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Police Brutality Thread

I just don't understand how you can be a law enforcement officer, be endowed with & authorized to use lethal force, and not realize that you have a handgun in your hand and not a piece of plastic. That's just ridiculous to me. The amount of force used to pull the trigger shouldn't even matter, you shouldn't even have your finger on the trigger if you don't know what you're shooting!

Maybe re-invest some of that $$$ to buy tanks or really butch-looking "Robocop"-style gear, and put it towards sufficient training, making sure that some of these recruits have a sufficient amount of grey matter between the ol' ears before sending them out in the streets to use lethal force, etc. :)

I know that it may make some people feel even more aggrieved and stoke the victimization-mindset among some in LEO, but guess what? The large amounts of power and authority that you're granted by society when you're in that role costs you something, and that's a high level of scrutiny and an expectation that you'll fulfill that role competently and obey the law as a public servant. I hope that the people (or their families) who get victimized by these goons in uniform start making it hurt monetarily for the municipalities, counties etc. that enable this crap, that's the only way I see this kind of thing start to get reeled in.

Also, regarding Chauvin's education etc, and the larger topic of education required for a career in law enforcement...it's admirable (to me anyway) that Chauvin followed through on what he was trying to do and finished his degree, regardless of what it was in. That's admirable regardless of who you are, and my animosity towards Chauvin has nothing to do with him being "dumb" or whatever, it has to do with him taking another person's life in a cruel and heartless way. You don't need to have a Ph.D. in the natural sciences or whatever to be a capable law enforcement officer...nor does being intelligent save you from the kind of corrupting, institutional power structures that corrupt people and make them commit savage acts of violence and inhumanity...just look at the enthusiasm among doctors, scientists and other professionals for the National Socialist movement in Germany during the 30s and 40s. I wouldn't say that being smart is necessarily the best prerequisite for the job, a baseline intelligence is necessary of course but what's more important is having a conscience and a clear understanding of what the job you've signed up for is, i.e. you're a public servant and a bureaucrat with a gun, basically, and not some Robocop commando who demands reflexively that everyone "respect my authoritah!"
 
Personally, I find the idea of using a taser to stop a fleeing suspect quite flawed to begin with. For starters, in normal circumstances a taser only has an effective range of about 10 feet (despite claims of 35 feet, various factors make that practically a significantly shorter distance). So someone running away from the person using the taser has quite a good chance of getting out of the effective range. Secondly, tasers need to penetrate clothing and contact the targets skin. That penetration is significantly reduced when the target is moving in the same direction as the taser prongs. This is why tasers are effective weapons in circumstances like where an officer is being aggressively approached by a melee armed assailant, but significantly less useful for a fleeing suspect.

So to summarize the ludicrousness of the scenario:

The officer claims to have reached for a weapon that would likely be out of range and a poor choice for the circumstances.
The officer claims to have gotten confused reaching for that wholly inappropriate weapon and instead grabbed a different weapon which is in a different location, is a different weight, is made of different materials and is a different colour.
The officer concerned is a 25 year veteran considered so competent in their job they are entrusted with the training of new officers.

If this really was an accident, the only conclusion that can seriously be reached is that the Minneapolis police department is so woefully compromised in its training that the only viable remedy is to disband the department and start again with newly hired and highly trained officers recruited from other jurisdictions. Or it wasn't an accident and the department should be placed under federal oversight.
 
Burnt Offerings said:
I just don't understand how you can be a law enforcement officer, be endowed with & authorized to use lethal force, and not realize that you have a handgun in your hand and not a piece of plastic. That's just ridiculous to me. The amount of force used to pull the trigger shouldn't even matter, you shouldn't even have your finger on the trigger if you don't know what you're shooting!

Maybe re-invest some of that $$$ to buy tanks or really butch-looking "Robocop"-style gear, and put it towards sufficient training, making sure that some of these recruits have a sufficient amount of grey matter between the ol' ears before sending them out in the streets to use lethal force, etc. :)

I know that it may make some people feel even more aggrieved and stoke the victimization-mindset among some in LEO, but guess what? The large amounts of power and authority that you're granted by society when you're in that role costs you something, and that's a high level of scrutiny and an expectation that you'll fulfill that role competently and obey the law as a public servant. I hope that the people (or their families) who get victimized by these goons in uniform start making it hurt monetarily for the municipalities, counties etc. that enable this crap, that's the only way I see this kind of thing start to get reeled in.

Also, regarding Chauvin's education etc, and the larger topic of education required for a career in law enforcement...it's admirable (to me anyway) that Chauvin followed through on what he was trying to do and finished his degree, regardless of what it was in. That's admirable regardless of who you are, and my animosity towards Chauvin has nothing to do with him being "dumb" or whatever, it has to do with him taking another person's life in a cruel and heartless way. You don't need to have a Ph.D. in the natural sciences or whatever to be a capable law enforcement officer...nor does being intelligent save you from the kind of corrupting, institutional power structures that corrupt people and make them commit savage acts of violence and inhumanity...just look at the enthusiasm among doctors, scientists and other professionals for the National Socialist movement in Germany during the 30s and 40s. I wouldn't say that being smart is necessarily the best prerequisite for the job, a baseline intelligence is necessary of course but what's more important is having a conscience and a clear understanding of what the job you've signed up for is, i.e. you're a public servant and a bureaucrat with a gun, basically, and not some Robocop commando who demands reflexively that everyone "respect my authoritah!"
Click to expand...
The Nazi/National socialist comparisons to police in the USA are laughable. If you want to see actual militarized and/or National police, go to Mexico, Italy, China, North Korea, Brasil, Argentina, Colombia, Paraguay, or any number of Central/South American countries. Or look at the former USSR, or former Soviet countries' police forces.

From what I have read and heard from the trial, Officer Chauvin was not on Fentanyl Floyd's neck, but on his shoulder, and even if he was, Chauvin weighs maybe 140lbs at the very most, while George Floyd weighed as much as two men of Chauvin's weight/height. During the time when George Floyd was bellowing he could not breathe, he could breathe and it was just histrionics and theatrics as he did before when arrested by police; but he eventually died from the drugs he took which he was addicted to.

George Floyd took enough Fentanyl/heroin/opiods to kill an elephant-and overdosed and died from this, and also was using cocaine/crack, METH, was in poor health with COVID, and even if he had been given Narcan or taken to a hospital he would have died. I have read and heard George Floyd was HIV+ and infectious, or living with AIDS and not on meds, and he fucked women without condoms in the porn videos he was in. What a nice guy. 8)

What happened to Daunte was an accident; but this guy was a violent criminal and robbed and attacked a woman he was supposedly "friends" with. Don't be surprised if he sexually assaulted or raped her as well but she did not report it.

www.dailymail.co.uk

REVEALED: Daunte Wright was charged for attempted aggravated robbery

Daunte Wright, 20, choked a woman and threatened to shoot her if she did not hand over $820 she had stuffed in her bra in 2019, court papers obtained by DailyMail.com allege.
www.dailymail.co.uk www.dailymail.co.uk

George Floyd, Daunte Wright, or Michael Brown were not good people, 'pillars of the community/family men', or 'gentle giants' or whatever the media and their families want to pretend they are to avoid the truth that they were violent criminals. If you have a warrant out for your arrest, are a violent criminal, resist arrest, try to run/drive away, or try to fight back at the police do not be surprised if you get tased or shot. What happened to Daunte was an accident but had he just pulled over, told the police officers how he was going to stop the car and get out with his hands up, and not "resisted" he would be alive and not dead.

If you want a rare example of police brutality towards a black American, look at Elijah McClain, he was black, gay, and 'on the spectrum' and somehow he got injected with Ketamine by EMTs and/or police and died from it, as well as from being in the "hogtied" position-which looks like this which cuts off breathing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bondage_positions_and_methods#/media/File:Woman-in-pony-hogtie.jpg if the person is in it too long. It is super sad what happened to him as he was not a criminal and was a good person. :(
 
Buzz Lightbeer said:
Criminal or not is totally irrelevant, a man is dead, suggestions about his background should be allowed but they're always, and really always meant disingenuously.
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It's not irrelevant but it is completely relevant. Dude, these people-George Floyd, Michael Brown, and Daunte Wright all robbed other people, and were crazy and violent sociopaths, and are not the saints or angels their families and the media claim they are.
 
PriestTheyCalledHim said:
The Nazi/National socialist comparisons to police in the USA are laughable. If you want to see actual militarized and/or National police, go to Mexico, Italy, China, North Korea, Brasil, Argentina, Colombia, Paraguay, or any number of Central/South American countries. Or look at the former USSR, or former Soviet countries' police forces.
Click to expand...

You totally missed my point. It was not about comparing American police to the Nazis, is was to illustrate how being "smart" doesn't save you from acting in a brutal or immoral way.

PriestTheyCalledHim said:
crap about Floyd's supposedly poor character
Click to expand...

Yawn
 
PriestTheyCalledHim said:
Dude, these people-George Floyd, Michael Brown, and Daunte Wright all robbed other people, and were crazy and violent sociopaths, and are not the saints or angels their families and the media claim they are.
Click to expand...
1 in 5 corporate CEO's meet the criteria for psychopathy. Should the police be given carte blanche to execute them too?

Do you even understand the basic separation of police and courts? Police are charged with apprehending law breakers. Courts are charged with determining guilt, the severity of their crime and the appropriate punishment. What you're advocating is police usurping the role of the courts.
 
PriestTheyCalledHim said:
these people-George Floyd, Michael Brown, and Daunte Wright all robbed other people, and were crazy and violent sociopaths, and are not the saints or angels their families and the media claim they are
Click to expand...

i don't see anybody claiming they were saints or angels. when you have to embellish your point like that, you just end up making other peoples' points for them.

you feel they all deserved to die? i guess you don't really understand or respect the idea of due process, enshrined in the 5th and 14th amendments to the u.s. constitution.

of maybe those should only apply to people who aren't, you know, black? i don't know - i'm just piecing it together from your comments.

alasdair
 
aemetha said:
1 in 5 corporate CEO's meet the criteria for psychopathy. Should the police be given carte blanche to execute them too?

Do you even understand the basic separation of police and courts? Police are charged with apprehending law breakers. Courts are charged with determining guilt, the severity of their crime and the appropriate punishment. What you're advocating is police usurping the role of the courts.
Click to expand...
Of course I understand the separation of a judicial system/courts, and police/law enforcement. What you and others are describing did not happen. George Floyd overdosed and died since by his own choice he took a massive amount of opiates-fentanyl as well as using other hard drugs. The others resisted arrest as they never showed up to court or a parole officer, or in the case of Michael Brown they attacked a police officer or reached for his/her weapon, or had weapons on them and are violent sociopath criminals as the four examples below are.

But let's look at the facts:
George Floyd, Daunte, Jake Blake, and Mike Brown were all violent criminals, had robbed/attacked innocent people-why don't you ask how they feel about the criminal thugs that gave them complex-PTSD? Jake Blake is a rapist.-in all cases they had warrants out for their arrest and were violent thugs, so the whole excuses of 'I dindu nothin, he was a gentle giant, or Doing (insert everyday activity here) while black' do not count.
 
PriestTheyCalledHim said:
George Floyd overdosed and died
Click to expand...

so now you know more about the death of george floyd and how he died than the county chief medical examiner who ruled his death a homicide and that the police officers' restraint of his body and compression of his neck were the primary causes?

and you know how to spell daunte wright's name better than he and his family - who gave him the name - do?

amazing.

alasdair
 
alasdairm said:
i don't see anybody claiming they were saints or angels. when you have to embellish your point like that, you just end up making other peoples' points for them.

you feel they all deserved to die? i guess you don't really understand or respect the idea of due process, enshrined in the 5th and 14th amendments to the u.s. constitution.

of maybe those should only apply to people who aren't, you know, black? i don't know - i'm just piecing it together from your comments.

alasdair
Click to expand...
Have you listened to the media, or do you get all of your 'news' from twatter?

Due process, and Constitutional amendments do not matter when violent criminals who have weapons, pull out weapons when police go to serve a warrant/arrest, attack police officers/civilians, resist arrest by running away, or in the case of Fentanyl Floyd drive intoxicated try to steal from a store, and go into canned drama and histrionics, and hostility.

More people are buying guns, even other black Americans-who by the way hate other black people who are violent criminal thugs like George Floyd, Daunte, Jake Blake, and Mike Brown all are/were-so I am surprised the people who they robbed or in the case of Jake Blake raped/sexually assaulted, did not pull out a gun and shoot them.
 
alasdairm said:
so now you know more about the death of george floyd and how he died than the county chief medical examiner who ruled his death a homicide and that the police officers' restraint of his body and compression of his neck were the primary causes?

and you know how to spell daunte wright's name better than he and his family - who gave him the name - do?

amazing.

alasdair
Click to expand...
Look at the medical/autopsy records, which have been public for awhile now. George Floyd took enough heroin/fentanyl to kill himself, which is exactly what happened.
 
i barely use twitter. but please keep assuming...

please tell us how you know more about george floyd's cause of death than the county chief medical examiner who ruled on his death?

alasdair
 
alasdairm said:
i barely use twitter. but please keep assuming...

please tell us how you know more about george floyd's cause of death than the county chief medical examiner who ruled on his death?

alasdair
Click to expand...
George Floyd's autopsy:
"It is noted that no life-threatening injuries were identified in Floyd."

"No injuries of anterior muscles of neck or laryngeal muscles"

Psychoactive substances in Floyd's blood: Fentanyl 11ng/mL, Meth 19 ng/mL, etc. etc.
 
PriestTheyCalledHim said:
George Floyd took enough heroin/fentanyl to kill himself, which is exactly what happened.
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Dear god man, are you serious? Have we seen the same video?
Let someone sit on your own neck like that and then come back retching this BS.

I despise personal attacks, but you say some really outlandish shit here.

What psychoactive substances are in your blood?
 
you're seeing a few words and selectively assuming.

the autopsy, carried out in june last year, concluded the death was a homicide and that he died of "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression."

baker's preliminary report added that death was caused by "combined effects of Mr Floyd's being restrained by police, underlying health conditions and any potential intoxicants in his system".

baker then filed an updated report two months later confirming traces of fentanyl (11 ng/mL of fentanyl in his blood) and that this was a dose that could have supported an overdose verdict had his death occurred in different circumstances.

further, an independent autopsy concluded death due to "asphyxiation from sustained pressure."

but please, continue to tell us how you know more about this than the physicians who examined george floyd's dead body...

alasdair
 
PriestTheyCalledHim said:
Officer Chauvin was not sitting on Fentanyl thug Floyd's neck, he was on Fentanyl thug Floyd's shoulder.

Hah! I have had worse done to me, not by police. I am perfectly healthy, fine, and have no issues from it.

Masochistic/slave/submissive types I know into consensual breath control, being choked, etc. have been in the position Fentanyl Floyd was in but they did not die as they were not on Fentanyl and METH, were not obese, did not have COVID, etc.

Just caffeine, in low/moderate amounts.

George Floyd got himself killed, and the world and society are better off without violent sociopath criminals like him, Mike Brown, and Daunte. George Floyd's family who and children who did not even really know him won the ghetto lottery and will waste the money incredibly fast.

So what if Officer Chavez used excessive force with George Floyd. He had a history of police misconduct. However neither Chauvin or Chavez or any of the other oficers are responsible for Floyd's death, but there were a multitude of factors contributing to Floyd's death.
  1. Floyd had a lethal dosage of Fentanyl in his system. Fentanyl restricts your ability to breath.
  2. He was also on Meth.
3.He had a heart condition.
  1. He had Covid.
  2. He had Asthma.
  3. He was morbidly obese.
  4. He was HIV+ or had AIDS and was not on medications.
Floyd was a time bomb who could have just have likely to die in the back seat of the police car, or the McDonalds drive thru for that matter. Floyd also wasn't innocent, despite what burn loot murder claims.
  1. Floyd was a career criminal. He was on Judge Judy at age 16 for assaulting a woman, stealing her car, and wrecking the car. He had been arrested 9 times in the past 23 years, and spent 8 of those years incarcerated. He robbed a pregnant woman at gun point.
  2. Floyd was a drug addict, he was arrested 3 times for cocaine possession.
  3. He was committing a felony at the time of his death.
  4. He was on Meth and Fentanyl at the time if his death. He might as well have drank bleach and drain cleaner.
  5. Because of the drugs he was on he was acting crazy. The officers repeatedly told him to keep his hands where they could see them, and to keep his hands on the steering wheel. Floyd repeatedly moved quickly, and moved his hands from the steering wheel.
  6. Floyd was hysterical, in histrionics putting on an act as usual as was shown in the other arrest video, he was screaming and crying in his car but it was all an act, much like the histrionics and crocodile tears on command by his family who he was a deadbeat to in court put on for the cameras, media, etc.
  7. The police had to pull him out of his car, because he would not exit his vehicle.
  8. Floyd's companion and drug dealers exited the vehicle, against police instruction. They weren't helping.
  9. Floyd refused to enter the Police Car.
  10. Floyd 6'6", the average American male is 5'9" Floyd weighed 260lbs Chauvin was barely 140lbs.
  11. Up to this point, the officers had been calm and respectful, they had been trying to de-escalate Floyd, but Floyd kept escalating, going crazy, in histrionics, and not following clear orders, instructions, or requests from police.
  12. This is the point that the officer goes around, opens the other door, and starts to pull Floyd into the Police car. Floyd jumps back through the car, pushes the officer to the ground, and lands on top of the officer.
  13. This is the when Officer Chavez, restrained Floyd, and Fentanyl Floyd himself asks to be put onto the ground. As I said before Chavez used excessive force, however he was fighting a violent criminal on METH and fentanyl.
Floyd was a thug, he did hard drugs which he died from, he was a violent career criminal, he attacked women, he threatened to kill a pregnant woman. He had zero respect for his own life or anyone else's, and he did not give a shit about his family or any of his five kids he neglected that he had with various hoes and baby mamas who needed it RAW and did not use condoms or other birth control, or suck cock and swallow instead of having unprotected vaginal sex.

On another website for LGB people I read, it has been discovered that George Floyd was living with AIDS or was POZ/HIV+, not on meds, and infectious. In the porn films he was in as well as with any women he unfortunately had sex with he did not use condoms and now those women got Pozzed from him.

Don't treat him as a saint, a martyr, a hero, he was a idiot and a criminal.
Click to expand...
Wow. "Fentanyl Floyd". And that's a nice patch-work of nonsense.

I'm just gonna back away, because this is like walking in on your parents fucking;
it's awkward and I want to rub my eyes with bleach.

But you soldier on with that keyboard and those convictions.
Some of us drive our own cars to work, and some of us gets a ride. I can break that down if you want me to.

xoxo
 
alasdairm said:
you're seeing a few words and selectively assuming.

the autopsy, carried out in june last year, concluded the death was a homicide and that he died of "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression."

baker's preliminary report added that death was caused by "combined effects of Mr Floyd's being restrained by police, underlying health conditions and any potential intoxicants in his system".

baker then filed an updated report two months later confirming traces of fentanyl (11 ng/mL of fentanyl in his blood) and that this was a dose that could have supported an overdose verdict had his death occurred in different circumstances.

further, an independent autopsy concluded death due to "asphyxiation from sustained pressure."

but please, continue to tell us how you know more about this than the physicians who examined george floyd's dead body...

alasdair
Click to expand...
In a city where my friend lives, a man's elbow was injured in a scuffle with the police. They took him to a hospital for treatment where eventually he suffered a fatal embolism and died. The coroner or county medical examiner ruled it a homicide despite the man's family, who were present for the scuffle, saying the police weren't responsible and didn't egregiously mishandle him,

You're out of your gourd if you think there's no pressure on coroners and/or medical examiners to rule according to what activists/politicians want, by their feelings/theory not actual facts or evidence, and as the saying goes money talks. In some states, counties, and cities there are coroners and/or medical examiners who do not even have medical degrees, have no medical education, never went to med school, etc.

Regardless if the Fentanyl is the proximate cause of death, or the METH is, the case is so muddled, there's considerable reasonable doubt. Another source of reasonable doubt: Floyd saying he couldn't breathe when he was sitting in his own car, and saying this before in the previous arrest video when he went into histrionics as usual.

NPR Cookie Consent and Choices

www.npr.org
 
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