Opioids Withdrawal question

[willbec1]

Hey everyone. Long time lurker first time poster.

I am looking to get off of opioids completely and wondering what I am in for. As a background, I have had chronic pain for a long time (I’m 38 now and have had chronic back pain for at least 15 years.) Being young doctors were never willing to prescribe anything but gabapentin.

However, my dad has always been prescribed pain meds. Started with Nucynta then Oxy 10mg IR and now 30mg Morphine ER.

I’ve always taken some of what he has had. Hated the nucynta. Absolutely loved the OXY but sadly he was switched to morphine a few years ago.

I never went TOO crazy with them. Prob took 15mg of oxy every day for the few years he had them. And now take one 30mg Morphine everyday. (I also have a friend who can get me 35-40 10mg Hydrocodone a month that usually last me ~10 days).

I have gone days-1week where I haven’t taken anything over the years and have dealt with the withdrawals. (Bad mood, restless leg, insomnia). But I have never gone more than a week or so. I want to get off of all of them completely.

Iam wondering how long the withdrawal symptoms last beyond the few days-week of feeling like crap. Like is that all it will be? Will I feel other symptoms in the following weeks/months?

Sorry for the long winded post and appreciate the help.

 

[willbec1]

anybody? Don’t wana go at this and not know what to expect. And would it be better to cold turkey or try to titrste off

 

[pixies+]

hang tight hey?
you’ll get your questions answered.
I understand how scary this feels.
But You’re not alone. And you absolutely can get through this.

 

[badknee]

Hey everyone. Long time lurker first time poster.

I am looking to get off of opioids completely and wondering what I am in for. As a background, I have had chronic pain for a long time (I’m 38 now and have had chronic back pain for at least 15 years.) Being young doctors were never willing to prescribe anything but gabapentin.

However, my dad has always been prescribed pain meds. Started with Nucynta then Oxy 10mg IR and now 30mg Morphine ER.

I’ve always taken some of what he has had. Hated the nucynta. Absolutely loved the OXY but sadly he was switched to morphine a few years ago.

I never went TOO crazy with them. Prob took 15mg of oxy every day for the few years he had them. And now take one 30mg Morphine everyday. (I also have a friend who can get me 35-40 10mg Hydrocodone a month that usually last me ~10 days).

I have gone days-1week where I haven’t taken anything over the years and have dealt with the withdrawals. (Bad mood, restless leg, insomnia). But I have never gone more than a week or so. I want to get off of all of them completely.

Iam wondering how long the withdrawal symptoms last beyond the few days-week of feeling like crap. Like is that all it will be? Will I feel other symptoms in the following weeks/months?

Sorry for the long winded post and appreciate the help.

First I will let you know that I’m a sensitive person, a sissy.

Most of my withdrawals are from buprenorphine, either long term or short term as aid coming off more traditional opioids. So if you’ve been using more short acting opioids you might have less trouble since you already know the acute symtoms during the first week.

But since you’ve been using for a long time, my guess that you might have the following scenario:

Day 1-12 semi acute withdrawal, anxiety, restless legs, trouble sleeping, diarrhea.

Day 12-30 restless legs are a little better, probably more hours of sleep, anxiety, but also moments of positive thoughts, time goes extremely slow. Diarrhea remains, maybe a little better. I remember feeling a bit hopeless during this period. Struggle with thoughts on giving up and just take a small amount, just to feel human for a couple of hours. Don’t give in, it’s so hard to get back where you were.

Day 30-60 positive thoughts, music sounds good, movies engage. Very lethargic, a feeling that it almost gotten worse than previous two weeks. Still diarrhea, maybe a little better. The biggest problem is the lethargy, even brushing the teeth is big task. Slowly some hours of misery are replaced by feeling okay. Still an urge to do some more, but also easier to resist since one’s afraid to start all over again.

If I would have had opioids at home during this time or could get them easy, I would not hesitate and relapse.

many speaks about PAWS as a fact. But that never happened to me. Sure I had som weeks as long as six months later where depression returned, but it went away sometimes after a couple of days or two weeks. But I would say that you’re not totally fine the first 6-9 months, but you’re feel comfortable I your body most of the time.

I’m sure I missed som stuff, but this is what I could remember now.

I have always used zopiclone for the sleep day 1-30. It helps a lot. But everyone is different of course, but I suspect one’s weak sides get exaggerated during withdrawal, whether it’s back pain or trouble sleeping.

 

[Allylbenzene]

And would it be better to cold turkey or try to titrste off

You can slowly taper/titrate off using these OTC items. They'll reduce withdrawals and help the overall process:

• Theanine
  - stops stress response, anti-anxiety, anti-insomnia, repairs dopaminergic system (GDNF)
• Agmatine
  - fast-acting antidepressant, anti-stress, anti-adrenaline, endogenous opioid release, boosts dopamine, prevents tolerance, potentiates other drugs, NMDA antagonist
• Magnolol & Honokiol
  - potent anti-anxiety, antidepressant, anti-stress, potentiates opioids, anti-insomnia
• Rhodiola rosea (adaptogen, all-around support, boosts dopamine, anti-stress)
• Thymoquinone (pro-opioid effects, prevents opioid tolerance/withdrawals)
• Curcumin (prevents opioid tolerance, dependence, and withdrawal, potentiates opioids)
• Eugenol (direct opioid effects, prevents tolerance)
• Linalool (direct opioid effects, reduces opioid tolerance & dependence, anti-anxeity)
• Creatine (anti-depressant, reduces opioid withdrawals)

Opioids that work directly and indirectly:

• Caryophyllene (antidepressant, potentiates opioids, prevent opioid tolerance)
• Cannabigerol (endogenous opioids, enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, antidepressant, anti-stress)
• Myrrh (delta-opioid agonist: curzerene, furanoeudesma-1,3-diene)
• Menthol (direct opioid, enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, boosts GABA)
• Vanillin (endogenous opioids, antidepressant)
• Myrcene (enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, potentiates opioids, sedative)
• alpha-pinene (direct opioid effects @ mu-opioid receptor, anti-stress)

I've mentioned these things in other threads with relevant papers on their biological effects.

The other side to this appoach is restoring the body's natural ability to self-regulate.
This is achieved by restoring proper thyroid function and mitochondria (see this post on what they are and why they're worth repairing)

• Vitamin B1 (via B-complex)
• Niacinamide (50-100mg, with meals)
• Low dose aspirin (81-100mg max per day, why aspirin?)
• L-Phenylalanine (300-500mg, daily)
• Creatine (1g daily)
• CoQ10
• Ribose
• Inosine
• Coffee (+ honey + theanine) - why honey? this post explains how to use it sustainably to avoid negative-reactions (shakes, jitters, anxiety)
  

  The caffeine in coffee is powerful and can act like thyroid to increase your metabolic rate and the oxidation of sugar, making it a health-protective food.
  Symptoms to expect when you do coffee right are calmness, focus, motivation, warmth, and stable energy.

 

[willbec1]

Thanks BadKnee. These timelines are pretty scary thinking about having two kids and a full time job.

I know my doses haven’t been too high compared to some other people. But do realize I have been taking them for a long time.

Do you guys think it’s better to try to taper off? Or should I just go cold turkey?

 

[dopamimetic]

Interesting that you get withdrawal from 30mg morphine. The lowest which I could feel were 60mg, 30 wouldn't do shit for me. I was as high as 600mg per day and know somebody who is on 1.2 fucking grams a day (prescription).
But yeah in general, dissociatives and specially memantine can do wonders for opioid withdrawal. I quit with memantine with little discomfort, didn't even need loperamide for diarrhea.

 

[willbec1]

Yeah it’s not too bad when I don’t take them for a few days. Insomnia and restless leg and just overall bad mood. (I also take about 35-40 10mg Hydrocodone per month that I get from a friend). And while all this isn’t a ton. I’ve been on this kind of level of opioids for like 7 years now. So I’m mainly just worried about how long I will feel shitty for if I were to just cold turkey.

Also if it matters I chew the MS Contin when I take them.

 

[ovo1024]

Yeah it’s not too bad when I don’t take them for a few days. Insomnia and restless leg and just overall bad mood. (I also take about 35-40 10mg Hydrocodone per month that I get from a friend). And while all this isn’t a ton. I’ve been on this kind of level of opioids for like 7 years now. So I’m mainly just worried about how long I will feel shitty for if I were to just cold turkey.

Also if it matters I chew the MS Contin when I take them.

Honestly bro, it won't be that bad. You're overthinking it. I have detoxed off of a decently high daily Fentanyl habit, and lemme tell you that was HELL. I had to do it cold turkey in jail. Also remember Fentanyl is like 100x stronger then morphine and those hydros you're taking.

 

[willbec1]

Yeah I’m not too worried about the “bad parts” or the withdrawl. I’m just worried about like how long after that I’m going to have the post acute withdrawl symptoms. (Since I have a family and a job). Withdrawing off Fent, in jail nonetheless must have been torture

 

[yubacity]

No need to go cold turkey why punish yourself .
Get yourself comfort meds best is pregabalin benzos or even gabapentin will help . My first wd was cold turkey and it was that don't need to be like that just don't jump addictions especially pregabalin or benzos the rattle on them is worse