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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards

Kratom (Mitragynine;7-hydroxymitraginine) Dose convrsion[s

I had a friend die a week ago from an OD on 7 oh and alcohol. He was a major user and alcoholic. I'd presume he probably did over a gram of 7 oh followed by two bottles. I'll miss him forever.
There's been a lot of talk about laced 7oh products going around, even more likely if he was buying from a shady cheap vendor online like many do or heads hop tabs but good lord at a gram a day I hope it wasn't from a headshop bc I know exactly how expensive that habit would be lol
 
7-OH is not 10-14 times stronger than Morphine in PO (oral). 7-OH is not even as strong as Oxycodone.

Where 7-OH "shines" is it's Affinity for mu-receptors. It works quickly but the effects wear off quickly.

Converting 7-OH to the MME scale is difficult. Yes the affinity aspect helps establish it's foot in the door but in order to sustain an "opioid tolerant" patient for 24hrs it requires a lot more when compared of morphine, oxycodone, etc.

A 7-OH tolerance and dependency increases faster than anything I have even taken. It gets to the point where 700mg of 7-OH does not even produce a noticable effect. If someone took 700mg of morphine or oxycodone and was "opioid dependent" they would absolutely feel that for decades to come.

7-OH has it's place as the 1st opioid dose of the day for the dependent/tolerant. It has a place as a alternative to people that cannot tolerate normal opiates/opioids. But 7-OH in an IR formula is the worst choice for someone completely dependent on opioids. It is not build like real opioids.
700mg of Oxy would kill most opiod users.
It is 1.5 times as strong as morphine. It feels a lot better and hits deep pain better.
1+ gram of morphine would be felt for decades to come?


They would be dead. Unless they had a huge fentanyl addiction. Or were an elephant.
 
Not physically possible, your friend wasn't just doing 7oh, or he got laced shit and didn't know. 7oh doesn't cause real respiratory depression even when combined with alcohol. I'm not saying it's smart to do so but it wouldn't cause an OD especially if he's at the point of doing a gram of 7 a day but I'm sorry for your loss.
I've also mixed 7 oh and alcohol and it's never stricken me as particularly dangerous though it is worth noting that 7 oh causes very minimal respiratory depression or suppression, at least for me and some reports online though it is negligible. I'd like to state that I personally think it was alcohol toxicity that killed him and that 7 oh very much so encouraged him to drink so much so fast that night and that it probably dehydrated the shit out of him.
 
There's been a lot of talk about laced 7oh products going around, even more likely if he was buying from a shady cheap vendor online like many do or heads hop tabs but good lord at a gram a day I hope it wasn't from a headshop bc I know exactly how expensive that habit would be lol
It was online. He told me the site he used but I forgot and he deleted that social media account. I get mine from another site and I "rarely" use it
 
I've also mixed 7 oh and alcohol and it's never stricken me as particularly dangerous though it is worth noting that 7 oh causes very minimal respiratory depression or suppression, at least for me and some reports online though it is negligible. I'd like to state that I personally think it was alcohol toxicity that killed him and that 7 oh very much so encouraged him to drink so much so fast that night and that it probably dehydrated the shit out of him.
That's far more likely, 7oh is EXTREMELY dehydrating imo but again still sad to hear, tough loosing people
 
This is true, I recently just noticed this how I wake up more thirsty than usual.
Ya 7 gives me the worst morning mouth, also gives me EXTREME night sweats like waking up every hour just to change shirts type of sweats, I don't even get em this bad in withdrawal it's crazy. I'm gonna order some mgm and see if that'll at least let me get a full night's sleep without waking up fifteen times
 
Ya 7 gives me the worst morning mouth, also gives me EXTREME night sweats like waking up every hour just to change shirts type of sweats, I don't even get em this bad in withdrawal it's crazy. I'm gonna order some mgm and see if that'll at least let me get a full night's sleep without waking up fifteen times
I don't get sweats, I use to get that when I was a heavy drinker. I would get so wet at first I thought I was pissing myself and it was soaking my clothes but my underwear wouldn't be wet.
 
I don't get sweats, I use to get that when I was a heavy drinker. I would get so wet at first I thought I was pissing myself and it was soaking my clothes but my underwear wouldn't be wet.
Ya same shit, wake up freezing with my clothes absolutely glued to me, the worst is waking up every hour though and the anxiety
 
In my state 7oh is now banned but they are selling pseudoindoxyl now and pseudoindoxyl with mit. I’ve only tried the pseudoindoxyl by itself. I did two 3 packs with a week in between each pack. So yea, It comes with 3 tabs in the pack. Both times I got threw up a couple hours after dosing first pill. I then would only take half a pill from then on. 7oh never made me nod but this stuff did. I made the 3 pills last 2 and half days bc I was on meth, adderall and bromazolam so I didn’t feel the need to redose so much. It’s been a week since I used any and I took two silver top viva zens with 2mg of clonazepam and didn’t feel anything. Next I’m gonna try the pseudo plus mit by itself and see how that goes. I’m gonna wait a few more days before I touch any drug though. I’m not trying to go back to rehab or have to be on subs. Subs sucked the life outta me.
 
I'm just gonna parrot my usual bullshit, as I feel any thread about Kratom extract products like this should feature a disclaimer at the top of the page.

These companies are unscrupulous individuals. We are living in an atmosphere in which companies who make money are less and less likely to be prosecuted or even looked into, especially if their "politics" i.e. campaign contributions i.e. bribes are correct. This is a tale as old as the CSA 1973.

They are going to put whatever into those tablets they need to put in to enable them to make a profit. If I'm profiling the person who would start trading in Kratom Extracts, the CEO is indeed the type of person to throw his cards on the table, put bad shit in the drugs and just set it and forget it until he gets the word to flee the country. Come to think of it, they probably are already in a non-extradition country.

I see no good way with this stuff, especially if the dosages are so unreliable. How can you ever make anything resembling a rational decision about your intake? You can't. The whole process becomes completely random, or worse yet, derives entirely from a person's own biological clock telling them when they "need a bit more".

It was hard enough doing this in Massachusetts with Heroin, in which I'd say, long, long-term, the potency of the supply where I lived could change ~25% from one day to the next from the same gang. I say long-term because, yes, a couple times a year, you would buy dope that was clearly over-cut and likewise clearly under-cut, resulting in pissed off junkies and dead junkies respectively.

I don't even want to speculate upon how different different batches of this shit could be. I'll let you do the mentals on this one, knowing the people selling you this product were likely raised during the height of the most recent Opioid Epidemic starting in ~94', saw friends and family suffer, be forgotten to the streets and/or die from Opioids. I know this fact wasn't well-known until recently, but if you had any fully-literate dumbass doing your market research, they would likely put 2 and 2 together and arrive at the conclusion that Kratom was likely an Opioid or otherise extremely similar. They knew exactly who their target market was (addicts in remission, older folks with aches and pains, chronic pain patients disavowed by their treatment programs etc.)

So, these people knowingly targeted some of our most vulnerable people for money. If Purdue Pharma was the Lion and the American people were a deaf Gazelle, what exactly does that make these people? I suppose it makes them the hyenas that then come along to eat the unwanted parts of the Gazelle, ass-first. Even the other predators were looking sideways at the Lion, thinking "man, I just don't know if this is civilized behavior".

Nobody has a Blue's Clue what is in one batch to the next prior to them being professionally tested and even then, who knows what the quality control is like. Well, I bet it's pretty bad.
 
That's far more likely, 7oh is EXTREMELY dehydrating imo but again still sad to hear, tough loosing people
This is out of my ass, but I am really adept at telling if I have a high or low blood pressure, I could tell that 7 oh and methadone were slightly seritonergic before even looking it up and I'm pretty sure I can tell when I'm sober when I have more serotonin or norepinephrine in my brain etc. With this same ass knowledge I possess, I'm pretty surecthat 7 oh is more neurotoxic thsn nicotine and most other substances (nothing like cocaine or excessive molly) but apparently opioid aren't particularly neutotoxic besides the things that generic addiction does that's bad for your brain and lack of oxygen if you sleep with a shallow breath. Maybe it's dehydration but im pretty sure it's neutotoxic beyond that. Sorry I wrote this in a hurry cuz im with frenz and super stoned and relapsed on perc so I know its a bit weird to read and comprehend my bad. Im basically saying I'm sure of myself that 7 oh is particularly neurotoxic.
 
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This is out of my ass, but I am really adept at telling if I have a high or low blood pressure, I could tell that 7 oh and methadone were slightly seritonergic before even looking it up and I'm pretty sure I can tell when I'm sober when I have more serotonin or norepinephrine in my brain etc. With this same ass knowledge I possess, I'm pretty surecthat 7 oh is more neurotoxic thsn nicotine and most other substances (nothing like cocaine or excessive molly) but apparently opioid aren't particularly neutotoxic besides the things that generic addiction does that's bad for your brain and lack of oxygen if you sleep with a shallow breath. Maybe it's dehydration but im pretty sure it's neutotoxic beyond that. Sorry I wrote this in a hurry cuz im with frenz and super stoned and relapsed on perc so I know its a bit weird to read and comprehend my bad. Im basically saying I'm sure of myself that 7 oh is particularly neurotoxic.
I thought it was pretty obvious info that 7oh had adrenic and serotonigenic actions, that's why it leaves you with such bad anxiety and depression only an hour after the dose wears off, it basically gives me a mini stim crash and then you get into the side effects like bad blood flow, numbness of limbs and other extreme ties. I kinda figured before even trying it just bc it's a kratom alk. I could see it being neurotoxoc but Im more inclined to belive irs not all that toxic and it's more so the left over solvents and shit in tabs particularly but cheap powder as well. I noticed a huge decline in negative symptoms once I found a quality powder vendor
 
It's a good idea to open a thread like that, there is indeed a lot to discover.

The situation in the US with opioids is pretty fucked up and I won't say much since i never had this xylafent soup BUT I went through all the other opiates and a decade of addiction before finding peace and stability in this plant.

I switched to kratom around 3 years ago, and it was a damn life saver. My situation is particular, I used buprenorphine before having brown heroin and lived in a country where codeine was OTC until 2016 or 2018 dunno exactly. Raw opium was available too. The docs scripted anything from codeine to methadone.

I've been addicted to buprenorphine, then went on heroin, then methadone, then went to morphine that I ended up injecting for too long. I am clean from hard opiates and needles it has been more than 4 years. I had to go somewhere further where drugs and needles are not everywhere and even from a 80mg methadone + 600mg morphine IV + downers daily habit, I took the plane and put dozens of thousands of kilometers from me and the troubles.

Needless to say, it was incredibly painful. Beyond words. I went down from oral methadone to morphine to tramadol to codeine pills and syrup in a year . Thats when I got my hands on Kratom powder.

So yeah I got a bit of vision on other opioids before going into kratom, a plant that truly set me free from going to the pharmacies or dealers every day dealing with the looks and also all the money. At first I had no idea on how to dose it, I took too much it felt like I took too much coffee. Anyway it got me off the codeine quite easily.

I became a lot more functionnal, waking up, doing more things cleaning eating, going out. I ended up finding good dosage which was 5 grams 2 or 3 times a day yet less is more .

Feeling better with my body, healthier, clear headed and just FREE.

For me it's harder to get kratom than all the other opiates/opioids, so I had to go trhough times of no kratom. At first I switched to codeine / tram too afraid of wd but eventually discovered that kratom wds are more mental than physical. I would have some time feeling a bit down, a bit depressed and energyless but NOTHING compare to even the weakesst of opiates like codeine. This plant just feels cleaner, lighter and truly medicinal. It saves my life everyday and keeps me from using stronger drugs. I can focus on other things and overall feel so much better since I use it. I am not saying there is no wd, but it is nothing compare to quit even codeine let alone buprenorphine that for me was the hardest.

This plant is a miracle for me, and this 7-OH thing and all the analogs are very dangerous for it. Can we for once let the plant alone instead of tweaking it up to make it dangerous to all those first timers ? Why western countries keep messing up with plants and take out their soul to make it a hard drug ?

Is it a developped behaviour, the need to fuck up the nature all the time ? is it gonna be like opium because we gonna make heroin from it ? Look at cannabis with all the extracts and shit kids are losing their minds we gonna see the consequences on the new generations... It is just sad, while I am all for the research and everything, all I see is people profiting from a sacred plant to make really addictive substances without any consideration for its users... Is it a plot so everybody dies to xylatranqfent ? Because at this pace it is a matter of time before it gets banned.
I may have missed it, but how much Kratom do you take?
 
Thanks. I was at 5 but went down to 3 or less. I get a runny nose. Tonight I am taking a little 7O but I keep that use rare.
Hold in you'll be alright ! I don't know 7-oh but it seems more potent, there is cross tolerance too.. take care
 
Hold in you'll be alright ! I don't know 7-oh but it seems more potent, there is cross tolerance too.. take care
I kind of partied tonight. It was Saturday. Over a 90 minute period I took 2.4 grams of Kratom, 12 mg of 7O, 1 Mexican fent, and 1 30 mg Oxy.

I felt great. I know I can only do something like tis once a week.
 
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