💊 Drug Discussion 💊 Most Expensive Drug of All Time

[4DQSAR]

Yes, @ecstacydata.org since I work in harm reduction and it normally costs $150 for a lab work up (GC/MS), but I was getting three free per calendar year; otherwise it would just be ~$40 for for me after the three free testings. It’s all on their website somewhere but I would need to dig through a lot.

GC-MS doesn't detect optical rotation. You need a solild CHIROBIOTIC column or similar. I doubt a drug testing outfit would pay for a tool of marginal utility - polarmetry would be cheaper. It's old but it works.

I just checked ecstacydata.org (now called drugsdata.org) and they don't offer chiral analysis. Maybe they did, it's not someone I have ever used.

It WOULD be quite cool if, for a HR worker, they pulled a cobwebbed polarmeter out of a dusty cupboard, wiped off the mold and did it the old fashioned way.

I assume you would need a larger sample to use that latter methodology - I struggled to find anyone who still used it. They didn't even know how much extra to charge! But being a HR worker, I guess you would get 'mates rates'... or they farmed it out to someone with that technology? I interpret GC-MS data as part of my job, so while I would love Chiral GC, it's just so much more costly that using the old way is fine for my needs.

But I would like to know the rotation as even that can just be put into an equasion and the ee drops out. I would be able to use it as reference.

Of course, if you told them it was chiral, would they assume you as a HR worker would already know so not actually perform the test? But as I said, never used them.

 

[Syntherize]

GC-MS doesn't detect optical rotation. You need a solild CHIROBIOTIC colum or similar. . I doubt a drug testing outfit would pay for a tool of marginal utility - polarmetry would be cheaper. It's old but it works.

I just checked ecstacydata.org (now called drugsdata.org) and they don't offer chiral analysis. Maybe they did, it's not someone I have ever used.

It WOULD be quite cool if, for a HR worker, they pulled a cobwebbed polarmeter out of a dusty cupboard, wiped off the mold and did it the old fashioned way.

I assume you would need a larger sample to use that latter methodology - I struggled to find anyone who still used it. They didn't even know how much extra to charge! But being a HR worker, I guess you would get 'mates rates'... or they farmed it out yo someone with that technology? I interpret GC-MS data as part of my job, so while I would love Chiral GC, it's just so much more costly that using the old way is fine for my needs.

But I would like to know the rotation as even that can just be put into an equasion and the ee drops out. I would be able to use it as reference.

Of course, if you told them it was chiral, would they assume you as a HR worker would already know so not actually perform the test? But as I said, never used them.

You make some really good points indeed, but another important thing is knowing the supplier/manufacturer’s techniques used in order to achieve this goal, especially when you are closer to said source. This was almost ten years ago for me now, but I know that it is still floating around, and yes the drugs data site always offered deals for people in the field so to speak. Check this interesting video as well, bc I found it pretty informative, yet as to the validity of this chemist’s life I am not entirely sure, but it was a good podcast to listen to in bed nonetheless:

 

[N0ph0n0]

I wonder what damage all these spice heads, and tranq users in the USA, must be doing to themselves in a similar way, when they are nodding out, or their brains are going offline, or whatever is happening to them, when they end up contorted into all the famously bizarre postures we've all seen the footage of.

Not just the states anymore, even montreal is being hit with tranq (mostly medetomidine). And while spice is rare, i once had the mispleasure of being given a bowl of "weed" by my "opp" (gangster wannabe who allways to fight) which ended up being spice.

 

[chippermonk]

Or just trying out different variations of gravity.

Hmm...which raises a question: if an astronaut in zero gravity were to do fentanyl, would he fold? I'm guessing not, but what would he do?

 

[BadBoy377]

Hmm...which raises a question: if an astronaut in zero gravity were to do fentanyl, would he fold? I'm guessing not, but what would he do?

Nod out, float off and wake up on mars?

 

[Jnowhere]

That's still the average price in northern Canadian reservations (everything over there is overpriced, a liter of the cheapest vodka is 150-200 bucks).

Yeah, I guess they outlawed booze on First Nation resevations, like in some American Indian, Eskimo, Inuit, and aboriginal areas or rservations.

Hmm, That would be tempting; to smuggle booze if I were a Canadian. But Grain alcohol might be more effective. Moonshine production would make it even more tempting. Canadian law enforcement is a joke compared to areas in America I have I lived.

 

[Ki3ly]

Lust with some dust and some crust

 

[4DQSAR]

@Syntherize - HM asked me for an intervew BUT a good friend of mine was the discoverer of MXE, was interviewed by HM (Interview with a Ketamine Chemist) and so I KNOW HM isn't above inventing lies for his own reaons. In that case, it was NOT an IRA bomb that meant my friend lost an arm. It was a childhood experiment gone wrong.

So don't quote HM at me - the guy is a liar. In fact, he invents so much, it's a joke.

hamilton | HTMLGIANT

htmlgiant.com

Anyone else spot the mistakes PLURAL?

We all make mistakes but it's the arrogance that gets me. Even I would check if it were going to end up being seens by many people. As a journalist, he is talented and able - but he's building a myth that he is the expert. Which he assuredly isn't.

Plus, what sort of person would WANT to admit to criminal acts? It's people like Owsley - people who want the cache. In that case, Melissa Cargill made all of the LSD. Later Owsley had her lab-notes to support his claim and handed them to Nick Sands & Tim Skully. When the DEA issued warrents for their arrests, who wasn't arrested? I suggest THAT is the litmus test in that case.

I posted the original patent covering mephedrone from 1967 - but how many people have we read who CLAIMED to be the inventor? Likewise 5.6-APB, Eli Lilly patented them in 2006. So Dr. Zee has changed his story twice (at least). He's absolutely the perfect patsy - someone who WANTS the credit.

BTW in the video you posted, it's Spitball, not the chemist. CLEARLY not the chemist as he can't even name reagents. Nice guy and DID keep his mouth shut. But he's struggling and I totally get that he needs work. I KNOW 'Ben' so you couldn't have chosen a worse example.

 

[Featherfall]

@Syntherize - HM asked me for an intervew BUT a good friend of mine was the discoverer of MXE, was interviewed by HM (Interview with a Ketamine Chemist) and so I KNOW HM isn't above inventing lies for his own reaons. In that case, it was NOT an IRA bomb that meant my friend lost an arm. It was a childhood experiment gone wrong.

So don't quote HM at me - the guy is a liar. In fact, he invents so much, it's a joke.

hamilton | HTMLGIANT

htmlgiant.com

Anyone else spot the mistakes PLURAL?

We all make mistakes but it's the arrogance that gets me. Even I would check if it were going to end up being seens by many people. As a journalist, he is talented and able - but he's building a myth that he is the expert. Which he assuredly isn't.

Plus, what sort of person would WANT to admit to criminal acts? It's people like Owsley - people who want the cache. In that case, Melissa Cargill made all of the LSD. Later Owsley had her lab-noties to support his claim and Nick Sands & Tim Skully were fooled... right up until the moment the DEA issued warrents for their arrests. But who wasn't arrested, judged and found guilty? Got it in one.

I posted the original patent covering mephedrone from 1967 - but how many people have we read who CLAIMED to be the inventor? Likewise 5.6-APB, Eli Lilly patented them in 2006. So Dr. Zee has changed his story twice (at least). He's absolutely the perfect patsy - someone who WANTS the credit.

BTW in the video you posted, it's Spitball, not the chemist. CLEARLY not the chemist as he can't even name reagents. Nice guy and DID keep his mouth shut. But he's struggling and I totally get that he needs work. I KNOW 'Ben' so you couldn't have chosen a worse example.

whats with the link? i might be not seeing it correctly but how is it related? link the right thing?
also, please do elaborate on the lies of HM, i'd be interested to know his points of critique more

 

[4DQSAR]

PMed it to you.

 

[Syntherize]

@Syntherize - HM asked me for an intervew BUT a good friend of mine was the discoverer of MXE, was interviewed by HM (Interview with a Ketamine Chemist) and so I KNOW HM isn't above inventing lies for his own reaons. In that case, it was NOT an IRA bomb that meant my friend lost an arm. It was a childhood experiment gone wrong.

So don't quote HM at me - the guy is a liar. In fact, he invents so much, it's a joke.

hamilton | HTMLGIANT

htmlgiant.com

Anyone else spot the mistakes PLURAL?

We all make mistakes but it's the arrogance that gets me. Even I would check if it were going to end up being seens by many people. As a journalist, he is talented and able - but he's building a myth that he is the expert. Which he assuredly isn't.

Plus, what sort of person would WANT to admit to criminal acts? It's people like Owsley - people who want the cache. In that case, Melissa Cargill made all of the LSD. Later Owsley had her lab-notes to support his claim and handed them to Nick Sands & Tim Skully. When the DEA issued warrents for their arrests, who wasn't arrested? I suggest THAT is the litmus test in that case.

I posted the original patent covering mephedrone from 1967 - but how many people have we read who CLAIMED to be the inventor? Likewise 5.6-APB, Eli Lilly patented them in 2006. So Dr. Zee has changed his story twice (at least). He's absolutely the perfect patsy - someone who WANTS the credit.

BTW in the video you posted, it's Spitball, not the chemist. CLEARLY not the chemist as he can't even name reagents. Nice guy and DID keep his mouth shut. But he's struggling and I totally get that he needs work. I KNOW 'Ben' so you couldn't have chosen a worse example.

That’s cool that you’re in the wise man, but I could care less about all these media hype folks since as you said staying low is the way to go in these circles, and yup “Spitball” in this video is definitely not a very trained chemist, but all he said was that he was trained to do it while following suit on his own. I didn’t say the D-MDA I was procuring ten years ago was from him—-just sharing the video mate since it pertained to our conversation.

 

[4DQSAR]

I didn’t say the D-MDA I was procuring ten years ago was from him.

My bad. It IS possible to chirally reduce a nitroalkene to the chiral nitroalcohol (all are legal, BTW). That's where the confusion came from, and why I wanted to know the ee. The intermediate is chiral but if you are already employing Parr hydrogenation, that benzylic alcohol is itself reduced (as is the nitro) so it's not just neat, it's the way it's done. Nitroolfefin to chiral amine in one go. Now just what that ee IS, I would like to know as different people give me different values - so if your man had used old-school optical resolution of product, in theory, ee should be knowable since it should be essentially BE just one enantiomer.

Forgive my oversight.

 

[Syntherize]

My bad. It IS possible to chirally reduce a nitroalkene to the chiral nitroalcohol (all are legal, BTW). That's where the confusion came from, and why I wanted to know the ee. The intermediate is chiral but if you are already employing Parr hydrogenation, that benzylic alcohol is itself reduced (as is the nitro) so it's not just neat, it's the way it's done. Nitroolfefin to chiral amine in one go. Now just what that ee IS, I would like to know as different people give me different values - so if your man had used old-school optical resolution of product, in theory, ee should be knowable since it should be essentially BE just one enantiomer.

Forgive my oversight.

It’s all good man thanks for sharing your perspective! I have no clue what the values are at this point bc the chemist passed away years ago due to “hitting the restart button” so to speak smh

 

[4DQSAR]

Yeah - most seem to break RULE 1.

Known a lot that ended up dead for ignoring that rule.

 

[N0ph0n0]

Yeah, I guess they outlawed booze on First Nation resevations, like in some American Indian, Eskimo, Inuit, and aboriginal areas or rservations.

Hmm, That would be tempting; to smuggle booze if I were a Canadian. But Grain alcohol might be more effective. Moonshine production would make it even more tempting. Canadian law enforcement is a joke compared to areas in America I have I lived.

Yeah dry zones.
As for smuggling while it is tempting i really would'nt recommend it, the police are'nt the ones you gotta be scared of. Unless you get pernission from the native gangs/mafia in control of "x" reservation then you are going to get robbed and beaten up or even killed.

Edit: as for moonshining it's allredy going on but on a much smaller scale but it's very low value, it's mostly just teens/bums that do it (atleast in the reservation i lived in).

 

[Perkins : Reborn]

Black tar is pretty popular in southern Europe and Germany.
Opium has lit more appeal for me also than H isn’t stigmatized it’s exotic it’s natural it lasts all day
Black tar smells like vinegar

Are you sure this isn't just your standard Afghan / Pakistan brown? That can also smell.

I've never heard this before from anybody in Germany or Southern Europe.

Seems highly unusual that something almost completely synthesised in Mexico would surface in Germany, where the Turks largely control the trade and they sell the usual brown freebase.

If you do happen to be wrong, don't worry because the substances are superficially quite similar.

 

[4DQSAR]

Smuggling ethanol - BRILLIANT PLAN

40mg of pyeyzolam is a bit easier to smuggle, don't you think? That's a bottle of vodka right there. Yet, oddly, legal.

 

[notsmokeymcpot42088]

^ Pyeyzolam tough to source for most ppl -- ethanol, who couldn't. If you live in a GBL country may as well do that and get the paperwork -- and do w/e you need to legally or w/e lol.

Are you sure this isn't just your standard Afghan / Pakistan brown? That can also smell.

I've never heard this before from anybody in Germany or Southern Europe.

Seems highly unusual that something almost completely synthesised in Mexico would surface in Germany, where the Turks largely control the trade and they sell the usual brown freebase.

If you do happen to be wrong, don't worry because the substances are superficially quite similar.

Yea the powder I use to get smelled thick of vinegar too. To the point 3 or 4 grams I was worried in car.

When it stopped smelling - that was basically fent coming in

 

[4DQSAR]

^ Pyeyzolam tough to source for most ppl -- ethanol, who couldn't. If you live in a GBL country may as well do that and get the paperwork -- and do w/e you need to legally or w/e lol.

Thus supply and demand play out. Being LEGAL, anyone can have a Chinese 'fine chemical company' make a 1 Kg or 10 or 100Kg for that matter.

You can buy small samples FROM ligand suppliers which offers a level of 'try before you buy'. Heck, ask them for scale - it it's legal.

 

[Syntherize]

Are you sure this isn't just your standard Afghan / Pakistan brown? That can also smell.

I've never heard this before from anybody in Germany or Southern Europe.

Seems highly unusual that something almost completely synthesised in Mexico would surface in Germany, where the Turks largely control the trade and they sell the usual brown freebase.

If you do happen to be wrong, don't worry because the substances are superficially quite similar.

I’ve never had true “black tar” on the east coast in the USA, but I have had different varieties of #4 H such as: pure white (not fentanyl), tan, and brown. The only type of tar that I’ve tried several times was this darker brown chunky and dense stuff that was very pungent with the reminiscent scent of vinegar, but it was still #4 since it was always water soluble. I’ve never seen #3 H freebase in the USA and I’ve been doing opioids on and off since the year 2000 lol

P.S. Real west coast black tar from what my friends told me is more like a dark asphalt block that must be cooked down with water to get it into solution (no ascorbic acid [vitamin C) needed). Supposedly, it feels good, but black tar will destroy your veins over time if you IV it due to all the impurities.