Treatment Educate me on methadone / buprenorphine

[menidiatis]

Hi everyone. After suffering severe stress these last days due to the constant fear that eventually the day will come when I will not be able to get my dose and I am going to suffer withdrawals (mind you I have never crossed 15 hours without heroin, and the WDs were already so bad that the thought I might go days without H makes me actually consider suicide) I decided I am going to get on methadone for maintenance (since I have been informed that methadone treatment is an option in the Netherlands where I live)

For those who are / have been on methadone I have a few questions (please answer any one of them you want, of course no need to answer all):

1) What should I expect in terms of a "high"? Obviously I am not expecting any rush, but will methadone, in the appropriate equivalent dose (I currently smoke 3g a day of unknown purity heroin, certainly less than 50% if not much much less), give the same feeling of content and safety that heroin gives me? How does methadone feel in general?

2) Do I need to go through withdrawals intentionally before starting methadone (like with suboxone)? Or can I jump straight on it?

3) Do methadone clinics in general accept someone who wants to use this as maintenance rather than someone who wants to quit? I am in phase in life of severe stress and non existent support from other humans, so right now I don't want to taper, I just want to use enough to not have WDs and just have this feeling of content H gives me. Is this generally considered acceptable with methadone treatment, or in most cases you are forced to taper down to 0mg as fast as possible?

4) Is there any reason why I should consider suboxone instead of methadone?

5) Does methadone cause any long term problems other than what heroin causes? Ideally I would stay on maintenance for the next 5 years until I can put my life in place, and then of course I want to eventually quit opiates. I have been told methadone can drop my testosterone to very low levels. Any other things I should be concerned with?

6) Am I going to suffer some WDs when I am switching from heroin to methadone, or is methadone powerful to not suffer this?

Thank you everybody for your help. If there is anything else I need to know about methadone that I did not ask about, please let me know

 

[axe battler]

I am in the UK so YMMV.

1) Methadone will make you feel nice for the first few weeks/months of being on it depending on what dose you end up on. However the higher you go, the harder it will be to get off it. I know it seems like you wanna just stay on it forever, but I promise you, it will lose it's magic and just become a fucking hassle and you'll soon realise why they call it liquid handcuffs.

2) No. Although you may have to sit about on your first day of induction waiting for your first dose. They also slowly build your dose up so it may take a few days for you to be satisfied on your dose.

3) I suppose they would, but you don't necessarily have to tell them what your long term plans are.

4) I wish I wish I wish I'd stayed on subutex instead of going on methadone. Methadone does get you a little buzzed at first, but that doesn't last long. I only went on meth because bupe was making me sick. In hindsight I should have lowered my dose.

5) People complain a lot about weight gain, which I think is definitely a real problem. Being on methadone can make you lazy and sedintary. When on bupe I exercised a lot more.
People commonly complain about it fucking up their teeth. I haven't noticed this and I think it's mainly a lack of oral hygiene among severe addicts.
The testosterone thing may be real but I haven't noticed. This is also supposedly a symptom of any long term opiate use.

6) Methadone is very strong and a full opiate agonist. You may crave a more euphoric opiate, especially when first titrating, but you should be withdrawal free on about 50mg based on your 3g a day (smoked, not very good gear) habit.

It's better than being on gear. But I would go on low dose bupe or even better poppy tea and/or kratom if I could turn back time. The latter would mean no fucking around with doctors and pharmacies and a lot more freedom.

 

[menidiatis]

I am in the UK so YMMV.

1) Methadone will make you feel nice for the first few weeks/months of being on it depending on what dose you end up on. However the higher you go, the harder it will be to get off it. I know it seems like you wanna just stay on it forever, but I promise you, it will lose it's magic and just become a fucking hassle and you'll soon realise why they call it liquid handcuffs.

2) No. Although you may have to sit about on your first day of induction waiting for your first dose. They also slowly build your dose up so it may take a few days for you to be satisfied on your dose.

3) I suppose they would, but you don't necessarily have to tell them what your long term plans are.

4) I wish I wish I wish I'd stayed on subutex instead of going on methadone. Methadone does get you a little buzzed at first, but that doesn't last long. I only went on meth because bupe was making me sick. In hindsight I should have lowered my dose.

5) People complain a lot about weight gain, which I think is definitely a real problem. Being on methadone can make you lazy and sedintary. When on bupe I exercised a lot more.
People commonly complain about it fucking up their teeth. I haven't noticed this and I think it's mainly a lack of oral hygiene among severe addicts.
The testosterone thing may be real but I haven't noticed. This is also supposedly a symptom of any long term opiate use.

6) Methadone is very strong and a full opiate agonist. You may crave a more euphoric opiate, especially when first titrating, but you should be withdrawal free on about 50mg based on your 3g a day (smoked, not very good gear) habit.

It's better than being on gear. But I would go on low dose bupe or even better poppy tea and/or kratom if I could turn back time. The latter would mean no fucking around with doctors and pharmacies and a lot more freedom.

Hi @axe battler thank you so so much for your detailed answer, I am going through severe stress these days and any help is invaluable, it calms me down so much

I have some questions that come to me now from your answer if you could please help me with these as well I would be infinitely grateful

1) when you say it will lose its magic, do you mean that eventually I will start getting WDs even on methadone? It is OK for me to not get buzzed anymore, I just don't want to have WDs. Can methadone guarantee that for me?

4) do you mean that subutex was making you sick because your dose was too high? And you could have tapered instead your dose to a lower one were you would not get sick?

Some new questions for you or anyone who can answer:

1) is it sensible to start already tapering my heroin dose as much as it is possible? Meaning, will it make my jump on methadone easier?

2) after they titrate my dose where I do not have WDs, then is it possible to progressively taper down on the methadone itself, until I get on a dose as low as possible?

3)is it maybe a better idea just to taper my H use to the maximum possible, and then go on subuxone instead?

I only wish to be free of the withdrawals, I don't care about being high anymore. In that sense, what is the better option, subuxone or methadone?

Thank you so so much

 

[axe battler]

1) I just mean you'll not feel buzzed. You won't get withdrawal as methadone lasts more than 24h in most people. Most can skip a day and barely notice, especially after being on a high dose for a while.
4?) I think that's what it was. I was on 12mg daily for 6 months and for the last month I started feeling ill an hour or 2 after my dose. I think tapering down would have helped but who knows.

1) I suppose it would help you cope with a lower dose of methadone which is a good thing.
2) Absolutely.
3) I think so, especially if you just want to be stable and do t care about getting high anymore. I must admit when I was getting on methadone I was looking forward to being on a full opiate again, but yeah the honeymoon don't last long. Bupe is a better medication IMO.

 

[cdin]

ill chime in here and just say -- i've always gone the route of tapering with a medium length agonist (OC, morphine, hydrocodone, something) because the withdrawals if you do ever want to get off methadone or subs are protracted and more difficult to deal with than a shorter acting agonist. It is more difficult to deal with a taper with multiple doses a day, all depends on how involved you want to be/how you want to do it.

no matter what though, you have to be resolved that you're dealin w stuff be ok with not being high, because you will not be high as you taper any mu agent.

 

[menidiatis]

1) I just mean you'll not feel buzzed. You won't get withdrawal as methadone lasts more than 24h in most people. Most can skip a day and barely notice, especially after being on a high dose for a while.
4?) I think that's what it was. I was on 12mg daily for 6 months and for the last month I started feeling ill an hour or 2 after my dose. I think tapering down would have helped but who knows.

1) I suppose it would help you cope with a lower dose of methadone which is a good thing.
2) Absolutely.
3) I think so, especially if you just want to be stable and do t care about getting high anymore. I must admit when I was getting on methadone I was looking forward to being on a full opiate again, but yeah the honeymoon don't last long. Bupe is a better medication IMO.

Thank you so so much for your answers

ill chime in here and just say -- i've always gone the route of tapering with a medium length agonist (OC, morphine, hydrocodone, something) because the withdrawals if you do ever want to get off methadone or subs are protracted and more difficult to deal with than a shorter acting agonist. It is more difficult to deal with a taper with multiple doses a day, all depends on how involved you want to be/how you want to do it.

no matter what though, you have to be resolved that you're dealin w stuff be ok with not being high, because you will not be high as you taper any mu agent.

Again thanks a ton! The only problem is I don't know whether it is realistically possible to get access to these substances. The only way would be through the dark web, and thus far I had no luck getting real OC.

Could you elaborate a bit on what is worse with methadone/sub withdrawals? I understand that they last for a lot longer (if I am informed correctly for months) in comparison to short acting opioids (which last weeks?), but they are also a lot milder, no?

If the meth/sub WD is a medium level of discomfort, and I can go to sleep in the night with some medicine, I think I could perhaps deal with this better, even if it lasts a lot longer, than going through a brutal WD where I am literally suffering and there is nothing to come to my avail, because then, even if it is shorter in duration, 2 weeks would be more than in enough to throw me off my plan I am afraid.

I understand completely that I am not going to be high no matter which way I choose if I am going to taper. That is ok. I just don't want to go through WD.

Thank you so much guys!!

 

[Robby D]

Hi everyone. After suffering severe stress these last days due to the constant fear that eventually the day will come when I will not be able to get my dose and I am going to suffer withdrawals (mind you I have never crossed 15 hours without heroin, and the WDs were already so bad that the thought I might go days without H makes me actually consider suicide) I decided I am going to get on methadone for maintenance (since I have been informed that methadone treatment is an option in the Netherlands where I live)

For those who are / have been on methadone I have a few questions (please answer any one of them you want, of course no need to answer all):

1) What should I expect in terms of a "high"? Obviously I am not expecting any rush, but will methadone, in the appropriate equivalent dose (I currently smoke 3g a day of unknown purity heroin, certainly less than 50% if not much much less), give the same feeling of content and safety that heroin gives me? How does methadone feel in general?

2) Do I need to go through withdrawals intentionally before starting methadone (like with suboxone)? Or can I jump straight on it?

3) Do methadone clinics in general accept someone who wants to use this as maintenance rather than someone who wants to quit? I am in phase in life of severe stress and non existent support from other humans, so right now I don't want to taper, I just want to use enough to not have WDs and just have this feeling of content H gives me. Is this generally considered acceptable with methadone treatment, or in most cases you are forced to taper down to 0mg as fast as possible?

4) Is there any reason why I should consider suboxone instead of methadone?

5) Does methadone cause any long term problems other than what heroin causes? Ideally I would stay on maintenance for the next 5 years until I can put my life in place, and then of course I want to eventually quit opiates. I have been told methadone can drop my testosterone to very low levels. Any other things I should be concerned with?

6) Am I going to suffer some WDs when I am switching from heroin to methadone, or is methadone powerful to not suffer this?

Thank you everybody for your help. If there is anything else I need to know about methadone that I did not ask about, please let me know

I have been on both medications and they are both good but methadone is a lot better in my opinion . It has a better high to it. A more of an opioid buzz a good clean high while suboxone can be a little dirty of a buzz. And yes it will take ur testosterone levels out them in a headlock then DDT them! Lol I just buy testosterone from one of those Canadian sites and replace it and it works fine! If ur doing three grams of H a day idt suboxone is an option for you! You need to go with the full agonist

 

[axe battler]

How long have you been using H @menidiatis? How many withdrawals have you been through? Or too many to count?
If you haven't been using long then it may be easier in the long run to do a sub/meth taper, where you only go on these meds for a week or 2 at ever diminishing doses whilst taking increasing amounts of comfort meds like loperamide, pregabalin and valium.
I dunno, not many people wanna stay on meth/subs forever so most will have to withdraw eventually, it's just whether you're ready to be totally sober yet.
If you're sick of getting high but don't feel ready to get off completely then methadone especially is good for that, but if you do opt for that I would go on as low a dose as possible.
Bupe won't really give you as much of an opiates feeling but if all you wanna do it be stable and slowly decrease your dose it's definitely better.

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

I am in the UK so YMMV.

1) Methadone will make you feel nice for the first few weeks/months of being on it depending on what dose you end up on. However the higher you go, the harder it will be to get off it. I know it seems like you wanna just stay on it forever, but I promise you, it will lose it's magic and just become a fucking hassle and you'll soon realise why they call it liquid handcuffs.

2) No. Although you may have to sit about on your first day of induction waiting for your first dose. They also slowly build your dose up so it may take a few days for you to be satisfied on your dose.

3) I suppose they would, but you don't necessarily have to tell them what your long term plans are.

4) I wish I wish I wish I'd stayed on subutex instead of going on methadone. Methadone does get you a little buzzed at first, but that doesn't last long. I only went on meth because bupe was making me sick. In hindsight I should have lowered my dose.

5) People complain a lot about weight gain, which I think is definitely a real problem. Being on methadone can make you lazy and sedintary. When on bupe I exercised a lot more.
People commonly complain about it fucking up their teeth. I haven't noticed this and I think it's mainly a lack of oral hygiene among severe addicts.
The testosterone thing may be real but I haven't noticed. This is also supposedly a symptom of any long term opiate use.

6) Methadone is very strong and a full opiate agonist. You may crave a more euphoric opiate, especially when first titrating, but you should be withdrawal free on about 50mg based on your 3g a day (smoked, not very good gear) habit.

It's better than being on gear. But I would go on low dose bupe or even better poppy tea and/or kratom if I could turn back time. The latter would mean no fucking around with doctors and pharmacies and a lot more freedom.

I agree with everything you say about methadone, but I wouldn't recommend poppy tea as an alternative. The dosage is far too variable and its extremely hard to get a reliable supply.

I personally would go with methadone because that's what worked for me. I don't really get the 'liquid handcuffs' metaphor because smack is just powder handcuffs innit?

 

[axe battler]

Ha yeah I suppose. It's just liquid handcuffs sounds cool as fuck don't it? Also with the methadone you have to play ball with doctors and pharmacies and fitting pick ups around work and getting piss tests and waiting around for ages when they've fucked up your script... All this shit can make you feel "imprisoned". However so can an addiction to smack, it's just different.

 

[menidiatis]

How long have you been using H @menidiatis? How many withdrawals have you been through? Or too many to count?
If you haven't been using long then it may be easier in the long run to do a sub/meth taper, where you only go on these meds for a week or 2 at ever diminishing doses whilst taking increasing amounts of comfort meds like loperamide, pregabalin and valium.
I dunno, not many people wanna stay on meth/subs forever so most will have to withdraw eventually, it's just whether you're ready to be totally sober yet.
If you're sick of getting high but don't feel ready to get off completely then methadone especially is good for that, but if you do opt for that I would go on as low a dose as possible.
Bupe won't really give you as much of an opiates feeling but if all you wanna do it be stable and slowly decrease your dose it's definitely better.

Less than a year, about 8 months I believe, I have only had WDs once, where I did not use for about 15 hours travelling from NL to GR and having to wait till the morning to score H. So I have no experienced the worst of WDs.

Thing is, I am not completely ready to be sober. I can deal with not being high, but I want to have just a little bit of opiates in my system, to give me this feeling of "safety". Smoking H to me feels like getting a hug, which is something I don't get in real life, and it makes me feel safe. So I just want to maintain this feeling, even if I have to skip on euphoria. That's why I'd rather "maintain" for now with methadone than taper and quit, even though it will be a lot easier to do it now that I have been using for little time than it will be a few years down the line.

Ha yeah I suppose. It's just liquid handcuffs sounds cool as fuck don't it? Also with the methadone you have to play ball with doctors and pharmacies and fitting pick ups around work and getting piss tests and waiting around for ages when they've fucked up your script... All this shit can make you feel "imprisoned". However so can an addiction to smack, it's just different.

By this do you mean that there is actually a chance they are going to fuck up, and I will be left without methadone to go into WDs? This actually scares the fuck out of me, the whole point for me to go on methadone is to not have to experience the immense stress that I might not be able to score dope and go through WD, if I am gonna have to worry that I can get in this position in a methadone program, then what it is the point? (other than ofc saving the 1k euros I spend a month on H, which tbh is quite a big motivator)

I mean they have to be responsible no? Can they just fuck up so easily and leave people without their script?

 

[menidiatis]

I agree with everything you say about methadone, but I wouldn't recommend poppy tea as an alternative. The dosage is far too variable and its extremely hard to get a reliable supply.

I personally would go with methadone because that's what worked for me. I don't really get the 'liquid handcuffs' metaphor because smack is just powder handcuffs innit?

H absolutely feels like handcuffs to me so I don't get the liquid handcuffs metaphor either to be honest

@F.U.B.A.R. could you actually share a little bit of your experience with methadone? how long did you stay on it? were the WDs tolerable when you decided to taper and quit? I see a lot of people describing methadone WDs as being more horrible than H...

thank you so much!

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

H absolutely feels like handcuffs to me so I don't get the liquid handcuffs metaphor either to be honest

@F.U.B.A.R. could you actually share a little bit of your experience with methadone? how long did you stay on it? were the WDs tolerable when you decided to taper and quit? I see a lot of people describing methadone WDs as being more horrible than H...

thank you so much!

@menidiatis

Yeh, so basically I was dependent on opiates for 20 years or so (and enjoyed them for another 10 years before becoming dependent).

Basically I'm a total wuss when it comes to withdrawals, so as soon as the gear became a problem, I got a methadone script. Spent years using heroin and/or methadone and getting nowhere.

Things changed during the drought of 2010 when the gear became totally shit and I wasn't willing to mutilate my rapidly failing venous system any further. The low quality smack meant that reverting to smoking wasn't viable.


The next five years were spent on a very slow methadone reduction regimen from around 100mg/day. There were hiccups along the way and my doses often fluctuated. But eventually I got down to 1mg and thought "what's the fuckin point?"

I jumped off then and it was totally painless.

Methadone is brilliant as long as you follow a few rules:


Don't use heroin as well


Reduce very slowly - once you get below 50mg/day reduce by no more than 2mg every month.


Once you get down to 10mg reduce by no more than 1mg every month.



It's a long, drawn out process but if you really want to be successful, you have to comply.


Basically, it works But you need to make an effort yourself.

 

[menidiatis]

@menidiatis

Yeh, so basically I was dependent on opiates for 20 years or so (and enjoyed them for another 10 years before becoming dependent).

Basically I'm a total wuss when it comes to withdrawals, so as soon as the gear became a problem, I got a methadone script. Spent years using heroin and/or methadone and getting nowhere.

Things changed during the drought of 2010 when the gear became totally shit and I wasn't willing to mutilate my rapidly failing venous system any further. The low quality smack meant that reverting to smoking wasn't viable.


The next five years were spent on a very slow methadone reduction regimen from around 100mg/day. There were hiccups along the way and my doses often fluctuated. But eventually I got down to 1mg and thought "what's the fuckin point?"

I jumped off then and it was totally painless.

Methadone is brilliant as long as you follow a few rules:


Don't use heroin as well


Reduce very slowly - once you get below 50mg/day reduce by no more than 2mg every month.


Once you get down to 10mg reduce by no more than 1mg every month.



It's a long, drawn out process but if you really want to be successful, you have to comply.


Basically, it works But you need to make an effort yourself.

wait, this actually sounds like exactly what I wanted to hear! I am willing to be perfectly compliant and obviously I will not use any heroin on top of the methadone.

I mean if it is actually possible to jump off painlessly what more could I ask for? For me even some discomfort is ok (where discomfort means mild depression, perhaps some insomnia, lack of motivation etc etc) as long as I don't have WDs where I can do nothing but focus on how much I suffer and pray that I had never done this to myself

My question is, considering that I have been using heroin for less than 1 year, and I have never injected, could this process perhaps work a little faster for me?

Like maybe if 50mg is already sufficient to stave of WDs, could I maybe reduce my 5mg every month? Or is that a pipe dream?

I really am willing to do anything though to jump off painlessly/ with mild discomfort, and ofc I can only hope that I will not succumb to the pressures in life that are soon coming for me and relapse with heroin.

What I am afraid is that I have to travel again back to Greece in the summer, and then I will not have access to methadone and I will have to use heroin to not get WDs, and then all is fucked and also I will be kicked out of the methadone program, that's why I was hoping if it is maybe possible, considering the fact I have not been using for so long, to accelerate this process a little bit

anyway, thank you so so much for your reply, you are really give me hope that I can get out of this, thanks a lot!!

PS: what does "hiccups" mean?

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

'Hiccups' just basically means a few fuck ups along the way. It happens.

If you've been only using for a year I reckon you could reduce a lot quicker than I did. I don't know where you live or what your drug services are like, but I was lucky enough that the UK drug service at the time allowed the 'clients' to dictate their dosage regimen.

Good luck mate, and don't give up giving up.

It really is worth it in the end...

 

[menidiatis]

'Hiccups' just basically means a few fuck ups along the way. It happens.

If you've been only using for a year I reckon you could reduce a lot quicker than I did. I don't know where you live or what your drug services are like, but I was lucky enough that the UK drug service at the time allowed the 'clients' to dictate their dosage regimen.

Good luck mate, and don't give up giving up.

It really is worth it in the end...

thank you friend, this is not the only time you bothered to help me and I am really grateful to you.

I live in NL, I don't know how the drug services work, but I will just tell them that I want to taper without suffering WDs, and I will discuss with them what you told me, perhaps they allow me to have a say in how to do this

truth is, maybe even if I quit heroin cold turkey I wouldn't even have that bad WDs, because after 15 hours of not using, I woke up having only a headache and fatigue, while I read about people being sick af after 4 hours (shitting themselves, teary eyes, runny nose, shaking, sweating buckets, none of which happened to me)

but I am a total wuss when it comes to WD, so I'd rather do a slow taper to avoid any WDs at all, so that I can focus on getting my life back in place in the meantime.

thank you so so much for your help, I really appreciate it, you gave me a lot of hope that I can actuallt get rid of this nasty habit!!

 

[axe battler]

Yeah good luck. I'm sorry if I made you worry, fuck ups at the chemist are very rare, it's just an arse ache sometimes when you go in to pick up and they tell you half an hour even though you rang ahead to make sure it's ready!! You do get the occasional moron pharmacist/assistant but it's not often.

If your withdrawal isn't bad and you don't want to go on maintenance but get off fairly painlessly then loperamide, pregabalin and benzos could be almost as good and faster than methadone you know. Food for thought anyway.

Whatever method you choose, Fubar is right, it's well worth getting off the shit!

 

[menidiatis]

Yeah good luck. I'm sorry if I made you worry, fuck ups at the chemist are very rare, it's just an arse ache sometimes when you go in to pick up and they tell you half an hour even though you rang ahead to make sure it's ready!! You do get the occasional moron pharmacist/assistant but it's not often.

If your withdrawal isn't bad and you don't want to go on maintenance but get off fairly painlessly then loperamide, pregabalin and benzos could be almost as good and faster than methadone you know. Food for thought anyway.

Whatever method you choose, Fubar is right, it's well worth getting off the shit!

oh if it is just half an hour then that should be fine hahaha

yeah, at this point I am really not sure what method I should choose, maybe indeed I can taper heroin for a couple weeks and then try to jump off with comfort meds

the one time that I did not use heroin for 15h I had taken 120mg of loperamide, and I woke up in the morning having only fatigue and a headache, but no sweating / shitting myself / pain etc, I dont know though what would have happened if I waited even more

I think I will go the methadone way, just because I will feel safe having a doctor take care of me, I have done so many things in this life alone like treating my social anxiety disorder alone with cbt and my depression alone with medicine, that for once I want to do this with the support of an expert rather than alone again with the insane stress of the uncertainty

and then if after jumping off methadone I still have severe discomfort, then I guess I ll use comfort meds for a max of 1 week, and perhaps throw some Kratom in the mix, I just dont want to do everything alone, this is so stressful

again thanks for your reply much appreciated!

 

[cdin]

wait, this actually sounds like exactly what I wanted to hear! I am willing to be perfectly compliant and obviously I will not use any heroin on top of the methadone.

I mean if it is actually possible to jump off painlessly what more could I ask for? For me even some discomfort is ok (where discomfort means mild depression, perhaps some insomnia, lack of motivation etc etc) as long as I don't have WDs where I can do nothing but focus on how much I suffer and pray that I had never done this to myself

My question is, considering that I have been using heroin for less than 1 year, and I have never injected, could this process perhaps work a little faster for me?

Like maybe if 50mg is already sufficient to stave of WDs, could I maybe reduce my 5mg every month? Or is that a pipe dream?

I really am willing to do anything though to jump off painlessly/ with mild discomfort, and ofc I can only hope that I will not succumb to the pressures in life that are soon coming for me and relapse with heroin.

What I am afraid is that I have to travel again back to Greece in the summer, and then I will not have access to methadone and I will have to use heroin to not get WDs, and then all is fucked and also I will be kicked out of the methadone program, that's why I was hoping if it is maybe possible, considering the fact I have not been using for so long, to accelerate this process a little bit

anyway, thank you so so much for your reply, you are really give me hope that I can get out of this, thanks a lot!!

PS: what does "hiccups" mean?

my personal route has always been taper/comfort meds over methadone because i have watched people do it, and it looked awful (the coming off part). But for those that DO use it succesfully, I have noticed the pattern is to use it in an EXTREMELY fast taper. 7-10 days.. maybe 14 max. doing like 10% reduction a day. I have seen several people do that to good effect, but it's hard in america to convince docs to do it. mostly they want to keep raising your methadone dose (it's a business, they know hi dose people almost never stop)

 

[menidiatis]

my personal route has always been taper/comfort meds over methadone because i have watched people do it, and it looked awful (the coming off part). But for those that DO use it succesfully, I have noticed the pattern is to use it in an EXTREMELY fast taper. 7-10 days.. maybe 14 max. doing like 10% reduction a day. I have seen several people do that to good effect, but it's hard in america to convince docs to do it. mostly they want to keep raising your methadone dose (it's a business, they know hi dose people almost never stop)

So basically the opposite from what was recommended, do a fast taper. I honestly don't know, I guess I will just follow the docs advice, although I d much rather go slow and steady, it fits more my personality

As for docs wanting to keep people on high dose, that's beyond cruel and inhumane and I can only wish for the worst to befall those bastards