'm not really sure what I'm thinking- I feel it's almost like security or just in case for something. In the back of my mind I want to IV something again, I never get heroin cravings but sometimes I get really strong cocaine cravings and I never really liked coke. If I ever did act out on the urge I would want to IV it, and now talking about suboxone if I got to a low enough daily intake I would consider IVing it too, I don't know why or what the benefit is....

Anyway sorry for the rant it's just something that's been at the back of my mind, I should probably just throw it away but I also want to keep it if I ever "need it." It's definitely NOT ever going to be used for heroin, I am strong enough not to touch it again I just want tl clarify that since some people might interpret it as preparing to relapse. Can any recovering addicts with clean time relate and do any of you keep a needle around for some reason?

 

[Z Y G G Y]

Another thing: I am really serious about never touching heroin again or getting hooked on another opiate (yes I know I am dependant on bupe and it counts), but you know what I mean.

When I got serious about getting clean and started my suboxone treatment I threw all my needles and gear away. I was just cleaning my house the other day and I found a needle I had stashed away. For some reason I didn't throw it out and hid it, I'm not really sure what I'm thinking- I feel it's almost like security or just in case for something. In the back of my mind I want to IV something again, I never get heroin cravings but sometimes I get really strong cocaine cravings and I never really liked coke. If I ever did act out on the urge I would want to IV it, and now talking about suboxone if I got to a low enough daily intake I would consider IVing it too, I don't know why or what the benefit is....

Anyway sorry for the rant it's just something that's been at the back of my mind, I should probably just throw it away but I also want to keep it if I ever "need it."

I didn't know anyone felt like me as I also got strong coke cravings after I dropped the opiates. Like I kept telling my SO I want coke ever weekend. It was wierd as coke was not something I even liked that much, just usually did it if it was free and there was nothing else.

Just so u know, life w/o dope is so much better. God, my life is turning around big time. My house is spotless again. I study for hours a day since I'm a non woking student. My relationship is great again. And people were doing dope at my house, twice and I had no cravings since my life is so good now I don't want the shit anymore.

Hang in there and it will get better. I used bupe to get off. I made the mistake of being on it for a year but whatever, I'm clean now and that's all that counts. Right?

At some point even thou I wasn't using I also hid needles just in case and ended up using all 8 of them for heroin. I was never an IVer when I was using, I started to IV during the end stages of my addiction but once I stared IVing I never went back. I'm terrifeied thou to IV anything other than dope. I know Ivng dope is horrible but I hear so many bad things abut IVng pills that it totally turns me off. It's just something we do sometimes as addicts (hide needles for future use). Can't explain it but had the same thing.

I'm pretty sure Captain.Heroin IVs his very low dose bupe. From what he says bupe has no nasty additives that other pills have. Maybe he'll add more on this so u make better choices if u ever choose to IV bupe.

 

[Oxymorphone]

I didn't know anyone felt like me as I also got strong coke cravings after I dropped the opiates. Like I kept telling my SO I want coke ever weekend. It was wierd as coke was not something I even liked that much, just usually did it if it was free and there was nothing else.

Just so u know, life w/o dope is so much better. God, my life is turning around big time. My house is spotless again. I study for hours a day since I'm a non woking student. My relationship is great again. And people were doing dope at my house, twice and I had no cravings since my life is so good now I don't want the shit anymore.

Hang in there and it will get better. I used bupe to get off. I made the mistake of being on it for a year but whatever, I'm clean now and that's all that counts. Right?

At some point even thou I wasn't using I also hid needles just in case and ended up using all 8 of them for heroin. I was never an IVer when I was using, I started to IV during the end stages of my addiction but once I stared IVing I never went back. I'm terrifeied thou to IV anything other than dope. I know Ivng dope is horrible but I hear so many bad things abut IVng pills that it totally turns me off. It's just something we do sometimes as addicts (hide needles for future use). Can't explain it but had the same thing.

I'm pretty sure Captain.Heroin IVs his very low dose bupe. From what he says bupe has no nasty additives that other pills have. Maybe he'll add more on this so u make better choices if u ever choose to IV bupe.

Thanks for your response. the coke thing is really strange, I never like it much and always thought it was a waste of money but I get cravings for it often, sometimes really intense yet I have no heroin cravings.

Trust me I am so happy to be clean, I wasn't using for very long but it did a hell of a lot of damage and my life is finally starting to come back together. Life without it is great and I know that there is no life with it.

I guess the needle thing makes sense, as addicts we have certain habbits and tendencies to hoard and hide things for security that stick with us through recovery. Ir's almost like when I would hide bags in obscure locations and try to forget about them just in case i ever ran out and needed them. I even did that when I was addicted to pot although I think I hid weed more and I was so dependent and afraid of not having it. With heroin I didn't really care about much and figured out how to get my next batch when I needed to.

 

[Oxymorphone]

Also, can anyone tell me what that little cross is for on suboxone? It helps cutting a little but what about the short part, is it just a brand marking?

As a side thought cutting suoxone with a pill cutter in half and even quarters is really easy due to the hexagonal shape; it lines up perfectly with the 60 degree angled wedge on my pill cutter. If anyone tried to cut them by hand you know how difficult it is, it's nearly perfect with the cutter and I can get 2mg quarters out of an 8 which is what I'm aiming to get down to. I just mention it since I'm sitting here cutting all my pills in half.

 

[Z Y G G Y]

I also wondered about the cross. It looks like a fighting tool of some sort. Can't think of the name of the tool as English is not my primary language. Like a knife thing of some sort. I always thought it was the pharma companies laughing in our asses for the ass raping prices of the drug.

I had a 3 month break from bupe and since I have chronic pain I can't live w/o pain pills and no one cuz of my age wants to give me anything stronger so I went back to small bupe doses.

It seems to have no negative effect on me at o.1mg/day. I personally put the bupe in a solution to get 0.1/1ml of water and keep it in the fridge. It's really hard to get tiny amounts of bupe and the 2mg pills are a rip off so I use the solution method and it has been working well for me. U can I put 0.1mg in less than 1ml if u calculate it right. I also use the rectal ROA since I can't stand the taste of sub and for this reason it's especially important to keep it in the fridge.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I also have a friend who is on suboxone and about a year ago I saw him IV a pill (this was long before I touched heroin). Anyway that got me curious and he claims that the amount of naloxone in the pills is not enough to deter IV use at lower doses and he was still able to get high off it. I'm wondering if other people have experience with this and can shed some light on it.

It's pretty much true. The naloxone does nothing to make IVing it a problem. Naloxone is inert as buprenorphine will out-compete the receptor for it, and naloxone will be metabolized before buprenorphine will.

You don't need very much when IVing buprenorphine. I get pretty high off of 0.16mg.

Also, can anyone tell me what that little cross is for on suboxone? It helps cutting a little but what about the short part, is it just a brand marking?

It's R&B's logo.

As a side thought cutting suoxone with a pill cutter in half and even quarters is really easy due to the hexagonal shape; it lines up perfectly with the 60 degree angled wedge on my pill cutter. If anyone tried to cut them by hand you know how difficult it is, it's nearly perfect with the cutter and I can get 2mg quarters out of an 8 which is what I'm aiming to get down to. I just mention it since I'm sitting here cutting all my pills in half.

Yeah, I find no problem cutting them in quarters. Sometimes I'll lose a tiny bit but nothing to complain about.

 

[Oxymorphone]

It's pretty much true. The naloxone does nothing to make IVing it a problem. Naloxone is inert as buprenorphine will out-compete the receptor for it, and naloxone will be metabolized before buprenorphine will.

You don't need very much when IVing buprenorphine. I get pretty high off of 0.16mg.


It's R&B's logo.


Yeah, I find no problem cutting them in quarters. Sometimes I'll lose a tiny bit but nothing to complain about.

Thanks for clearing that up. Out of curiosity I took 40mg over the last hour, I felt a little bit at 24 and now nothing really. I wanted to see how the ceiling worked for me and if I could get an effect at a high dose.

Anyway how do you get .16mg doses? That seems crazy small and I wouldn't know how to begin to measure it. I am planning to drop down to 4mg daily starting immediately (well I'll skip tomorrow and maybe the next day due to my high dose right now, which was a waste but I have so much extra it doesn't matter).

Will I be able to get any euphoria at 4 going up to 6-12 or will I have to drop to 2mg per day? Aside from wanting to feel a little euphoria I think tapering down is overall a good idea anyway. I don't plan to tell my doctor this though and want to keep receiving 16mg per day, the extra can only come in handy and doesn't cost any more, plus for the assrape price of the drug I might as well get my money's worth. I got my insurance to drop it down to $50, I was being charged $90 at first for a week supply when it retailed for $120ish.

I am interested in IVing it, can you or anyone tell me a little more about the proper doses to get a positive effect and what I would have to be on daily? How much more effective is IV vs sublingual?

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Anyway how do you get .16mg doses? That seems crazy small and I wouldn't know how to begin to measure it. I am planning to drop down to 4mg daily starting immediately (well I'll skip tomorrow and maybe the next day due to my high dose right now, which was a waste but I have so much extra it doesn't matter).

I take a pill cutter and an 8mg pill. 1/4th of the pill is 2mg.

I take a pill crusher. I put in a 2mg pill section, and decimate it.

Measuring out the powder into lines, I even out 6 lines. Each pile has 1/3mg in it. I have half of one pile at a time, which is 1/6mg. that is 0.16666666...mg.

Will I be able to get any euphoria at 4 going up to 6-12 or will I have to drop to 2mg per day? Aside from wanting to feel a little euphoria I think tapering down is overall a good idea anyway. I don't plan to tell my doctor this though and want to keep receiving 16mg per day, the extra can only come in handy and doesn't cost any more, plus for the assrape price of the drug I might as well get my money's worth. I got my insurance to drop it down to $50, I was being charged $90 at first for a week supply when it retailed for $120ish.

I am interested in IVing it, can you or anyone tell me a little more about the proper doses to get a positive effect and what I would have to be on daily? How much more effective is IV vs sublingual?

You can get euphoria at 4mg of buprenorphine, but I find it takes a while since you've used heroin and other opiates until your tolerance drops down low enough to get high off of buprenorphine. I think if it's been a few months you have a better chance of getting high.

IV BA = 100%, sublingual BA ranges but is average around 30%. I prefer to use 2mg sublingually which lasts me a long time, or I like to use 0.16mg at a time IV which lasts me 3-5 hours (sometimes longer).

It's not worth it to IV Suboxone until your tolerance is down significantly.

If you can get by on 2mg per day, that's when you're able to get high with IV buprenorphine I would say. It may take a few weeks/months at 2mg/day sublingually to lower your opiate tolerance depending on how much dope you used and how long you stayed up there, etc.

If you have any other Q's feel free to ask me.

 

[Brose]

i got a q capt: say i did 8mg/day for months. then one day i switch to doing 2mg/day. how long after the switch from 8mg to 2mg until my bupe tolerance is low enough to reap the full benefits of bupe? no other drugs involved.

 

[blue_locus]

I realize most people posting here have a pretty high opiate tolerance, but I had a weird experience railing suboxone this weekend that I figured I'd share.

My friend takes it orally but cut me out a line cause I was interested, id say no more than 1-2mg. I eat and rail vicodins or oxys a couple times a week, although very low dose, so I didn't think much of it.

It was the most fucked up I've been on any opiate! it didn't even really have a euphoric opiate high, I just felt fucked up. I kept passing out and waking up, and couldn't do anything useful at all. My friend had to watch me to make sure my respiration didn't get too shallow. I was fine, but I felt drug effects until nearly noon the next day!

so just because its a partial-agonist doesn't mean its not serious business

bam harm reduction in your face!

 

[Captain.Heroin]

i got a q capt: say i did 8mg/day for months. then one day i switch to doing 2mg/day. how long after the switch from 8mg to 2mg until my bupe tolerance is low enough to reap the full benefits of bupe? no other drugs involved.

It's different for everyone, however I think of this process as "stabilizing". Whenever I taper to a lower dose (I used to cut my dose in half and then stabilize) I would find I only needed weeks to stabilize.

I think the bigger dose decrease you have, the longer it may take to stabilize. However, I think you will definitely notice a different before 1 month is up for sure, but probably between 1 and 2 weeks.

If you dropped to 2mg form 8mg then good job. Let me know how long it seems to take for you, because it'll vary for different people and I know it typically takes me about 2 weeks or less.

My friend takes it orally but cut me out a line cause I was interested, id say no more than 1-2mg. I eat and rail vicodins or oxys a couple times a week, although very low dose, so I didn't think much of it.

It was the most fucked up I've been on any opiate! it didn't even really have a euphoric opiate high, I just felt fucked up. I kept passing out and waking up, and couldn't do anything useful at all. My friend had to watch me to make sure my respiration didn't get too shallow. I was fine, but I felt drug effects until nearly noon the next day!

so just because its a partial-agonist doesn't mean its not serious business

bam harm reduction in your face!

You probably did too much.

I think you should try 0.5mg or less next time.

I find it is pretty euphoric but it can be a very "fucked up" feeling for sure. The nodding out is classic. I also like the long duration of effects.

If you only use hydro/oxy a few times a week then 0.5mg is probably all you need. Buprenorphine definitely is a very potent opiate.

Thanks for the subjective report.

 

[Brose]

much thanks for the reply CH. ill definitely post when i have some results from my little experiment. starting tomorrow its 2mg/per day, or 4mg MAX for the first few days.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

much thanks for the reply CH. ill definitely post when i have some results from my little experiment. starting tomorrow its 2mg/per day, or 4mg MAX for the first few days.

Good luck. Let us know how it goes.