🤝 Cultural 🤝 what could replace alcohol?

[Featherfall]

A thought that has been on my mind for a while now, is the idea of what drug could potentially replace alcohol in the cultural eye.
Alcohol is incredibly toxic, even comparatively to other 'strong' illegal drugs. I imagine we all know this, to make people stop drinking is also a rather Utopian idea. So why not replace it with a "less" toxic drug one might ask?
Well here is where this theoretical becomes fun, what drug could replace the common use patterns that alcohol has, while being less toxic? This doesn't mean the drug would need to feel similar or work in a similar way per se, but be able to always be chosen over alcohol. Be this for social drinking, getting shitfaced, partying, going to concerts, as a social enhancer, pretty much something to both stimulate and depress you. A everything side drug basically, i'd like to empathize i don't think it would really need to feel similar at all, simply just promote similar functions, but since alcohol is used in so so many contexts, it becomes increasingly difficult to think of something that might fit.
So this is why i wanted to put this question out there, i've found it a rather interesting thought while thinking it over whenever bored and people with more drug experience might have some neat contenders.
(My only current ""idea"" is pcp since its both dissociating and stimulating, but thats a big jump)
(also just for fun obv, not very serious, not like something like that would even ever be possible lol)

 

[placebonaut]

think you're describing Cannabis

a major driver for alcohol use is its ubiquitous availability that has ingrained itself in multiple cultures, this has made it highly socially acceptable despite the downsides, the pain just isn't big enough for most users to stop them taking it, in low dose it's mild, yet in higher doses you can use it to escape, it's a social lube, something you can dance on, and it helps you interact with the human you're attracted to.

Cannabis fulls lots of these criteria, the major downside being smoking it v drinking it and having to select the right strain for your mood.

So a drinkable version of cannabis with added things - northern lights and redbull anyone?

 

[Dr. John Thackery]

nothing like alcohol. i don’t see it being replaced

he’s it’s an awful awful drug but it’s unique

 

[Featherfall]

think you're describing Cannabis

a major driver for alcohol use is its ubiquitous availability that has ingrained itself in multiple cultures, this has made it highly socially acceptable despite the downsides, the pain just isn't big enough for most users to stop them taking it, in low dose it's mild, yet in higher doses you can use it to escape, it's a social lube, something you can dance on, and it helps you interact with the human you're attracted to.

Cannabis fulls lots of these criteria, the major downside being smoking it v drinking it and having to select the right strain for your mood.

So a drinkable version of cannabis with added things - northern lights and redbull anyone?

cannabis is a big one to think off, but i find it just to much of a "downer" chill type drug and while it works for alot of situations similar to it, i just cant see it work nearly as well as alcohol, esp as a social lube. Though its better than nothing

 

[Featherfall]

nothing like alcohol. i don’t see it being replaced

he’s it’s an awful awful drug but it’s unique

yeah, i've come to a similar conclusion sadly, but interesting to think about

 

[foodcrisis]

i'm thinking some people get goofy on shrooms socializing with their friends kind of like alcohol and they are good for concerts. maybe a little bit similar... not everyone can use mushrooms that way though.


a lot of people are going from alcohol to pot now that it's legal.


couldn't really see PCP replacing alcohol with how it's demonized. i've never tried it. not sure how similar it is to DXM with the both being dissociatives, but couldn't see anything at all like that replacing alcohol. i actually used to take DXM at like 200mg doses being like "probably better than drinking", but with the buzz, i don't think most people would be down with that. kind of a weird feeling. then again, i feel like strong weed is kind of bizarre and don't really get how some what i'd consider "normal" people like it, so i guess i really have no idea.



would love to just see all drugs legalized... pretty sure there'd be people that went in all different directions with their drug use if people were free to do what they wanted.

 

[Dr. John Thackery]

i'm thinking some people get goofy on shrooms socializing with their friends kind of like alcohol and they are good for concerts. maybe a little bit similar... not everyone can use mushrooms that way though.


a lot of people are going from alcohol to pot now that it's legal.


couldn't really see PCP replacing alcohol with how it's demonized. i've never tried it. not sure how similar it is to DXM with the both being dissociatives, but couldn't see anything at all like that replacing alcohol. i actually used to take DXM at like 200mg doses being like "probably better than drinking", but with the buzz, i don't think most people would be down with that. kind of a weird feeling. then again, i feel like strong weed is kind of bizarre and don't really get how some what i'd consider "normal" people like it, so i guess i really have no idea.



would love to just see all drugs legalized... pretty sure there'd be people that went in all different directions with their drug use if people were free to do what they wanted.

they can be in the same category at high doses (dxm and pcp)

the problem is that the difference lies in lower “functional” doses

pcp is a strong stimulant and dopamine reuptake inhibitor. DXM is not. so with pcp low doses there much more of the euphoric loss of inhibition, artificial boost in confidence, that we see in alcohol.

it’s a cleaner high too at functional doses, not as stoning as DXM. DXM doesn’t really have a low dose or threshold dose utility. you’re just sick and nauseous at low doses or in a another dimension when you break through without an in between sweet spot like you can get with pcp

 

[Featherfall]

i'm thinking some people get goofy on shrooms socializing with their friends kind of like alcohol and they are good for concerts. maybe a little bit similar... not everyone can use mushrooms that way though.


a lot of people are going from alcohol to pot now that it's legal.


couldn't really see PCP replacing alcohol with how it's demonized. i've never tried it. not sure how similar it is to DXM with the both being dissociatives, but couldn't see anything at all like that replacing alcohol. i actually used to take DXM at like 200mg doses being like "probably better than drinking", but with the buzz, i don't think most people would be down with that. kind of a weird feeling. then again, i feel like strong weed is kind of bizarre and don't really get how some what i'd consider "normal" people like it, so i guess i really have no idea.



would love to just see all drugs legalized... pretty sure there'd be people that went in all different directions with their drug use if people were free to do what they wanted.

yeah it'd be very interesting to see the splits of people, low dose shrooms seems good but i think for anything to get close to lapsing alcohol it'd always have to make you a little stupid. Pots good but just dont think it fits. Thought about dxm too but its to unpredictable individually. pcp just came to mind cause it dissos you but still keeps you up right

 

[Featherfall]

they can be in the same category at high doses (dxm and pcp)

the problem is that the difference lies in lower “functional” doses

pcp is a strong stimulant and dopamine reuptake inhibitor. DXM is not. so with pcp low doses there much more of the euphoric loss of inhibition, artificial boost in confidence, that we see in alcohol.

it’s a cleaner high too at functional doses, not as stoning as DXM. DXM doesn’t really have a low dose or threshold dose utility. you’re just sick and nauseous at low doses or in a another dimension when you break through without an in between sweet spot like you can get with pcp

Exactly. Thats why its the closest i ever got to a good answer.

 

[KurtAurelius]

I’ve always thought small doses of GHB or similar agents are perfect alcohol replacements but this is a bias due to my experience that was stellar.

GHB is the best GABAergic drug I’ve tried, it is actually euphoric without dirty sides like alcohol and is the least compulsive from my experience compared to alcohol or benzos.

In terms of sale and so forth? It would be difficult to sell safely other than it being dispensed dose by dose.

That is it’s pitifall I believe sadly, as toxic as alcohol is, it doesn’t cause someone to pass out in the ml range.

I despise alcohol so much, it’s a disgusting drug and caused me the most physical damage, and I was enabled as a child to get addicted to it.

I will never not be pissed of that I could buy alcohol but not any kind of Opioid OtC.

Haven’t drank for 4 years, and don’t regret it one bit. Nasty toxic shit.

 

[Featherfall]

I’ve always thought small doses of GHB or similar agents are perfect alcohol replacements but this is a bias due to my experience that was stellar.

GHB is the best GABAergic drug I’ve tried, it is actually euphoric without dirty effects and is the least compulsive from my experience.

In terms of sale and so forth? It would be difficult to sell safely other than it being dispensed dose by dose.

That is it’s pitiful I believe sadly, as toxic as alcohol is, it doesn’t cause someone to pass out in the ml range.

thing is ghb just seems at least similarly toxic/dangerous as alcohol. Maybe the danger points are a little reshuffled but still at the same level.

 

[KurtAurelius]

thing is ghb just seems at least similarly toxic/dangerous as alcohol. Maybe the danger points are a little reshuffled but still at the same level.

I can’t say for sure but I don’t know if it is physically safer except for overdose, in terms of like toxicity.

GHB notorious for overdosing but actual damage? I’m not so sure. Narcoleptics are on Sodium Oxybate for life.

There’s no way Sodium Oxybate causes the numerous damages that alcohol does.

Safety and efficacy of long-term use of sodium oxybate for narcolepsy with cataplexy in routine clinical practice - PMC

Sodium oxybate is licensed in Europe for the treatment of narcolepsy with cataplexy in adults. The aim of this study was to assess the efficacy and safety of sodium oxybate in clinical practice in patients with narcolepsy and cataplexy refractory to ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Featherfall]

I can’t say for sure but I don’t know if it is physically safer except for overdose, in terms of like toxicity.

GHB notorious for overdosing but actual damage? I’m not so sure. Narcoleptics are on Sodium Oxybate for life.

fair, if you could somehow mitigate the od risk and keep people from getting spiked, it could be a contender for at least a slight decrease in alcohol harm

 

[abefourth]

neurotoxicity is always a big consideration.

 

[Dr. John Thackery]

GHB is the best GABAergic drug I’ve tried, it is actually euphoric without dirty sides like alcohol and is the least compulsive from my experience compared to alcohol or benzos.

this strange. i’d say ghb is the 2nd most compulsive gabaergic after alcohol.

the fast almost instant come on makes it extra addictive and compulsive for me. also it doesn’t last long so you can keep repeating it. it’s like the crack of gabaergics. imo.

definitely doesn’t have the stimulating and upwards rising loss of inhibition that alcohol has tho

 

[abefourth]

this strange. i’d say ghb is the 2nd most compulsive gabaergic after alcohol.

the fast almost instant come on makes it extra addictive and compulsive for me. also it doesn’t last long so you can keep repeating it. it’s like the crack of gabaergics. imo.

definitely doesn’t have the stimulating and upwards rising loss of inhibition that alcohol has tho

Have you ever had any side effects from ghb?

 

[Esperighanto]

I have always found GHB, benzos and soma to be far superior to alcohol, but as far as addictivity goes maybe just soma and cannabis would excel, just a hunch though.

 

[Featherfall]

I have always found GHB, benzos and soma to be far superior to alcohol, but as far as addictivity goes maybe just soma and cannabis would excel, just a hunch though.

probably could replace it but idk if thats any better really lol

 

[Esperighanto]

probably could replace it but idk if thats any better really lol

As far as toxicity goes, benzos are objectively far safer. The question is how many people could form a healthy relationship to it, given that alcohol is more self-limiting, I would imagine.

 

[4DQSAR]

Pyeyzolam does 'drunk' off to a tee.

The issue is that it cannot emulate 'one glass of wine'. It's sort of 2 bottles of wine OR nothing.

Hence the design of the 'supercats' which are not a5b1y2 selective but a5b1/b2/b3y2 selective. Those DO fully emulate ethanol from the glass of wine to the bottle of vodka.