EADD Heroin thread v.XXV -- a quarter centuary of threads if not yet a full decade since the 'drought'...

[Zopiclone bandit]

2:39 #Truth

 

[OcCo]

Yep, cos brown no3 has heroin, and traces of 3MAM, 6MAM, morphine, codeine, and usually a bit of paracetamol for flavour.
More of a warm, less clinical high.

Is the paracetamol for flavour?
Years ago when I was involved in repressing bricks we bought barrels of APAP as when placed in the oven it'd look like heroin then when smashed up it was the same colour and also run so was a perfect cut.

 

[Perkins : Reborn]

For the first time in my life I can't even remember how long it is since I last scored. Could be three years or more. It helps not living in the flat above a hardened addict with multiple numbers memorised; not saved on a phone, but memorised. It was easier to score than it was to get a pizza.

But I still think about it every day, and probably always will. Just can't be dealing with the social scene that surrounds it all, nor the messing about looking for cars in sketchy alleyways. Not to mention the very good chance that the plastic you're handling / swallowing has spent a fair old time in some scally's rectum.

 

[brimz]

I've got many things I wanna say and ask you my opiate concusiers.
But 4 now I just want to know if the legendary Blondin Scale is still in use .
That was probably the best thing to come from Heroin going extinct well 2010 ifyn yn
Luv to Irish crew Midlands I remember u if u member me . Donnie Manchester. All you I hope yer happy. Papersom wys . DarkMark safe bro . Papaversom everyone that is still on it got off it we all been places that shouldn't exist. Breakdown fiend kktastik

 

[DrPetro]

@4DQSAR "Just make it all legal and have the DEA or whoever as the experts who check the licenced reailers so people ARE informed. At the end of the day, I suspect most people join the DEA because they truly believe they can save lives but after decades of service, they know it not to be true but they still have families to provide for. So any solution must ensure that nobody gets their rice bowl broken. I don't think that pragmatic, I see it as the best solution."

Have you ever heard of LEAP? Its law enforcement folk, often retired for practical reasons about speaking openly. They basically are calling time,or trying to, on the War on Drugs/Drug users. https://lawenforcementactionpartnership.org/
And yes, you're also right about many folk preferring Afghan brown with some morphine and derivatives . Ive smoked and snorted White No4 in Cambodia but I've never shot it. I reckon that the morphine in afghan brown varies-sometimes its very spiky/tingly-histamine reaction to morphine

 

[4DQSAR]

@DrPedro - I thank you for that insight. My reasoning is that when imported to Europe, EMCDDA data states that the mean purity is 78%. But I don't think for one moment anyone would smuggle cut, thuse that 78% is the HEROIN i.e. 3,6-diacetyl morphine and after reading how it's made, I concluded that the rest was likely to be 3-monoacetyl morphine, 6-monoacetyl morphine and plain morphine... and maybe small amounts of other alkaloids. But that's a hypothesis without evidence and what people here provide is unstructured case reports i.e. evidence.

I am aware of LEAP but thought they were pro-HR but I didn't know they actually called for all drugs to be made legal. I'm just listening to the former police captain who is spearheading the legalization of drugs. He's right. It's not the drugs per se that kills so many, it's the associated harms - one of them being impure, misrepresented and badly packaged drugs. He forgot to add that drugs can then be taxed (minor point) or who would enforce the legal sale of drugs, and I honestly think the valuable institutional knowledge within the DEA makes them the people to do the job. About 10,000 staff so average of 200 per state? There WOULD be a job for them all.

 

[Zopiclone bandit]

I've got many things I wanna say and ask you my opiate concusiers.
But 4 now I just want to know if the legendary Blondin Scale is still in use .
That was probably the best thing to come from Heroin going extinct well 2010 ifyn yn
Luv to Irish crew Midlands I remember u if u member me . Donnie Manchester. All you I hope yer happy. Papersom wys . DarkMark safe bro . Papaversom everyone that is still on it got off it we all been places that shouldn't exist. Breakdown fiend kktastik

He has returned, this isn't Easter folks!!!!!!!

 

[Zopiclone bandit]

. Just can't be dealing with the social scene that surrounds it all, nor the messing about looking for cars in sketchy alleyways. Not to mention the very good chance that the plastic you're handling / swallowing has spent a fair old time in some scally's rectum.

 

[DrPetro]

For the first time in my life I can't even remember how long it is since I last scored. Could be three years or more. It helps not living in the flat above a hardened addict with multiple numbers memorised; not saved on a phone, but memorised. It was easier to score than it was to get a pizza.

But I still think about it every day, and probably always will. Just can't be dealing with the social scene that surrounds it all, nor the messing about looking for cars in sketchy alleyways. Not to mention the very good chance that the plastic you're handling / swallowing has spent a fair old time in some scally's rectum.

Well done ! I'm an old timer whos been scripted one way or the other for decades but I was a late starter. Anyway, Im with you re the dodgy social scene. I only have one number these days and they deliver but just swapped to a blocking dose of bupe. I was laughing about dope packages that have been "stashed" .

 

[Zopiclone bandit]

Anyone heard of or tried something called Etonitazene before?

 

[4DQSAR]

Etonitazene is listed in the UNODC document on controlled drugs to which China is a signatory. So I assume the Chinese wouldn't make it.

It does find limited use in research. Because it's around x1500 M in animal models, an active dose is tasteless so it avoids any bias introduced by the model recognizing the active.

Even then it's a bit unclear if that value is accurate since it only gives you the ANALGESIC equivalency when patentheral administration is used.

Long ago I did find a small Russian (?) study where they trialled it as an alternative to methadone and if memory serves, orally, in man, it was reckoned to be more like x60 M.

But I say again, we really have so little data. Nobody has studied the stuff. All we know is that the very first clandestine synthesis was by a Morton Thiakol chemist who put it into a nasel spray and from the accounts I read, he was taking a hit every 20 minutes. Sad story. He was found out (obviously) and no amount of any prescribable opioid would stop the immense AWS and he took his own life.

I've mentioned elsewhere that their is some evidence that etonitazene is a SUPERagonist. So it may be a one-way street as methadone won't stop the AWS. Really dangerous. But when it is finally contolled, the Chinese will, I'm certain, have the next one lined up - one we know even less about.

 

[Zopiclone bandit]

Thousands of opioid deaths missed off official figures

The error - affecting England and Wales - raises concerns about the impact on the government's approach to drug deaths.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Zopiclone bandit]

He was found out (obviously) and no amount of any prescribable opioid would stop the immense AWS and he took his own life.

I am not shocked to read this sadly.

But I say again, we really have so little data. Nobody has studied the stuff.

I have no question to think what you say is wrong, I believe you 100% as over time you have proven you speak truth.
I am NO Chemist etc, I ask this due to my total lack of knowledge so please keep this in mind.

Can you see any way how in a Lab it may be mistaken for Fentanyl?

I have to be very careful in what I say but MAYBE if it turned up in a large UK batch of Heroin how would that be possible? if such little data is out there online about this stuff how could a Heroin dealer in the arse-end of Birmingham end up with this stuff in his Heroin?

100% Serious thanks for the reply to this my brother, I am not going into details but this stuff is out there & on the streets of the UK right now in parts of The West Mids, Wales, Manchester & possibly other parts but I known 100% the areas I listed have what is being called & sold as "heroin" with this stuff in it & who knows what kind of dose it is.

You have any idea what the L.D. 50> rate / level is on this stuff?

 

[Zopiclone bandit]

So it may be a one-way street as methadone won't stop the AWS. Really dangerous.

Someone said to someone else I maybe kind of know from just the feeling of the "Heroin" that whatever it is they were using was dangerous, it just felt "bad" & not quite like the Heroin feeling I Know so well.

 

[ageingpartyfiend]

@Zopiclone bandit I'm no chemist either but I can't see Wedinos (if thats what you refer to) mistaking that for Fent, or for anything really

When they do make mistakes (2% of the time max I'd say) it always looks like clear cross contamination type scenario. Like someone will have something totally stupid in their drug.

If you want clarity send some more in (or get whoever to, etc), and please be careful man (shudders)

 

[4DQSAR]

Someone said to someone else I maybe kind of know from just the feeling of the "Heroin" that whatever it is they were using was dangerous, it just felt "bad" & not quite like the Heroin feeling I Know so well.

I've never injected a drug. I don't have a huge phobia about needles but I understand how it bypasses all manner of defences the body uses to prevent toxins circulating through the body.

But I have heard many injecting drug users mention that some IV drugs produce transtory taste perversion and recently a BLer posted a trip report on isonitazene (but who really knows what it was?) and they mentioned that there was taste perversion.

It's important to remember that all such reports are by definition subjective. So if someone has a prejudice* that a drug might be misrepresented, there is a bias or maybe expectation is a better term, but as I have noted elsewhere, the placebo effect has been researched to the point where people reported more improvement when prescribed two pills of placebo compared to one. We learnt how important expectations are in outcomes.

So who knows? If the compound was tested, it's still possible that a highly potent opioid may not be detected, but not super likely.

*I am in no way denerating ANYONE. We all carry around prejudices on all manner of subjects. I felt the need to add this because more than once someone has accused me of attacking them merely because they don't really know the definition of the word. It's a morally neutral term.

 

[ageingpartyfiend]

if you @Zopiclone bandit or others want a full % breakdown of substance look into EnergyControl lab in Spain. It costs some £ though.

You'd imagine that a double Wedinos test would be reasonably conclusive too though, although as we know they do not provide a %

 

[Zopiclone bandit]

*I am in no way denerating ANYONE. We all carry around prejudices on all manner of subjects. I felt the need to add this because more than once someone has accused me of attacking them merely because they don't really know the definition of the word. It's a morally neutral term.

You are in a very small few percent who use BL Forum & everything I seen you post & comment upon has never had a tone of prejudice(s) to it.
It will come as a shock to you but I got lots of time for you & I have a deep respect for the knowledge you have on both RC's & the more usual street stuff you can score.

Take no fucking notice if someone calls you a bullshit artist, a cunt or you know fuck all, they clearly haven't read any of the stuff you post.
I have told my "Hindu" Aghori Guru about you, that is a RARE thing.

 

[Zopiclone bandit]

@Zopiclone bandit I'm no chemist either but I can't see Wedinos (if thats what you refer to) mistaking that for Fent, or for anything really

When they do make mistakes (2% of the time max I'd say) it always looks like clear cross contamination type scenario. Like someone will have something totally stupid in their drug.

If you want clarity send some more in (or get whoever to, etc), and please be careful man (shudders)

Sorry Old Man but you still gotta wait BEFORE you get the chance for this one, I am not checking out yet.

 

[Bleaney]

@Zopiclone bandit I'm no chemist either but I can't see Wedinos (if thats what you refer to) mistaking that for Fent, or for anything really

When they do make mistakes (2% of the time max I'd say) it always looks like clear cross contamination type scenario. Like someone will have something totally stupid in their drug.

If you want clarity send some more in (or get whoever to, etc), and please be careful man (shudders)

@Zopiclone bandit On second thoughts I agree with APF about the Wedinos error rate. It is very difficult to estimate, when basing it on own your personal experience alone. I suspect APF is basing it on a wider circle of people that have used the service, and is therefore more likely to have a more accurate error rate, than my estimate of less than 10%. Which I would now take back, and agree with the 2%.

The bottom line is they provide an excellent and free service, and they are right the vast majority of the time. It seems the odd error here and there is easy to spot, as it's just so out of place. Like that example I had of nicotine or caffeine supposedly being in my benzos. It just seemed obviously wrong.

I really would hate to put you, or anyone you know, off using them, as I'd imagine if you sent off a few samples of different gear, and saw what each one actually contained after testing, you might be able to develop a taste or sense as to what each batch actually is, according to it's appearance, and smell, and how it runs etc....

It could save your life one day, for example if you'd had a previous batch tested as containing fent or nitazenes as the primary ingredient, and then any new batches that were along the same lines, you'd possibly know. Without needing a further test.

I'm not 100% sure if I'm right about that though, but it makes sense to me that once you've had certain things tested as kosher, or for containing something else, then you will have that as a future reference point, and may be able to tell by the appearance, taste, smell, effects, how it runs etc...

It's generally served me well with benzos, knowing what the genuine ones are supposed to look and taste like.