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BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic
Opioids Buprenorphine vs. Kratom vs. Methadone
- Thread starter pnillyg
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- Jan 16, 2009
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I always thought kratom was a ladder up for someone who has been through the ringer with stronger opiates. But a step down in the wrong direction for someone who has not had their fill of stronger opiates.
Why? I have never had bupe, but had been on methadone about 3 times years ago. Methadone is a battle to get off but if you go slow it can work. But pn, you have a lot of variables going on. Just suggesting you keep your health in mind. Kratom is a baby to methadone. (talking plain leaf) I imagine the same for bupe. But if you are craving stronger opjates you may have to go though it if you have not had your fill. I notice these days people get on bupe for years. But if you are still at kratom level stay there and don't escalate. I say this as someone who is now a decade on katom. Just powder and working to get off. Although I have to admit it saved me this last few months. I was around a lot of pills and morphine and did not think about it because I had kratom. So kratom can be a help. But you have to decide which direction you are going. Methadone and bupe are heavy hitters. They may not be needed.
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- Jan 16, 2009
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Yeah man balance takes a little work. Whatever gives you balance. You have already been through the ringer. Stick with kratom. If you have to use opiates use some poppy products but still say stick to kratom.
I had a friend (RIP) that was really a baby when it came to dope withdrawal. But he was on methdaone, did a very very slow taper. Got down to 1/4 mg and jumped and had very little issue. That is rare. Bupe scares me too, seems like a f*cker to get off. I don't see many successful taper to abstinence threads.
I had a friend (RIP) that was really a baby when it came to dope withdrawal. But he was on methdaone, did a very very slow taper. Got down to 1/4 mg and jumped and had very little issue. That is rare. Bupe scares me too, seems like a f*cker to get off. I don't see many successful taper to abstinence threads.
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I support Kratom as a maintenance drug if it works. @JackARoe mentioned stability and that's the biggest flaw I see with using something like Kratom. In perfect conditions, I would have more confidence. We're not scientists in a lab, we are people with addictions. It is an extremely delicate procedure using these substances without losing control. First, Kratom is not standardized. Second, it's a powder. If someone is taking Opioids using a measuring spoon, even the minute differences from one scoop to another can play tricks on a person's mind. Maybe they don't feel good enough, maybe they think maybe that last spoonful wasn't quite a full spoonful, oh well, I took 8 spoonfuls, how big of a deal could a ninth spoonful be?
These are just examples. I think a lot of people reading this can probably relate to what I'm describing though. If a person is going to maintain this delicate balance for weeks, months, years, decades??? Being even a little bit off in one's approach is going to lead to going off the furrow given enough time. This is why I think you have to be using something that has a determined strength in preset dosage units. Kratom might even be superior to Methadone and/or Buprenorphine, I'm not sure. Because they are available and standardized, at least in the United States, this is the best you can hope for and live a truly stable life.
Comparing Buprenorphine and Methadone, they don't compare well side by side. Still, essentially Buprenorphine is weaker i.e. more appropriate for folks with smaller habits while Methadone is more powerful and thus better suited to people with larger habits.
To explain, I feel Buprenorphine was at its highest level of relevance during the Oxycontin days and somewhat less so during the Heroin days. People who were using ~240mg Oxycodone or maybe a gram of street Heroin per day could still have success with Buprenorphine. As Oxycodone and prescription Opioids died out, I saw less people getting benefit from Buprenorphine and more requiring Methadone. In the days of Fentanyl, Buprenorphine is pretty much useless except for folks in situations like yours @pnillyg
All of that being said, my advice is to try Buprenorphine first, see how you feel and if it's not enough, you can try Methadone.
These are just examples. I think a lot of people reading this can probably relate to what I'm describing though. If a person is going to maintain this delicate balance for weeks, months, years, decades??? Being even a little bit off in one's approach is going to lead to going off the furrow given enough time. This is why I think you have to be using something that has a determined strength in preset dosage units. Kratom might even be superior to Methadone and/or Buprenorphine, I'm not sure. Because they are available and standardized, at least in the United States, this is the best you can hope for and live a truly stable life.
Comparing Buprenorphine and Methadone, they don't compare well side by side. Still, essentially Buprenorphine is weaker i.e. more appropriate for folks with smaller habits while Methadone is more powerful and thus better suited to people with larger habits.
To explain, I feel Buprenorphine was at its highest level of relevance during the Oxycontin days and somewhat less so during the Heroin days. People who were using ~240mg Oxycodone or maybe a gram of street Heroin per day could still have success with Buprenorphine. As Oxycodone and prescription Opioids died out, I saw less people getting benefit from Buprenorphine and more requiring Methadone. In the days of Fentanyl, Buprenorphine is pretty much useless except for folks in situations like yours @pnillyg
All of that being said, my advice is to try Buprenorphine first, see how you feel and if it's not enough, you can try Methadone.
My issue is that i try to take kratom in 5g doses or less, 3 x per day max… but if i have a long day and im up late that can be 4 x per day and im wondering how to drop my dose slowly from a fairly inconsistent schedule… maybe i should be more regulated with my dosing as most the time i am but there are times when im loose with it
SuperPsych
Bluelighter
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- Apr 29, 2012
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I struggle with the same looseness. The thing that helped me was figuring out how long between doses before I start feeling the first tinge of withdrawal. For me that's around 4 hours. So I just set it in my mind that after I dose I can't dose again until 4 hours later. I even set a timer on my phone. Even if at the 4 hour mark I'm feeling fine I still take my dose. Sometimes I start feeling crappy at the 3 hour mark and I have to psych myself up to make it the last hour. Distracting myself at work or with video games at home makes the last hour not so bad.
The only time I'll alter that is if I'm going to bed around the 3 hr mark after my last dose. I'll then take my dose an hour early so I don't wake up one or two hours after falling asleep in withdrawal.
I like doing a standard time between doses instead of a strict number of doses per day because if I do have a long day, then I'm allowed however many doses I need.